Trick Question For You Guys & Gals

[Obi Wan Kenobi]

Thank you all for answering this question if you have some experience. I know this has probably been asked a million times.

If you were to book an African safari with 1 rifle, a 300 win mag. It was a combo plains game hunt for various things. Zebra, Kudu ect ect. But the main trophies on the hunt are hyena & leopard. I've been told 180 grain Barnes TTSX BT bullets in 300 win mag will be fine for any of the plains game but may be dicey on a leopard at 45 yards. My PH says we will shoot no more than 45 yards at a cat with his set ups. My 300 absolutely love these rounds.

Will it really matter if I zero the rifle at 50 yards after he starts hitting the bait & place the bullet in shoulder 1/3 the way up?

Am I over thinking this? WWYD?

 

[Wyatt Smith]

zeroed at such a short distance, your bullet will never be any further away from the point of aim, than the distance from the center of the scope than the center of the bore.
This is of course provided the shots are less than the distance zeroed. You will likely be high at 100 yards.

 

[sgt_zim]

You're overthinking. If the best you can manage is 0.5 MOA, 50, 100, and 200 yard zeroes will all produce roughly the same result at 40 yards. Your target is a little smaller than your fist. +/- 1" either way is still in the target.

Zeroed at 100 yards, assuming 2900 fps.

Zeroed at 50 yards, same mv

Either way, at 40 yards, you're going to be around a quarter inch low.

Zeroed at 200 yards, looks like you'll be a whopping quarter inch high, maybe a little more. Not enough to make a difference.

 

[Flewis]

zeroed at such a short distance, your bullet will never be any further away from the point of aim, than the distance from the center of the scope than the center of the bore.
This is of course provided the shots are less than the distance zeroed. You will likely be high at 100 yards.

Yes it will, probably about 1:5 to 2 inches at100 or on at 200 or so.

 

[AimSmall]

TTSX has a reputation for being too 'tough' of a bullet for the cats. Most PH's would recommend a softer, 'cup-and-core' like Remington Corelok, Hornady ELDX, or other soft points.

Test fire your rifle to see POI at each yardage you might be shooting (long before you leave town).

Have fun, best of luck!

 

[Daisy]

Thank you all for answering this question if you have some experience. I know this has probably been asked a million times.

If you were to book an African safari with 1 rifle, a 300 win mag. It was a combo plains game hunt for various things. Zebra, Kudu ect ect. But the main trophies on the hunt are hyena & leopard. I've been told 180 grain Barnes TTSX BT bullets in 300 win mag will be fine for any of the plains game but may be dicey on a leopard at 45 yards. My PH says we will shoot no more than 45 yards at a cat with his set ups. My 300 absolutely love these rounds.

Will it really matter if I zero the rifle at 50 yards after he starts hitting the bait & place the bullet in shoulder 1/3 the way up?

Am I over thinking this? WWYD?

Yep. Drastically overthinking it. Ha. Zero at 100 and have fun.

 

[sestoppelman]

TTSX has a reputation for being too 'tough' of a bullet for the cats. Most PH's would recommend a softer, 'cup-and-core' like Remington Corelok, Hornady ELDX, or other soft points.

Test fire your rifle to see POI at each yardage you might be shooting (long before you leave town).

Have fun, best of luck!

Maybe the smaller cats. I sure would feel good with one hunting lion though.

 

[375Fox]

If you didn’t have the internet all you could do is ask your PH on the bullet and trust his opinion. It’s easy to overthink with too much information. Ask your PH’s opinion and stick with that. That 180 gr TTSX from a 300 will likely perform better than many 300 gr bullets from a 375 H&H that have been used on leopards.

 

[TOBY458]

Judging from the results I've had from TTSX on deer sized game, I would think it would do fine on Leopard. The relatively high velocity that the 300 WM will produce should give plenty of hydrostatic shock.

 

[Tra3]

A 100 yard zero will also be at zero at around 70 yards in a .300 WM with a 180 gr bullet (and less than 1/4” off at 50).
If you are used to a 100 yrd zero, my vote is to keep it there.

+1 for the advice to ask your PH about which bullet. When I doubt, bring the max amount of ammo! Actually, I always bring the max amount of ammo.

 

[375er]

Is the question about sight-in or the bullet itself?

 

[Obi Wan Kenobi]

TTSX has a reputation for being too 'tough' of a bullet for the cats. Most PH's would recommend a softer, 'cup-and-core' like Remington Corelok, Hornady ELDX, or other soft points.

