Has magnum action today, really become history?

CoElkHunter

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With the demise of the low cost, double square bridged, magnum length actioned CZ 550, many cartridges such as the .416 Rigby, .450 Rigby, .500 Jeffrey, .505 Gibbs and to a lesser extent, the .458 Lott will fade more and more into obscurity as time goes on. Once again, those cartridges will be in the domain of those who can afford much more expensive rifles as once was the case. Very sad.
 

rookhawk

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With the demise of the low cost, double square bridged, magnum length actioned CZ 550, many cartridges such as the .416 Rigby, .450 Rigby, .500 Jeffrey, .505 Gibbs and to a lesser extent, the .458 Lott will fade more and more into obscurity as time goes on. Once again, those cartridges will be in the domain of those who can afford much more expensive rifles as once was the case. Very sad.

@CoElkHunter while I concur there is a dearth of premium magnum actions in the pipeline for new guns, there are some. There are many, many high quality magnum rifles in the hands of both “wishful” bubbas that like big guns and will never get to Africa, and there are even more higher grade magnum rifles in the hands of the greatest generation and the baby boomers that owned several, went on safari, want to go again, but never will. Those folks are sadly dying off or retiring and their collections are coming to market.

For those that want a good rifle at a reasonable price, there are some amazing vintage values hitting the market in recent years.
 

CoElkHunter

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@CoElkHunter while I concur there is a dearth of premium magnum actions in the pipeline for new guns, there are some. There are many, many high quality magnum rifles in the hands of both “wishful” bubbas that like big guns and will never get to Africa, and there are even more higher grade magnum rifles in the hands of the greatest generation and the baby boomers that owned several, went on safari, want to go again, but never will. Those folks are sadly dying off or retiring and their collections are coming to market.

For those that want a good rifle at a reasonable price, there are some amazing vintage values hitting the market in recent years.
Well, generally your right. But not in the $900-$1100 range of a used CZ just 18 months ago? Yes, the CZ doesn't compare in quality with a Winchester, Kimber, MRC, etc., but then again, it was an inexpensive rifle with a magnum length receiver in the larger bore cartridges that someone on a limited rifle budget could afford to buy (several) and shoot and experiment with the different cartridges. My only point was as time goes on, some of the cartridges the CZ was chambered for, will slowly fade back into obscurity as the ability to find an affordable rifle(s) in those cartridges will be "fleeting", and thus fewer and fewer people using those cartridges.
 

Safari Dave

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If you can't afford a Winchester Model 70, then you probably can't afford to hunt with it.



I have bought a used .375 and a .458 and only gave $500/each for them.



If you don't have to have a "controlled-feed" pre-64 action, they are not hard to find.
 

colorado

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Well, generally your right. But not in the $900-$1100 range of a used CZ just 18 months ago? Yes, the CZ doesn't compare in quality with a Winchester, Kimber, MRC, etc., but then again, it was an inexpensive rifle with a magnum length receiver in the larger bore cartridges that someone on a limited rifle budget could afford to buy (several) and shoot and experiment with the different cartridges. My only point was as time goes on, some of the cartridges the CZ was chambered for, will slowly fade back into obscurity as the ability to find an affordable rifle(s) in those cartridges will be "fleeting", and thus fewer and fewer people using those cartridges.

Well I guess I don't agree with your statement about the CZ 550. If I were going to buy a 375 H&H or a 416 Rem Mag I would go with either a pre-64 or a new Model 70. They're really nice guns and about the right weight for those calibers. I do have a Model 70 Classic in 416 Remington. It's a nice gun, but compared to Model 70 my CZ 550 in 500 Jeffery is built like a bank vault. Smooth action, zero wiggle in the bolt, accurate as hell. I wouldn't buy a CZ550 unless it was in 416 Rigby, 450 Rigby, or 500 Jeffery because it is built like a tank. Mine had a little work done on it and it's by far the nicest rifle I own.


full
 
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CoElkHunter

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Well I guess I don't agree with your statement about the CZ 550. If I were going to buy a 375 H&H or a 416 Rem Mag I would go with either a pre-64 or a new Model 70. They're really nice guns and about the right weight for those calibers. I do have a Model 70 Classic in 416 Remington. It's a nice gun, but compared to Model 70 my CZ 550 in 500 Jeffery is built like a bank vault. Smooth action, zero wiggle in the bolt, accurate as hell. I wouldn't buy a CZ550 unless it was in 416 Rigby, 450 Rigby, or 500 Jeffery because it is built like a tank. Mine had a little work done on it and it's by far the nicest rifle I own.


