Politics

[AJ Peacock]

I once had a dental hygienist argue that the universe was something like 6000 years old based on some biblical interpretation. The discussion began as small talk during a dental cleaning. I dropped it, no need for a dust up.

I think Hawking, mathematically back calculated a beginning point for the universe called the singularity. Einstein mathematically described the cosmic speed limit and the relationship between mass and energy. I don’t believe either could have envisioned the concept that both dark energy and dark matter would have to be used to help explain why the known universe is expanding at an increasing rate, an accelerating expansion, when logically, it should be contracting because of cumulative gravitational coalescence after the initial big bang from a singularity as described by Hawking. I finally gave up trying to fully understand the mathematical gymnastics involved in describing the concept of an Einstein-Rosen bridge. Quantum physics is “relatively” easy to understand compared to that.

“Scotty, give me warp 8… now!”

I agree, I've read 'A Brief History of Time' 2/3's of the way through 3 times! I have a degree in Applied Mathematics and can't just read it for 'fun', I need a CPU upgrade to fully understand even a text meant for laymen!

AJ

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

In just our lifetimes we have seen evolution result in new species. There is a mosquito in the London tube system that has evolved and is unique. It can breed without a blood feed, something that is common ancestor cannot do.

That occurred in less than one human lifetime.

That sounds like a biological adaptation or micro evolution. Whatever you prefer. It’s still a mosquito……….

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

No, the Church was.

Again, spend ten minutes and look it up. I’m no fan of the Catholic “church” but they were not flat earthers and that was not their beef with Galileo

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

“Particles don't just exist in one state or location; they exist in a "superposition," meaning they can be in multiple states simultaneously until they interact with their environment and "collapse" into a single outcome.”

This weird Quantum rabbit hole is aligned with almost every ancient culture. Buddhist, Native Americans, cultures that never mingled to share notes. All believe everything is the same thing.

All describe a similar plane or frequency. that everything exists and are the same thing
They use trances, meditation, using specific plants to hallucinate to get on that Frequency.

Now people using Ibogaine describe the experience as a religious experience. They have a hard time explaining exactly what happened. But describe it as going to a place where everything is on the same “frequency”.

It is interesting how intoxicants work. It’s as if they generally behave the same way regardless of the person. Ground breaking

 

[Brent in Az]

Speaking of micro/macro evolution.....

 

[Red Leg]

Yes. I take Genesis literally. There’s no room for macro evolution or millions of years in the Bible. So, macro evolution no. Micro, yes.

That is simply mind boggling to me - a form of willful ignorance. I have a Clovis point found on this property that dates from 12,000 years ago. Seriously, have you ever actually been to a natural history museum? Do you believe all those fossils of now long extinct creatures were carved out of stone in some backroom? The river bed of the San Gabriel behind our place is full of fossilized clam shells. They are no longer shells but are now limestone. Do you believe that God decided to decorate that river bed with limestone nodules made to look like shells?

I should add that none of the long passage of evolution negatively affects my belief in God. In fact, it reinforces my understanding of the vast breath and completeness of his creation.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

That is simply mind boggling to me - a form of willful ignorance. I have a Clovis point found on this property that dates from 12,000 years ago. Seriously, have you ever actually been to a natural history museum? Do you believe all those fossils of now long extinct creatures were carved out of stone in some backroom? The river bed of the San Gabriel behind our place is full of fossilized clam shells. They are no longer shells but are now limestone. Do you believe that God decided to decorate that river bed with limestone nodules made to look like shells?

That’s fine. I’d say your viewpoint is willful disregard of the truth, so that makes us even.

I’ve been to museums before. lol.. I’ve seen fossils in a creek just like you as well.

There was an earth changing cataclysmic flood over 4000 years ago that answers for a lot of things.

If you want to complete disregard the Bible, go ahead.

 

[mark-hunter]

I am following this philosophical debate with great interest.
Gents, please continue!