Test fire your rifle to see POI at each yardage you might be shooting (long before you leave town).

Have fun, best of luck!

This is what I was referring to I appreciate everyone's response.

Should I even use this bullet at all? What's a great bullet for leopard and plains game. I'm not so much worried about the zero I was just wondering what's the best all around bullet for plains game and cats

 

[Daisy]

This is what I was referring to I appreciate everyone's response.

Should I even use this bullet at all? What's a great bullet for leopard and plains game. I'm not so much worried about the zero I was just wondering what's the best all around bullet for plains game and cats

Coming from a guy that has never killed a leopard….

I just don’t understand the “too tough a bullet.” What does that even mean? Sounds like people that want to hold on to something? Or want to justify the bullet they used for theirs?

I don’t think someone having killed 2 leopard makes them an expert on what bullet best kills leopard. It’s so cool to read their stories. Hear about their experience. But in my book it has zero relevance to what is best bullet for a leopard.

Look at data on bullets. Which ones have high quality R and D. Which ones have great quality control. Which ones expand rapidly at high speeds. Which ones cause the absolute most tissue damage (unless you plan on eating cat).

I’ve seen threads of people saying on one hand a leopard will kill you. Then in same thread saying a projectile is too powerful and will cause pelt damage.

I see people say A frame is the perfect bullet for Cape buffalo. Then say it’s great for all plains game and leopard. Then say other bullets are “too tough” for cats.

When the A frame came out it was a great step forward in a reliable bonded lead bullet. That was 30 years ago. Copper monolithic bullets are as good in every way, and better in a lot of ways. They have much better tolerances due to how they are manufactured. They have extensive testing in their design for better BC, better weight retention, better expansion at high and low velocities.

I also think a single PH is a really good data point. But just one point. If they killed their first leopard with an A frame, stuck with it for 30 years, they are gonna say it’s the best bullet for leopard. Does that mean it is? What about the ones that didn’t go down immediately? All bad shots? I guess my thought is a musket would take down a leopard with a perfect shot. Wouldn’t the best bullet be the one most forgiving with a bad shot? Produce most collateral damage with radiating petals? Most penetration with an odd angle shot? Again, I’ll read about how they will kill you, then folks will tell people not to take a 300wm and only take your 30/06. Makes zero sense to me.

So, when I kill my first huge cat (I’ve taken a bobcat) I will not listen to someone that has killed one cat and say “he has the perfect bullet figured out.” I would her on sniperhide or rockslide and talk to guys that put thousands of rounds a year through a barrel and what they think the best bullet is. I would talk to r and d guys that have taken tax and raptors and hammers to Africa and harvested 100 animals at a time to field test the bullets on line game after many years in the lab.

But hey. That’s just me.

 

[Fatback]

180 Nosler Partitions would fit the bill nicely for PG and a leopard. Rapid expansion and hydrostatic shock are important on a leopard and the NP provides just that as long as they shoot accurately in your rifle. Proper shot placement is always important but especially so with leopards. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[Tally-Ho HUNTING SAFARIS]

so heres an idea, probably get a lot of flack but im pretty sure i will be right

sight your rifle in at 100, or 200 your preference on your favoured ammo, barnes 180gr(my favoured bullet too) test a 180gr soft point at 50 yds , i will put a lot of money on it not being off enough to worry about, maybe a 1/4 to 1/2 inch max
both jobs done

the issue with barnes on soft animals, such as cats, they basically act like a solid and dont do enough damage. i have had this experience myself, they all died, just not as quickly as with a soft point.

regards

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Coming from a guy that has never killed a leopard….

I just don’t understand the “too tough a bullet.” What does that even mean? Sounds like people that want to hold on to something? Or want to justify the bullet they used for theirs?

I don’t think someone having killed 2 leopard makes them an expert on what bullet best kills leopard. It’s so cool to read their stories. Hear about their experience. But in my book it has zero relevance to what is best bullet for a leopard.

Look at data on bullets. Which ones have high quality R and D. Which ones have great quality control. Which ones expand rapidly at high speeds. Which ones cause the absolute most tissue damage (unless you plan on eating cat).

I’ve seen threads of people saying on one hand a leopard will kill you. Then in same thread saying a projectile is too powerful and will cause pelt damage.