full
Very nice rifle with beautiful wood! As to your statement that "you wouldn't buy a CZ 550 unless it was in .416 Rigby, .450 Rigby, or .500 Jeffrey", add I'll add .505 Gibbs, .404 Jeffrey and probably/maybe .458 Lott. Since CZ ceased the production of it's low cost magnum actioned rifles, you'll pay NOW three to four times or more the cost to own a rifle in most of those those cartridges than the CZ 550. Again, much more expensive rifles in those cartridges=MANY fewer owners of rifles in those cartridges, which will ultimately lead, OVER TIME, the demise of the availability of ammo and reloading components for those increasingly obscure cartridges. In my opinion, as an example, the .416 Rigby was on it's deathbed until CZ manufactured their 550 at a LOW COST in that cartridge. The availability of the .416 Remington and .416 Ruger in lower cost rifles, eclipsed the Rigby in higher end rifles by a huge margin. You can find a .375 H and H in many, many reasonable lower cost rifles right now. But, try and find even a Lott right now in a rifle costing under $2K? My CZ Lott was $900. Then go up from there EXPONENTIONALLY in cost for any of the above cartridges chambered in rifles right now. Look around the internet and tell me what your beloved CZ550 in .500 Jeffrey cartridge would cost in ANY rifle chambered for it now? Yeah, my point exactly.
 
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colorado

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Thank you! I didn't add the 505 Gibbs because it's my feeling the bolt face on the CZ 550 is a little too small for that cartridge. I know they made them, but that's what made me decide to go for the 500 Jeffery.
 

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I think it was mentioned that the Zastava or Whitworth actions are not true magnum actions. They make the magazine box fit the round, and they remove metal from the feed ramp to add length inside.
Some consider this an unsafe procedure but my .375 has never suffered any ill effects from this and been shooting it since 1984.
they are decent working rifles but they are standard length actions not a true magnum length ,,FN did the same for browning
 

Forrest Halley

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Very nice rifle with beautiful wood! As to your statement that "you wouldn't buy a CZ 550 unless it was in .416 Rigby, .450 Rigby, or .500 Jeffrey", add I'll add .505 Gibbs, .404 Jeffrey and probably/maybe .458 Lott. Since CZ ceased the production of it's low cost magnum actioned rifles, you'll pay NOW three to four times or more the cost to own a rifle in most of those those cartridges than the CZ 550. Again, much more expensive rifles in those cartridges=MANY fewer owners of rifles in those cartridges, which will ultimately lead, OVER TIME, the demise of the availability of ammo and reloading components for those increasingly obscure cartridges. In my opinion, as an example, the .416 Rigby was on it's deathbed until CZ manufactured their 550 at a LOW COST in that cartridge. The availability of the .416 Remington and .416 Ruger in lower cost rifles, eclipsed the Rigby in higher end rifles by a huge margin. You can find a .375 H and H in many, many reasonable lower cost rifles right now. But, try and find even a Lott right now in a rifle costing under $2K? My CZ Lott was $900. Then go up from there EXPONENTIONALLY in cost for any of the above cartridges chambered in rifles right now. Look around the internet and tell me what your beloved CZ550 in .500 Jeffrey cartridge would cost in ANY rifle chambered for it now? Yeah, my point exactly.
You're correct in my opinion Mark, but as we have not seen what the ammunition makers are really going to be up to after the pandemic panic buying response, we don't know what calibers will actually survive. They could very well kill off a few of the old standbys and leave us with very few choices. When you can actually buy 20,000 primers and projectiles again with 16 pounds of powder I will feel at ease. Sadly, I think this little virus is being used to justify a smaller supply on many goods which will ensure consistent demand and hold a higher price. Price elasticity is absurd on ammunition.
 

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Well, generally your right. But not in the $900-$1100 range of a used CZ just 18 months ago? Yes, the CZ doesn't compare in quality with a Winchester, Kimber, MRC, etc., but then again, it was an inexpensive rifle with a magnum length receiver in the larger bore cartridges that someone on a limited rifle budget could afford to buy (several) and shoot and experiment with the different cartridges. My only point was as time goes on, some of the cartridges the CZ was chambered for, will slowly fade back into obscurity as the ability to find an affordable rifle(s) in those cartridges will be "fleeting", and thus fewer and fewer people using those cartridges.
Just a thought. The 416 Rigby and up gained popularity despite being chambered in some pretty expensive rifles. The average guy could afford a Winchester in 375 H&H, but not the bigger stuff in Rigbys, Purdeys, H&Hs, etc. It wasn’t until the 458 Win Mag came available in the Model 70 that a big bore became relatively affordable.

The CZ 550 is a gem. Good enough out of the box. With a small amount of tweaking it can be a fine option for most of us regular Joe’s and handle the most powerful rounds designed for a bolt gun. But will its demise push the 416 Rigby and more into obscurity? I don’t know about that.
 

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Latest news, the great extintion of mauser action, continues.