 

[Aaron N]

That’s fine. I’d say your viewpoint is willful disregard of the truth, so that makes us even.

I’ve been to museums before. lol.. I’ve seen fossils in a creek just like you as well.

There was an earth changing cataclysmic flood over 4000 years ago that answers for a lot of things.

If you want to complete disregard the Bible, go ahead.

Like what though? I thought two of every animal was rounded up and put on a boat? Where did the pairs of mammoth, t-Rex’s and such go after they left the ark?

We all know the only animals that didn’t make the Ark were the unicorns, as the Irish Rovers so thoroughly documented

 

[Red Leg]

That’s fine. I’d say your viewpoint is willful disregard of the truth, so that makes us even.

I’ve been to museums before. lol.. I’ve seen fossils in a creek just like you as well.

There was an earth changing cataclysmic flood over 4000 years ago that answers for a lot of things.

If you want to complete disregard the Bible, go ahead.

That is the problem with fundamentalism. It can't be debated and is immune from uncomfortable facts or research because it is anchored in a circular belief system. The response to every logical argument is the Bible says so - or perhaps more correctly, my sect's interpretation of the Bible says so.

 

[Boyd Brooks]

Like what though? I thought two of every animal was rounded up and put on a boat? Where did the pairs of mammoth, t-Rex’s and such go after they left the ark?

We all know the only animals that didn’t make the Ark were the unicorns, as the Irish Rovers so thoroughly documented

Might be a little to Canadian with that reference!

 

[Brent in Az]

There are some who believe in the young earth creation theory, that God made man and dinosaurs on the same day 6,000 - 10,000 years ago.
Yet, there are carbon dated fossil records going back many millions of years.
Pretty deep stuff, and no clear explanation in the Bible that explains those prehistoric events.

 

[Flipper Dude]

You guys do know that debating long held religious beliefs fosters animosity?

You do know that?

To what end?

Now politics, that’s a different story

I enjoy fostering that animosity.

 

[Red Leg]

Like what though? I thought two of every animal was rounded up and put on a boat? Where did the pairs of mammoth, t-Rex’s and such go after they left the ark?

We all know the only animals that didn’t make the Ark were the unicorns, as the Irish Rovers so thoroughly documented

Don't forget that amazingly fast growing olive tree.

That said, there was indeed a catastrophic event within the memory of modern man. It is prevalent in the mythology of all the major civilizations of Mesopotamia and in Eastern Asia. A number of modern scientists seem to be coalescing around the Younger Dryes event - likely an impact, which occurred approximately 12,900 years ago. In virtually all the cultural histories, it is described as a flood.

This of course did not "wipe out" all mankind but for eight people, but it does seem to have been catastrophic enough to have reset the clock on the development of human civilization. For instance, the Clovis Culture, which seems to have extended across most of North America at its height (identical highly refined stone tools), seems to have vanished completely and was gradually replaced by a host of localized hunter gatherer ones using tribal specific tool designs.

Such an event likely would have also had a very destructive effect on much of the then existing fauna (much of it mega-fauna) of that period.

 

[rookhawk]

That is simply mind boggling to me - a form of willful ignorance. I have a Clovis point found on this property that dates from 12,000 years ago. Seriously, have you ever actually been to a natural history museum? Do you believe all those fossils of now long extinct creatures were carved out of stone in some backroom? The river bed of the San Gabriel behind our place is full of fossilized clam shells. They are no longer shells but are now limestone. Do you believe that God decided to decorate that river bed with limestone nodules made to look like shells?

I should add that none of the long passage of evolution negatively affects my belief in God. In fact, it reinforces my understanding of the vast breath and completeness of his creation.

The problem with evolution is only with fundamentalists, but it actually supports intelligent design quite strongly.

The sophistication of macro evolution, including extremely vulnerable intermediate species (e.g. dinosaurs that have crappy wings for crappy flight) makes it seem very directed.

