Politics

[Nature Boy]

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt." Unknown

The value of these past pages to some of us, is reading the responses from those that @Randy F and @Red Leg referenced; the vast and varied expertise of members here, and their willingness to share that expertise and experience. I, for one, greatly appreciate your efforts, even when it is obvious that effort is put forth from the irritation of seeing ignorance and falsehoods being promulgated as fact. Please continue that fight, it is beneficial to a lot of us.

You mean like the Euros and the USA buying Russian energy? lol, keep up the mob attacks. I'm tougher than all of you combined.

 

[Nature Boy]

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt." Unknown

The value of these past pages to some of us, is reading the responses from those that @Randy F and @Red Leg referenced; the vast and varied expertise of members here, and their willingness to share that expertise and experience. I, for one, greatly appreciate your efforts, even when it is obvious that effort is put forth from the irritation of seeing ignorance and falsehoods being promulgated as fact. Please continue that fight, it is beneficial to a lot of us.

The post fits you perfectly BTW

 

[Nature Boy]

It would be great to pull out our manufacturing from China but the US government doesn’t have the power to mandate such a thing and shouldn’t have that kind of power over businesses.

I do find it disturbing and ironic that several NATO countries were or are getting their energy from Russia. Trump had that right. However, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t stop Russia from reassembling the Soviet Bloc.

They financed Putin. But he is a big threat and is re-forming the Soviet Union. lmao. If that threat was so dire then the BORDERING NATO "allies" (who won't even fiollow the treaty) can march in and stop him. Or is that only for the USA? I'm confused.

 

[Scott CWO]

They financed Putin. But he is a big threat and is re-forming the Soviet Union. lmao. If that threat was so dire then the BORDERING NATO "allies" (who won't even fiollow the treaty) can march in and stop him. Or is that only for the USA? I'm confused.

Exactly. The NATO countries in Europe should do more so when they don’t, we step up. Russia is a threat and we have decided to help Ukraine now instead of dealing with a bigger Russia problem later. Just because other countries are too weak or unwilling doesn’t mean it’s not necessary or makes the problem go away. That is likely where we disagree. You are entitled to your opinion and I have not ignored you.

 

[Nature Boy]

Exactly. The NATO countries in Europe should do more so when they don’t, we step up. Russia is a threat and we have decided to help Ukraine now instead of dealing with a bigger Russia problem later. Just because other countries are too weak or unwilling doesn’t mean it’s not necessary or make the problem go away. That is likely where we disagree. You are entitled to your opinion and I have not ignored you.

Well, since countries that border Russia won't do enough or much at all I don't believe they think it is a huge threat. Russia is not invading NATO ever imo. But our MI complex sure does and they sure did in Aghan too. hmmm....

And if I was the President and our NATO "allies" wouldn't do anything in their own backyards then I would be home securing our border, building new airports and roads, creating good jobs, etc.

I appreciate you not going into personal attacks as the others have. That's what it is all about, good discourse. In the USA, the 1st Amendment is "1st" for a reason. It's not to protect popular speech, it's to protect unpopular speech. What media has done to that is insidious imo.

 

[Scott CWO]

I know that but NAFTA caused a huge loss of US jobs as did going to china. They made more profits so if you are a shareholder of say Apple (who refused to criticize chy-na when they have 2M in camps and disappear people like Jack Ma among other things yet freely criticize the USA all the time) then you did ok I guess. The fact is they are pulling it back and away from chy-na who forces you to share tech and steals whatever you do not share. There is, to this day, the stupid agreement we have to share tech and education with china, beyond belief stupid. China owns Smithfield, our largest pork and poultry producer. Thjey just shuttered one of the larger plants. Thy have purchased more US land than anyone in recent years (what kind of stupid country sells their land to their arch enemy?).

There were 370,000 chinese nationals in our Universities as of 2019/2020. Read the Book "The 100 Year marathon" by Mike Pillsbury, will open your eyes to the real enemy.

I already understand the Chinese threat and mostly agree on that subject so you can stop beating a dead horse.

 

[WAB]

Ok, so what? The point was we were buying it from RUSSIA, along with a lot of oil and nothing from Ukraine. So why are we buying things from russia (our big bad threat per all here??????). We get nothing of any importance from Ukraine. But please do explain why Russia is a big threat to te USA? I would love to hear it from experts like you? I don't care what job yu had braggart.

So what??? That is your response to my pointing out that you stated a complete falsehood as a fact??? I think that you have clearly established the level of credibility we can give your statements.

Oh, and I wasn’t stating my background to brag, merely to establish that I know a fair bit more about a specific subject than the talking heads you get your facts from.

Wow, just wow.

 

[Scott CWO]

Well, since countries that border Russia won't do enough or much at all I don't believe they think it is a huge threat. Russia is not invading NATO ever imo. But our MI complex sure does and they sure did in Aghan too. hmmm....

And if I was the President and our NATO "allies" wouldn't do anything in their own backyards then I would be home securing our border, building new airports and roads, creating good jobs, etc.

I appreciate you not going into personal attacks as the others have. That's what it is all about, good discourse. In the USA, the 1st Amendment is "1st" for a reason. It's not to protect popular speech, it's to protect unpopular speech. What media has done to that is insidious imo.

Because some bordering countries didn’t do enough does not remove the fact that an expansionist Russia is a threat in the future, as @Opposite Pole says.

