Elephant caliber

[Tanks]

It really is about “want” not “need”. You don’t need anything beyond your 375, but you may want a rifle with a 4 in front

Well, sometimes one needs something beyond a 375.

 

[zephyr]

You're going to hunt Elephant ....
Buy yourself an Elephant Gun ....

 

[eyedok]

Have shot elephant with a .450-400 and a .404, my next will probably be with a .375HH, i have .458 and .416 Rigby and Taylor, but havent had a PH yet say a .375 isnt adequate

 

[kpoynter]

I'm starting to put my mind towards wanting to complete my Big 5. With that in mind, I'm trying to decide on a caliber for an elephant. I currently have a Winchester M70 in .375 H&H for everything else. I originally was going to go with a .458 Win Mag but from what I've been reading/researching, there's mixed reviews on the Win Mag for elephant. So then I've been looking at the .458 Lott. I don't have the $15-75k+ for a double rifle (my plan is a non-trophy elephant and a green rhino hunt) and I want something that I can still buy commercial ammo for. Therefore, my two choices of the Win Mag and the Lott.

For those of you with actual elephant experience, is the Win Mag enough juice or do I need the Lott? Especially if SHTF and a charge occurs.

There is zero practical difference between the two .458s
Hit him in the right spot….Dead… it’s that simple

 

[375Fox]

I bought a 450 Rigby (similar to 458 Lott) for my elephant hunt. It’s likely going to sit in the gun safe for a lot of years. It bought me a few seconds when I slightly missed the brain, but the recoil is really punishing. I’d suggest shooting a 458 Lott first to judge the recoil for yourself before buying one. I think I’d just use my 375 if I were to do it again. I’d talk with your PH once you choose an outfitter. There’s not really a wrong answer. I think a 416 would be a good middle option, much more manageable recoil and also much more suited to a scope for a more accurate shot. I put a red dot on my 450 but I wouldn’t put a scope due to the heavy recoil and high possibility of getting scoped.

 

[deewayne2003]

Haven't been ele hunting yet, but if you end up taking your 375H&H, North Fork flat point solid has developed quite the reputation.

Couple of buddies going with me to Zim in 27 are taking .375H&Hs and we just finished load development on 350gr NF FP solids at 2275fps for their tuskless hunt.

The next dead cow on my cousins ranch will be the subject of penetration testing.

 

[Rare Breed]

Well, sometimes one needs something beyond a 375.

Agree which is why me personally nothing less than a 450, 470 or 500 NE. My point is your PH better have a heavy hitter beyond a 375 backing you for elephant in case of a charge or I am not hunting with them

 

[Badboymelvin]

I would just stick with the .45WM.

I’ve owned 5 of them (hoping to be 6 real soon) and have never had a problem achieving the promised velocity with any of them.

I have personally achieved 2100fps with the 550gn Woodleigh, 2150fps with the 500gn Woodleigh, 2150fps with the 480gn Woodleigh and 2300fps with the 450gn Woodleigh Hydro.
And I’m a nurse, not a professional hunter, just a nurse.
So if I can do it, I’m sure everyone else can too.

All these loads were personally chronographed by me in the Australian heat, and l had no problems with any of them.

And if everything goes to plan and I end up getting number 6, I’m just going to settle on the 450gn copper HP Atomic 29 projectiles at an easy 2200fps.

I love the .458WM and I would be more than happy to hunt anywhere in the world with it…

Russ

 

[David jr]

I'm starting to put my mind towards wanting to complete my Big 5. With that in mind, I'm trying to decide on a caliber for an elephant. I currently have a Winchester M70 in .375 H&H for everything else. I originally was going to go with a .458 Win Mag but from what I've been reading/researching, there's mixed reviews on the Win Mag for elephant. So then I've been looking at the .458 Lott. I don't have the $15-75k+ for a double rifle (my plan is a non-trophy elephant and a green rhino hunt) and I want something that I can still buy commercial ammo for. Therefore, my two choices of the Win Mag and the Lott.

For those of you with actual elephant experience, is the Win Mag enough juice or do I need the Lott? Especially if SHTF and a charge occurs.

375 with a good solid will do the task at hand you are preparing for .
I have never hunted Africa this will be accomplished in 2027 with a 21 day safari 5 of the dangerous 7 on the list including bull elephant first animal on the safari .
I have hunted all over the USA and have taken quiet a few animals with 375 nothing wrong with a 375
I was going to take my model 70 in 458 WM on this safari .Except I will only be using lead bullets on this safari and the 458 WM just cant cut it with a heavy lead bullets . So I am switching to the 458 Lott which can handle up to 700 grain bullets. Now the 458 WM will be excellent with a 450 gr solid at 2300 fps with modern solid ammo on the market today. Reports on the 450 solid in the 458 WM. at 2300 fps will shoot completely through the elephant head . The 458 Lott is replacing the 458 WM today Finding brass for the 458 WM is starting to be difficult in the US . 458 Lott brass is all over the place.I only point this out if you will be reloading your ammo . In a pinch the 458 Lott will shoot 458 WM ammo.
Yes you can use the 416’s but your 375 will be real close with the 350 gr bullets on the market today .
If you are just wanting a bigger gun then buy a 458 lott take it on the safari then sell it unless you are planning on hunting elephant again , The 458 WM and the 458 Lott will be a lot more recoil than your 375 if you are recoil sensitive stay with the 375 and have a great safari.
A 600 nitro is no good if you cant put the bullet in the right place when SHTF and a charge happens . Sounds like you know your 375 well I would say stay with it and shoot 350 gr solid bullet .
Looking forward to seeing the report when you return from your safari .

 

[Fatback]

Have you considered the .416 Remington Magnum?

