Religions, Evolution and related Sciences

[cwpayton]

Sigh. I have no idea what you think you are trying to say.

First of all, I have questioned no one's sincerity of belief - however divergent they may be from reality. I also have been very clear in my statements that I believe in a creator and a creation event that our best evidence suggests began at least 14 billion years ago - at least for this universe and this time around. What I have questioned is the absolute nonsense that the earth was created 6 thousand years ago.

I also have no idea what you think you are proving by your creation cites. I AGREE. As I said. I believe there was a creation event by a creator. But no one you have quoted or the hundreds who have attempted to translate those cultural foundation stories had a clue of the time required or the incredible vastness of that creation. We know far more now, and none of that knowledge should conflict with a belief that intelligent design created this vast universe over those billions of years. In fact it should reinforce that belief.

And no, fossils in a riverbed are not evidence of a catastrophic event. Spend an hour on google and look into this yourself. On my property, those fossils are from an ancient seabed that existed where Texas does now during the Cretaceous period 100 million years ago. They are freed from the limestone in which they are imbedded by erosion. I should note, this is not a theory or my opinion.

Moreover, if you had paid an iota of attention to what I have written, you would know that I do believe that there is actual significant evidence of a catastrophic, planet-wide event that occurred approximately 12-14 thousand years ago - geologic and cultural. It even has a name - the Younger Dryas. What a number of scientists believe, and I think it is a reasonable belief, is the cataclysmic results were so severe that they remained in the cultural memory of numerous developing peoples to be eventually recorded in works like Sumerian epic of Ziusudra, the Mesopotamian epic of Gilgamish, the Hindu legends of Manu, and of course Genesis. All of these legends are referring to something terrible that happened in the dim past.

What I admittedly have little patience with is a self-delusional acceptance in the 21st century of an Elmer Gantry like assertion that the earth was created 6000 years ago. Interestingly, we can point to the individual who came up with this silliness and the point in history when he did it. His name was Archbishop James Usher (an Anglican no less and perish the thought for my fundamentalist friends), who died in 1656. It was he who "calculated" the date by summing genealogical timelines, or "begats," in the Book of Genesis. His pseudo analytical conclusion was that the creation was completed on the night preceding October 23, 4004 BC! If we chooses to think about it, I guess we are left with a question of whether God or the good Bishop Usher promulgated that 6000 years old assertion. My money is on the latter.

Thanks to geologic analysis beginning in the late 18th century, spurred by the burgeoning interest in science of the Enlightenment, it was quickly determined that the earth was far older. Almost as quickly most organized Christian denominations quietly dropped the clearly wrong 6,000 year claim.

I frankly could care less what an individual believes as long as it does not affect my life. Spend 20 minutes on X and you will realize people are capable of believing almost anything.

OH ok, I did pay attention , now if you will red my very lates post , and that is that.

 

[cash_tx]

I suppose you could discount belief in the entire old testament and still be a born again believer as in john 3-3. for Christ said who ever believes in the son has eternal life , john3-35. But and I mean but, Christ quoted from Genesis more than any other and Im not smart enough to explain to God why I didnt believe it, I will leave that to the educated ones, pleading ignorance should be as profound as pleading superiority of scientic knowledge based on carbon 14 and atheist fools. Pure religion is of the heart not the mind I hope we can agree on that.

I for one can absolutely agree with you that a decision to believe in Christianity (or for that matter, Judaism, Islam, HInduism, Buddhism, etc.) is a decision of faith; you will not reach a definitive conclusion for any of the above using an honest application of scientific methodology on the currently available archeological or historical data. Ironic as it may sound, this was actually one of the oft-overlooked key points made by atheistic debaters such as Hitchens, Hawkins, and Harris during the "four horsemen" new atheist movement of the mid-to-late 2000's. They didn't aspire to restrict people from making a declaration of faith of their own free will; they just wanted them to be intellectually honest with themselves that it was a decision of faith, not "fact". Personally, I think this is why it is often referrred to as "the gift of faith" (and some people might use the phrase "drawn by the Holy Spirit").