I see people say A frame is the perfect bullet for Cape buffalo. Then say it’s great for all plains game and leopard. Then say other bullets are “too tough” for cats.

When the A frame came out it was a great step forward in a reliable bonded lead bullet. That was 30 years ago. Copper monolithic bullets are as good in every way, and better in a lot of ways. They have much better tolerances due to how they are manufactured. They have extensive testing in their design for better BC, better weight retention, better expansion at high and low velocities.

I also think a single PH is a really good data point. But just one point. If they killed their first leopard with an A frame, stuck with it for 30 years, they are gonna say it’s the best bullet for leopard. Does that mean it is? What about the ones that didn’t go down immediately? All bad shots? I guess my thought is a musket would take down a leopard with a perfect shot. Wouldn’t the best bullet be the one most forgiving with a bad shot? Produce most collateral damage with radiating petals? Most penetration with an odd angle shot? Again, I’ll read about how they will kill you, then folks will tell people not to take a 300wm and only take your 30/06. Makes zero sense to me.

So, when I kill my first huge cat (I’ve taken a bobcat) I will not listen to someone that has killed one cat and say “he has the perfect bullet figured out.” I would her on sniperhide or rockslide and talk to guys that put thousands of rounds a year through a barrel and what they think the best bullet is. I would talk to r and d guys that have taken tax and raptors and hammers to Africa and harvested 100 animals at a time to field test the bullets on line game after many years in the lab.

But hey. That’s just me.

I think by "too tough" he meant those bullets have more risk of a pass through, relatively speaking, on thin skinned cats. That's why he was thinking something that can expand more may be better. One needs to worry more about quick kill than ruining the pelt. Well, that's my take on what he was saying. I would think Partitions might be a good choice for this.

 

[375Ruger416]

Read ‘The Perfect Shot’ or the second version. Kevin Robertson - veterinarian and PH - recommends partitions amongst other premium expanding bullets for leopards as I recall. I’ll double check my copy tonight. The rationale is that leopards will injure you and your hunting party if they are not put down immediately. A high shoulder shot may be desirable for the same reason. They are not particularly thick or heavy bodied, but you do not want them to bleed out while they chew up your hunting party.

As an aside, their vitals are not exactly where you might think - especially when they are in the sphinx pose. Study your shot placement and listen to your PH as far as cartridge and projectile selection IMO. If I ever hunt leopard, I’ll take the advice of the person who is putting their ass on the line with mine.

Buffalos kill more hunters, but more hunters and PH’s are injured by leopards than any other game animal apparently. I’ve been bit by a pissed off housecat and treated infections caused by cat bite and cat scratch. I have no desire to play with a pissed off leopard tom of 140+ lbs. YMMV.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

This is what I was referring to I appreciate everyone's response.

Should I even use this bullet at all? What's a great bullet for leopard and plains game. I'm not so much worried about the zero I was just wondering what's the best all around bullet for plains game and cats

@Obi Wan Kenobi
My son and I used accubonds for pg. I used Woodleigh as well.
Dang even the plain old cup and core Hornady RNSP 250gn performed flawlessly on a big oryx.
Call me strange but I find bonded or heavy for calibler cup and core seem to kill quicker than the monos. That's just my opinion.
If I was going after leopard I would want a bullet that opens quick but still holds together to do max damage in the shortest time. I wouldn't use a bullet that has ANY CHANCE of pencilling thru so he can then use me as a scratching post.
I'm just old fashioned tho.
Bob
Bob

 

[wvfred]

I hunted with a very famous leopard PH a few years ago and he told me that if I put a round behind the shoulder that we would find it he said they are not hard to kill.I was using a 300 Dakota with nosler partitions.

 

[Bert the Turtle]

TSX is designed for deep penetration more so than expansion. It will penetrate a leopard more than needed, so a softer bullet may be closer to the ideal choice.

That said, it will expand on a leopard, especially at the velocity it is going to have at under 50 yards. It there is going to be a problem, it will be because you shot it in the wrong place, not because you were using a TSX.

Zero wherever you like and shoot plains game to your hearts content. Once you have a leopard on bait, your hunt is no longer a mixed game hunt: it is a leopard hunt. You’ll zero your rifle for the exact range from the hide to the bait and from that point onward, you’ll be hunting that leopard.

Does it really matter if you are zeroed for 150 yards instead of 37? Think of it this way: would you rather your rifle be zeroed for leopard and you shoot a little off on a zebra or the other way around?