Most members here agree with you on the border, manufacturing things here and infrastructure. I offer that your posts are all over the place and you try to link things together too much. Maybe think about that and take a breath before posting. Not trying to berate you. Your arguments spiral out into several complex subjects at once. Go one by one at a time?

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Eesh winter must’ve come in like a lion up north.

 

[Woodcarver]

The post fits you perfectly BTW

Why, thank you! I strive for understanding and accuracy when I write. Thank you for noticing!

 

[Scott CWO]

You mean like the Euros and the USA buying Russian energy? lol, keep up the mob attacks. I'm tougher than all of you combined.

Would you prefer the US government to be so powerful that it would always mandate where US businesses can buy goods and services, even when not at war or in a proxy war? The US government has now put sanctions on Russia and this prevents most transactions until sanctions are lifted.

In many of your posts, you combine ideas about trade and geopolitics as if governments are all-powerful and should stop all trade with adversaries. Yes, it’s ironic that we have bought oil and other products from countries like Russia and China. They also buy from us. I also don’t like the mandated sharing of technology that China requires of US based companies. These companies have chosen to go forward anyway. Legally, the US government cannot stop this.

 

[Newboomer]

Why, thank you! I strive for understanding and accuracy when I write. Thank you for noticing!

My Dad had a great saying about people like nature boy. "They open their mouth and their guts fall out. Guts are usually full of shit."

 

[Woodcarver]

My Dad had a great saying about people like nature boy. "They open their mouth and their guts fall out. Guts are usually full of shit."

But I would agree they have the right to do so. Like an oyster, every now and again you find a gem. I'm still looking.....

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Would you prefer the US government to be so powerful that it would always mandate where US businesses can buy goods and services, even when not at war or in a proxy war? The US government has now put sanctions on Russia and this prevents most transactions until sanctions are lifted.

In many of your posts, you combine ideas about trade and geopolitics as if governments are all-powerful and should stop all trade with adversaries. Yes, it’s ironic that we have bought oil and other products from countries like Russia and China. They also buy from us. I also don’t like the mandated sharing of technology that China requires of US based companies. These companies have chosen to go forward anyway. Legally, the US government cannot stop this.

The U.S. can I believe do what it wants legally and arguably should. There was a thought process that integrating China more into the mainstream of the world would be a good thing. That seems to have proven wrong, and has had quite the opposite effect. And now that pendulum seems to have swung the other way.

The Evolution of U.S. Thinking and Policy - U.S.-China Technological “Decoupling”: A Strategy and Policy Framework

Washington has rapidly converged on a new, China-focused techno-nationalism. A diverse and growing U.S. restrictive tool kit has targeted Chinese tech with increasing intensity.

carnegieendowment.org

 

[Scott CWO]

Perhaps but it would have been very hard to isolate China like North Korea. We seem to think we can just snap our fingers and rule the whole world. We cannot but we like to think we can.

 

[John Wasmuth]

And as the protests, which are illegal in China, ramp up we’ll see more and more people get “disappeared “ over the coming days,,,,,,, and of course there is not a thing anyone can do, not being able to fight back and all that…..

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Perhaps but it would have been very hard to isolate China like North Korea. We seem to think we can just snap our fingers and rule the whole world. We cannot but we like to think we can.

Can’t disagree with you there. I think that is due to China to at least some level adopting capitalism as part of its economic system. North Korea has never done that and in reality isolated itself. We’ve allowed ourselves to be invaded by China. They chose to invade through the west coast shipping harbors bringing their cheaply made goods to the U.S. which we have happily bought. A modern Trojan Horse.

The one mistake I think Xi Jinping is currently making is consolidating power that much more unto himself. The more he does this, the more like NK he makes China.

 

[Ray B]

War hawks talk tough when the bullets aren't aimed at them. Hunter Biden and burisma is documented. The grift is in, like always. How'd that history work in Vietnam??? "stop the commies". It is now a tourist destination and new manufacturing base.

I infer from your comments that you consider military actions in Vietnam to have ended badly. But then you note that Vietnam has valued assets. If you look at the intent of US involvement in Vietnam you may see that the end result is what the US desired- so the US actually won from its involvement. Too bad you believe the teaching of some biased-for-communism professors and their lackey media.

 

[Nature Boy]

So what??? That is your response to my pointing out that you stated a complete falsehood as a fact??? I think that you have clearly established the level of credibility we can give your statements.

Oh, and I wasn’t stating my background to brag, merely to establish that I know a fair bit more about a specific subject than the talking heads you get your facts from.

Wow, just wow.

So what??? That is your response to my pointing out that you stated a complete falsehood as a fact??? I think that you have clearly established the level of credibility we can give your statements.

Oh, and I wasn’t stating my background to brag, merely to establish that I know a fair bit more about a specific subject than the talking heads you get your facts from.

Wow, just wow.

Folks like to try to take one little item and use it to discredit the rest. A billion dollars of fertilizer is still a lot and the point was we were buying it from Russia. Keep trying to justify it, fine by me.

 

[Nature Boy]

Because some bordering countries didn’t do enough does not remove the fact that an expansionist Russia is a threat in the future, as @Opposite Pole says.

Most members here agree with you on the border, manufacturing things here and infrastructure. I offer that your posts are all over the place and you try to link things together too much. Maybe think about that and take a breath before posting. Not trying to berate you. Your arguments spiral out into several complex subjects at once. Go one by one at a time?

The point was America first for a change and imo that is not the deal. It is money for certain folks over the American people. Like the burisma deal and a lot of other deals. Just my opinion.