 

[Red Leg]

I suppose you could discount belief in the entire old testament and still be a born again believer as in john 3-3. for Christ said who ever believes in the son has eternal life , john3-35. But and I mean but, Christ quoted from Genesis more than any other and Im not smart enough to explain to God why I didnt believe it, I will leave that to the educated ones, pleading ignorance should be as profound as pleading superiority of scientic knowledge based on carbon 14 and atheist fools. Pure religion is of the heart not the mind I hope we can agree on that.

What absolutely frustrates me is the perception that religion, absolute belief in a creator, somehow can not also be of the mind and the intellect as well as the heart.

 

[Ridge Runner]

From Grok AI, Common Misconceptions about Rank in the medical corps​

• "Medics outrank everyone in emergencies": This is a persistent myth or exaggeration, often from fiction (e.g., Star Trek's CMO or wartime stories). In reality, it's limited to medical scenarios to ensure proper care—similar to how a safety officer has authority in their domain. It doesn't mean a private-level medic commands generals outside that.
• Geneva Conventions: These protect medical personnel as non-combatants (they must be respected and not targeted), but they do not alter internal US rank structures or give them superiority.

• Studies on rank in care: Recent data even shows higher-ranking patients sometimes receive preferential treatment in military facilities, underscoring that rank still matters.

This is so true. And why officers and enlisted are, unless necessity dictates, have separate wards.

Kind of funny

 

[Ridge Runner]

This is definitely some of the wildest nonsense I’ve heard all month.

LMAO.....This isn't the wildest nonsense.

It's the unit(s) one serves in.

You just had to have been there. Even then witnessing what you were hearing and seeing you wouldn't conceivably believe what just happened.

Here's a question for you Army types:

What Company Commander slot is the worst-case scenario in an Army Corps?

May also be the 2nd worst-case scenario Army level would be worst-case.

Hint:
What Company Commander, captain slot/ rank, is in charge of a Corps Commander, 3 star general, and below?

Possibly Army Commander 4 star general and below.

Please posts your answers and comments in the OP: Whose In Charge.

 

[Ray B]

Whose In Charge.

Very interesting and reminiscent of Bud Abbott & Lou Costello,

Whose in charge is a statement noting someone name Whose is in Charge.

Who's in charge is a question asking Who is in Charge.

Whose on First....

 

[Certus]

Perhaps... but not nearly as insensitive as a buddy of mine's barn cats..

theyre both black cats (one completely black.. the other predominantly black but with some small white patches)..

he caught them fighting in the barn a few years back.. and promptly re-named them

Blackie Chan and Bruce Leroy..

theyve kept those names ever since..

Cousin has Meowsolini and Chairman Meow. Love those names lol.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

It actually doesn't matter what their rank is.

Same as Doctors. I was at Landstuhl military hospital a couple of times this week, and I rarely saw a doctor, nurse or anyone else in uniform actually in uniform. They were all wearing scrubs. Their rank was MD, or RN not Major, or LCDR, or LT, or Captain or whatever. Enlisted folks all had some kind of rank on their scrubs. Very few officers had their ranks on.

MP's were trending for a while that their rank didn't mean anything, but there are enough of them that are dickheads with a gun, I don't think they will go to a non-rank model for Military police.

As a military policeman on countless occasions I had to remind officers causing problems (usually drunk) they should not confuse their rank with my authority ... including one general in Korea. Actually, I'm surprised it was only one general who had to be warned. However, my authority did not excuse me from respecting their rank. Big difference. NCOs in special forces and marines seemed particularly prone to forgetting the difference between rank and military police authority. Much to my delight the debate always ended badly for those fatheads.

 

[Ray B]

fatheads.

Better a fathead than a dickhead

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Better a fathead than a dickhead

One = the other.

 

[Ray B]

Many would appreciate a reduced showing of ignorance.

 

[Red Leg]

Our group expert on military policing. He served a single enlistment as a junior enlisted man (or perhaps that story has evolved as well) and was dressing down generals and SOF personnel.

 

[mdwest]

Better a fathead than a dickhead

I was going to say liar…

But I suppose dickhead is more polite…

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Our group expert on military policing. He served a single enlistment as a junior enlisted man (or perhaps that story has evolved as well) and was dressing down generals and SOF personnel.