It also seems a logical way of creation for anyone that has ever written a computer program. A few MBs of compiled code can be executed, growing to gigabytes of a complex system. When you install a copy of Microsoft Office its patently obvious that it had a creator and if one line of code was wrong, you'd have nothing to show for it. Directed Evolution points to that same precision and intelligent design rather than purely natural selection.

I'd point out as well its patently obvious when you look at the skeletal structure of a Hippo, that it is related to whales. Mammals started on land, went to the sea, and Hippos being related to whales have now adapted back to being semi-terrestrial. Bone structures show this through basic observation. DNA supports it as well. How does that work if literally Sea Creatures were made on Day 5 and Land animals were made on Day 6? Does not compute.

Literalism leaves one with a conclusion that God is very deceptive, giving false apparent age of the earth, false apparent relationships among animal kinds, false transmission of DNA, a false geologic record, false radioactive decay, false fossilization, false observation of the cosmos, etc. Such deception seems more luciferian in mode than the God I read of in scriptures. The literalist has to be comfortable with God being a bullshitter where material observation cannot be "true". In this point, fundamentalism is forced to believe matter is an illusion somewhat in the style of Mary Baker Eddy.

 

[PARA45]

 

[Brent in Az]

View attachment 763560

Thanks.....now I can never unsee that.

 

[mdwest]

things are getting interesting on the gerrymandering/redistricting front..

Im incredibly surprised.. but the VA Supreme Court threw out just threw out VA's attempt redistrict and eliminate red districts with their insane map (which should have happened.. but.. Im still surprised that it did.. it was the right thing to do based on the complete bullshit used to justify the redistricting)..

and... Tennessee just re-districted yesterday.. eliminating a tradionally blue seat in Memphis..

Louisiana is definitely going to re-draw its map very soon since the USSC case was specifically about racially mandated lines drawn in LA..

Alabama and Florida will be redistricting very soon (in time to get things in place prior to the mid terms)..

Texas is currently working on a new map..

South Carolina is working on a new map (although what I am reading is they may not make it to the finish line prior to the mid terms.. )..

So youre looking at 14 new R districts in place before November.. and CA will probably bring 5 new D seats..

Thats a +9 advantage to the R's.. which isnt insignificant since there are really only about 15 "swing seats" in the house..and 9 of those seats will now be in new red districts.. so what we're really talking about is 6 potential flips to blue tops.. and the Republicans currently have a 5 seat lead..

So.. in a nutshell ALL of the remaining swing seats have to flip.. or the D's remain the minority party..

and the reality is.. with all of the new districts.. its very possible that the R lead increases in November rather than decreases..

Jefferies is definitely shitting himself right now lol..

At a minimum the DNC is about to have to completely empty its coffers and go on a massive PR campaign.. this is going to cost them a ton of money.. If theyre smart, they'll figure out some people that are more likeable and believeable to roll out in front of the American people.. Temu Obama doesnt do them any favors any time he goes on TV.. even left leaning reporters have been kicking his ass with "fact checks" every time he goes on the air lately.. Pelosi has got to be even more hated by the American people than Hillary was... AOC just comes across as a complete imbicille every time she speaks, even on the rare occasion she makes a valid point.. Omar and Talib come across as radicals.. etc..etc..

Their best hope I think would be Fetterman to take front and center to convince the country that they have actually got a plan and havent completely gone off the deep end.. but.. I think he might be more hated by his own party than Pelosi is hated by the people at large..

They are certainly not in a great place right now.. and the clock is ticking.. November is going to be here a whole lot faster than anyone thinks..

 

[Brent in Az]

Only twice since 1934 has the President's party gained seats, and held control of the house.
Maybe we are on to something good here, and a positive outcome will prevail in November.

Democrats are no doubt in full panic mode with the redistricting wins favoring the Red.

 

[Brent in Az]

U.S launches airstrikes against Iranian targets