No more CZ 527 in production, all went under umbrella of new production line cz 600.
For a moment I thought they are revivinig good old, zkk 600, but no, that is not the case.
Minimauser CZ 527, in 223, gone.

From bright side, at least they returned some magnum chambering, 300 win mag, back in production.
I estimate this, as "optimization of manufacturing costs".
Looks like the real good products from CZ still remain, CZ 75, CZ 75TS, and shadow 2. Pistols.
The rest remains.... hmmm... how to put it.... without character in world wide, mass production market.
Diluted.
 

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CoElkHunter

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Latest news, the great extintion of mauser action, continues.

No more CZ 527 in production, all went under umbrella of new production line cz 600.
For a moment I thought they are revivinig good old, zkk 600, but no, that is not the case.
Minimauser CZ 527, in 223, gone.

From bright side, at least they returned some magnum chambering, 300 win mag, back in production.
I estimate this, as "optimization of manufacturing costs".
Looks like the real good products from CZ still remain, CZ 75, CZ 75TS, and shadow 2. Pistols.
The rest remains.... hmmm... how to put it.... without character in world wide, mass production market.
Diluted.
I like the looks of the wood stocked and with sights Lux model. But, other than that, might as well buy a Savage?
 

Hunter4752001

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The CZ 600 certainly isn't a replacement for the 550 Magnum length. The data sheet indicates it comes in 3 lengths: Mini (.223), Medium (.308) and Long (30-06). The 300 Win Mag fits a 30-06 length action and isn't a true magnum length cartridge. No word in the material as to whether its CRF or push feed. And what are "Remington 700 type bases and rings" ? Sad to see given the traditions of the company.
 

mark-hunter

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Remington 700 type bases and rings?
This is formula, latest advertised by bergara.
Drilled and tapped, to accept piccatiny rail, designed for rem 700.
(hanging on massive rem 700 backmarket)

This also means, they have moved away from very good and secure dove tail mount system.
Thumb down in my view, But I am sure they will find fans for this as well.

Outdoor magazine claims it is controlled round feed, and if that is correct it should be something like sako 85 system.

All in all, with rifle makers not making rifles for chambering 375 H&H and upwards, I would not be impressed.
Good luck to them, with new enterprise, but not my cup of tea.
 
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Hunter4752001

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@mark-hunter Thanks for the link to the article. Hate to say this but the rifle looks like an abomination designed by one of the tacti-cool crowd who have never shot anywhere but the bench.
Goodbye CZ.
 

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The CZ 600 certainly isn't a replacement for the 550 Magnum length. The data sheet indicates it comes in 3 lengths: Mini (.223), Medium (.308) and Long (30-06). The 300 Win Mag fits a 30-06 length action and isn't a true magnum length cartridge. No word in the material as to whether its CRF or push feed. And what are "Remington 700 type bases and rings" ? Sad to see given the traditions of the company.
No, it's certainly not a magnum action or close to it - I think the posted was making the point that another largely under-valued CZ action is falling by the wayside.

The 527 mini is one of the few copies of the Mauser mini-action (with a metal, removable magazine too!) - a CRF action that is properly scaled down, which makes for a very compact, handy rifle in the smaller calibres.
 

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Unfortunately CZ is owned by Czech-Americans. This was positive in opening up American market to CZ and what I thought would be a famous CZ company remaining in Czech hands. CZ-USA was the result and with it came many more models and options. Also good in a way. It was negative in the respect of American market then dictating what CZ should look like (American style stock, no sights, one model many different stock/barrel combinations or features). It also drove the management and manufacturing style the true capitalist way - money and profit being more important than pride in the product and its quality. While no company sets out to make "junk", the manufacturing process got simplified to be able to produce more to flood the market. With it went QA in some cases (some African calibers having feeding issues, etc.). Ultimately companies really streamline production to a point of diluting the product but offering more "options" just like car industry. Same cars but you can "customize" each one up to ying-yang to feel like you have something special. Not necessarily bad either but I'm simple and would prefer fewer choices and more quality to begin with. In the end all rifles these days are good enough and actually so good that again I wonder why we need so many. I agree with the comment that it might as well be another Savage (not that Savage is something bad). I may buy one just to see (so they will probably get me as a customer) but in the then end I always gravitate to old Mausers/Brnos.

I like the barrel interchangeability but wish the system was more of a cam-lock design. This is more like CZ 455. LOL. Again not that there is anything wrong with that. I love CZ 455 but it's no Brno ZKM 452. I wish they kept CRF. But while I love the CZ 550, Brno ZKKs they already lost me on anything after ZG47. Anyway, world and time move on, not waiting on anyone. Old geezers like me with old-fashioned opinions do not matter and we all die in the end and none of it matters. ;)

Oh yeah. This has nothing to do with magnum actions. So sorry, just venting. :D
 
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