Yep. And if needed it was more than just dressing them down, and on more than one occasion. Gotta do my job. And only just one general whose misbehavior proceeded to end his career. I don't know, but I suspect it wasn't his first offense. No field grade officer is going to use his rank to "order" his way out of a driving under the influence charge or spending the night in the tank for beating up his wife. Not on my watch anyway. Another reason I declined West Point. Seemed to me the cream didn't float to the top in the Army. More like the stuff that floats to the top of the toilet bowl. I did my time and got out without shooting anyone ... who was my superior. But it was a close run thing.

I didn't go looking for trouble. It became clear to me very early on police was also not the career for me. I did what I had to do and that's all. Volunteering MP to Korea essentially guaranteed I wouldn't go to Nam. Dad worked at the hydro dam. We didn't have the money to pay a friendly doctor to write me a phony 4F letter for bone spurs. Fortunately, I could type 80 wpm (typewriter) and had something more than air floating between my ears. Eventually I was elevated during my last nine months stateside to shift desk sergeant ... as an E-4. Hung up my night stick and took up creative writing.

 

[Ray B]

took up creative writing.

Appears even compulsive liars say the truth on rare occasion. I'm impressed!!

 

[Datchew]

In an attempt to keep this on the rails (I really am enjoying the religious and evolution discussions and I kinda feel like the alien angle is waning too much) I will recommend one of my favorite books that I think several of you may appreciate.

The devil's delusion by David Berkinski

It's fantastic. He's a secular Jew and is as witty as Chesterton (and just between us... That's saying something.)

 

[rookhawk]

On the aliens / UAP topics, a few things have been on my mind lately.

1.) I saw articles this week talking about a potential trans medium craft that was built by Lockheed’s skunkworks beginning in the early 2000s. I haven’t dug deep to see if this is even remotely plausible, but the article I read stated it was tick-tack shape and could assign terrestrial causes to all the Navy pilot reports of tick tacks showing up off the coast of San Diego beginning in the mid-2000s. Feel free to do your own research and provide comments.

2.) The alien psyop thing has always interested me. It’s part of UFO folklore that aliens enjoy flying over nuke launch sites and disabling nukes. The little green guys seem to be very into the green peace movement over the years. At any rate, a number of articles have come out, some from former military, stating that they were doing an EMP test on the surface of our minuteman silos to see if they could disable our nukes temporarily. The allegation goes that they DID have a successful test, but didn’t want to divulge the sensitivity or susceptibility of our silos to the Russians during the Cold War. The spooks allowed an explanation of UFOs disabling the nukes to perpetuate rather than admit a device they deployed on the surface determined the silos could be compromised. There is a lot of literature available on this particular event, some more or less credible than the others but its worth poking around.

3.) For decades the UFO community was claiming that NASA knew about UFOs since the earliest era of the space program, but no astronauts would verify any of these claims. In the Dept of War’s info release last week there were several anomalies reported beginning with a Gemini mission and specifically events that occurred on Apollo 12 and 17. Some of the pictures and reports seem like they could be explained by ice or debris from the rockets, but in one of the audio recordings the crew were describing debris AND a bogey. Interesting viewing.

4.) For years there has been debate about the testimony of Bob Lazar, a guy that claimed he worked on reverse engineering of UFOs at Area 51’s S4 site in Nevada. His story has a few holes in it, but he has been fairly consistent in his descriptions since 1989. One of the most remarkable corroborations just came out a couple months ago: For years he described camouflaged hanger doors at S4 including that some of the bay doors were double sized, others single bays and in a particular order. A private pilot with a long range telephoto lens did take aerial photos of the area and indeed, they do show what appear to be hanger doors of the exact size, description, and location as Bob Lazar described years ago. The US Gov’t has stated Bob never worked at Groom Lake but this info seems too remarkable to be a coincidence. It was covered in a documentary that came out 3 weeks ago called Bob Lazar S4, I believe.

Happy researching. I look forward to any comments on these topics.

 

[skydiver386]

As a military policeman on countless occasions I had to remind officers causing problems (usually drunk) they should not confuse their rank with my authority ... including one general in Korea. Actually, I'm surprised it was only one general who had to be warned. However, my authority did not excuse me from respecting their rank. Big difference. NCOs in special forces and marines seemed particularly prone to forgetting the difference between rank and military police authority. Much to my delight the debate always ended badly for those fatheads.