This video helped influence my purchase of my Winchester Model 70 Safari Express chambered in 416 Rem Mag. Love to rifle and bullet selection/commercial availability of the caliber.

Another vote for the 416 Rem. That is what I used last year on my first elephant and it preformed perfectly

 

[VertigoBE]

To my limited understanding, yes a .375H&H will suffice for elephant, but you never know how the shot will present itself. Perfect side or frontal headshot on a calm elephant is not the same as an agitated elephant approaching at speed, or a shot when the head is up trying to scent you, or even a body shot through some brush or a running away shot to break the hip. In those cases I believe a .375 would be marginal and something a bit more potent is warranted.

When I shot my bull, we tried to approach for a perfect frontal, but the elephant was not cooperating and it became an angle shot between frontal and side brain shot. More bone and mass to punch through.

My .416Rigby with Norma Woodleigh 450grain solids worked perfectly:

When I go after elephant again, it will be with a .416, a 458 or my .500NE.

 

[uplander01]

Having been close to elephants a few times, haven’t hunted one yet, but will at some point, even though they are close I don’t see that shot being “easy”. If I was evaluating for myself, and I had a 375 dialed in with a 300-350gr solid, and a 404-416 option with a 400gr solid it would come down to taking all the rifles to the range and doing some shooting drills to see which one I actually shot best off hand, off sticks, out of breath, etc and one would shine I’m sure that’s the one I’d take

 

[Philip Glass]

For a one and done elephant trip, I'd stick with the 375 that you already own and are comfortable with. No need to buy another rifle unless the money is just burning a hole in your pocket.

I agree with these sentiments. Maybe go look for a heavier solid say 350g?

 

[Spey]

What would be nice is if we (Africa Hunting Members) had more big bore shoots where folks that were in the market for such a rifle could actually shoot various calibers to get a feel for them.

Recoil tolerance is built up, and without gradual stages of advancement, most shooters top out at 50-60ft lbs of recoil. I think you are wise to narrow your selection to the win or lott, and personally I'd go with the lott. Both can be down loaded easily for practice and the charges gradually increased as your recoil tolerance grows. Which brings us to the question do you reload?

If so, I wouldn't hesitate to find a good 458 Lott, reloading dies and brass. Grex shotshell buffer can be used to fill the remainder of the case when you want reduced loads for practice, then work your way up the scale until you've maxed out those 500 grain bullets.

I f any member wants to try out any of the following before making a purchase I am in Rhode Island: 375H&H, 416 Rem, 458 Lott, and double in 470 NE.

 

[Schüler Jumbo]

I am a risk adverse guy. All’s well in Africa until it’s not. And, I happen to be afraid of elephant. In addition I’m afraid of lion, leopard, buff, croc, and hippo just to name a few…..so, my choice for Elephant Safari is the cartridge .500 Schüler.

 

[Schüler Jumbo]

I'm starting to put my mind towards wanting to complete my Big 5. With that in mind, I'm trying to decide on a caliber for an elephant. I currently have a Winchester M70 in .375 H&H for everything else. I originally was going to go with a .458 Win Mag but from what I've been reading/researching, there's mixed reviews on the Win Mag for elephant. So then I've been looking at the .458 Lott. I don't have the $15-75k+ for a double rifle (my plan is a non-trophy elephant and a green rhino hunt) and I want something that I can still buy commercial ammo for. Therefore, my two choices of the Win Mag and the Lott.

For those of you with actual elephant experience, is the Win Mag enough juice or do I need the Lott? Especially if SHTF and a charge occurs.

To specifically answer your question take the .458 Lott. Since the Lott chamber will fire .458 Win you give yourself more options for commercial ammo.

 

[skydiver386]

I f any member wants to try out any of the following before making a purchase I am in Rhode Island: 375H&H, 416 Rem, 458 Lott, and double in 470 NE.

I live in Ohio, but I still have thoughts of a Big Game Hunt/Pheasant Hunt/Big Bore shoot at @gizmo Rockin G Ranch in TX.

I have several rifles that prospective big bore shooters might want to try to see where they are on the recoil tolerance scale before laying down the money for such a rifle.

CZ550 375 H&H MAG
CZ550 416 RIGBY
BRNO-602 458 LOTT
CZ550 450 RIGBY
CZ550 450 RIGBY JERRETT CUSTOM

I don't own any double rifles for the same reason the op has questions about moving up the scale. It may not be a wise decision to lay out thousands for a rifle that is beyond the shooters abilities, especially if he or she has no opportunity to test fire such a rifle. Several of the rifles I've bought in the last year were due to the owner deciding the rifle was to much for them, even though they wanted to hunt with the rifle very badly.

 

[Andrew62]

Has anyone used a 375 H&H for a frontal brain shot? Any thoughts on 300 grain or 350 grain? I have never shot an elephant but ….

I have taken 4 elephant with a .375H&H, 2 of which were frontal brain shots. One of those was with 300 grain Barnes banded solid, dropped at the shot stone dead, the other frontal was with 300 grain Barnes TSX, yes, TSX. Hunted the Nyakasanga area in November 2009, guide said they had a tuskless tag left, would I like to try for one. That was an easy ‘yes’, came up on the tuskless, shot her between her eyes, she sat back on her butt, I put 3 in her chest, she never went anywhere. And no guide took a backup shot!

 

[Mark Biggerstaff]

I live in Ohio, but I still have thoughts of a Big Game Hunt/Pheasant Hunt/Big Bore shoot at @gizmo Rockin G Ranch in TX.

You know that sounds like an awesome idea and I would be down for it, if right time of year for me.
We need to get @gizmo to put something together

 

[gizmo]

You know that sounds like an awesome idea and I would be down for it, if right time of year for me.
We need to get @gizmo to put something together

I would be honored to do that.