The only "fatheads" I ever encountered had a badge, gun and E-4 rank.

 

[skydiver386]

Personally the possible existence of other life forms in distant galaxies would have no bearing on my faith.

Why would it?

As to the UFO phenomenon, much can be explained by basic logic. We know when Viktor Belenko defected and flew his MIG-25 to Hokodate Japan, there was a huge cover-up. We knew we had it, the Japanese knew we had it, and the Soviet's knew we had it. The public didn't know we had it, and a cover story was crafted to explain things.

Within weeks, every Jackwagon conspiracy theorist was spreading rumors of an Alien craft that crashed, how the bodies had been secretly transported to Wright Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio, and autopsies were being performed.

Notice the phone in the wall? Guess that'll come in handy for calling Jesse Ventura with the autopsy results.

See some Military vehicles on railcars? OMG, it's the start of the WAR OF THE WORLD'S! Why else would they move that many tanks at one time? Now me, I see this and mumble "Yep, 2AD is headed to NTC for another rotation, suckers".

I just sit back and chuckle when I hear these conspiracy theories. It's like a Beavis and Butthead Moronathon.

 

[VertigoBE]

On the aliens / UAP topics, a few things have been on my mind lately.

1.) I saw articles this week talking about a potential trans medium craft that was built by Lockheed’s skunkworks beginning in the early 2000s. I haven’t dug deep to see if this is even remotely plausible, but the article I read stated it was tick-tack shape and could assign terrestrial causes to all the Navy pilot reports of tick tacks showing up off the coast of San Diego beginning in the mid-2000s. Feel free to do your own research and provide comments.

2.) The alien psyop thing has always interested me. It’s part of UFO folklore that aliens enjoy flying over nuke launch sites and disabling nukes. The little green guys seem to be very into the green peace movement over the years. At any rate, a number of articles have come out, some from former military, stating that they were doing an EMP test on the surface of our minuteman silos to see if they could disable our nukes temporarily. The allegation goes that they DID have a successful test, but didn’t want to divulge the sensitivity or susceptibility of our silos to the Russians during the Cold War. The spooks allowed an explanation of UFOs disabling the nukes to perpetuate rather than admit a device they deployed on the surface determined the silos could be compromised. There is a lot of literature available on this particular event, some more or less credible than the others but its worth poking around.

3.) For decades the UFO community was claiming that NASA knew about UFOs since the earliest era of the space program, but no astronauts would verify any of these claims. In the Dept of War’s info release last week there were several anomalies reported beginning with a Gemini mission and specifically events that occurred on Apollo 12 and 17. Some of the pictures and reports seem like they could be explained by ice or debris from the rockets, but in one of the audio recordings the crew were describing debris AND a bogey. Interesting viewing.

4.) For years there has been debate about the testimony of Bob Lazar, a guy that claimed he worked on reverse engineering of UFOs at Area 51’s S4 site in Nevada. His story has a few holes in it, but he has been fairly consistent in his descriptions since 1989. One of the most remarkable corroborations just came out a couple months ago: For years he described camouflaged hanger doors at S4 including that some of the bay doors were double sized, others single bays and in a particular order. A private pilot with a long range telephoto lens did take aerial photos of the area and indeed, they do show what appear to be hanger doors of the exact size, description, and location as Bob Lazar described years ago. The US Gov’t has stated Bob never worked at Groom Lake but this info seems too remarkable to be a coincidence. It was covered in a documentary that came out 3 weeks ago called Bob Lazar S4, I believe.

Happy researching. I look forward to any comments on these topics.

A few things are certain:
- If one believes in the size of the universe. and the probilistic nature of life occuring, it is impossible to deny the existence of extra terrestrial life somewhere.
- Due to the media, government, society, anyone who dares to research this, PHD or not, will be ridiculed and treated as a kook.
- If there would be extra terrestrial life visiting/present on earth in one form or other, there would be many vested interests to keep this hidden away from the general public.
- No absolutely conclusive proof has been provided so far.
- Even if absolutely conclusive proof would exist and be provided, due to AI these days, most people would still not be able to believe the proof.