Bullet Performance Database

Discussion in 'Firearms & Ammunition' started by Alchemist, Apr 21, 2017.

  1. Ridgewalker

    Ridgewalker AH ENABLER LIFETIME BRONZE BENEFACTOR AH Legend

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    Just thought of another possibility from looking at the bullet. Using the base of the neck, maybe the brain shot slowed enough to hit the neck vertebrae causing the glancing blow, then rotated down through the softer neck?
    Who knows? The bullets apparently did the job on the world’s largest land animal! Great no matter how it happened!
     

  2. Royal27

    Royal27 AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Who knows is right, at least at this point.

    I'm going to ssee what the NF guys say too. It's dead isn't good enough for me because next time it might not be.

    Stuff happens with all bullets (some on a regular basis)) and I've never heard of this happening with a NF, so definitely want to see what I can find out.
     
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  3. sierraone

    sierraone AH ENABLER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    A serious question here. I have never elk hunted. Has not a .270 Winchester killed more elk than any other caliber?
     

  4. CDorroh

    CDorroh AH Senior Member

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    I would guess that more elk have fallen to a .30-06 than any other caliber, due to its sheer prevalence if nothing else, but the .270 probably isn't too far behind it in that statistic. To clarify my statement, I wouldn't recommend Sako Hammerhead bullets on heavier game based on this experience, but a .270 with a better constructed bullet will definitely do the job on a moose or elk (though some consider it to be the minimum).
     
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  5. Adrian

    Adrian AH Fanatic

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    Bullet- Norma Oryx.
    Calibre - 30-06.
    Muzzle velocity - 2700 fps.
    Range - approx 160m.
    Species - Kudu.
    Shot placement - quartering towards me looking to my left, the shot went in between the shoulder and neck and traversed the vitals before coming to rest between the skin and ribcage on the animal's right side.
    Original weight - 11.7 grams.
    Recovered weight - 10. 3 grams.

    Just back from a nine day hunt in Namibia.

    I used my 30-06 and Norma Oryx bullets of 180gr.

    I shot a Black Wildebeest, two Springbok, a Kudu, two Warthogs and a Blue Wildebeest.

    All animals were only shot once and dropped on the spot or were found after 30m max apart from one which was a shot error on my part, however the single bullet prevented the animal from getting away.

    Shots were taken from 40m to 220m.

    I only recovered one bullet from the Kudu, everything else was a clean pass through the chest or neck area.

    I would have no hesitation in recommending this bullet to anyone wishing to hunt Africa with it.

    _20171013_110414.JPG
     

  6. MAdcox

    MAdcox GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    Nice to know @Adrian . I just got my first box of Norma Oryx. 100 gr. in .243 WIN for my son to hunt our Oklahoma Whitetail deer. It will be my first experience with that bullet, but they are grouping well out of my rifle.

    Also enjoying your hunt report. Keep it coming.
     
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  7. Adrian

    Adrian AH Fanatic

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    Glad you decided to give them a go. I also use Norma 100gr in my .243.
    I'll be back on the report as soon as my daughter graciously allows me access to the laptop.
     
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  8. Royal27

    Royal27 AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Follow up to this post. Below you'll find my email to North Forth, along with their reply, which John gave me permission to post. I'm satisfied with John's answer and after much back and forth in my mind believe that the recovered bullet was most likely the hip shot. If I had it to do all over again I'd check the pelvic bone for a bullet hole, but I didn't. This is only my personal opinion and the argument can certainly be made that almost the entire length of an elephant is a long way for a deformed bullet to travel.

    I also weighed the bullet and it weighed 496.1 grains out of 500.

    --------------


    John,

    I know Phil at least mentioned this to you, but I wanted to share what I at least perceive as a failure I had on an elephant. Picture attached.

    The biggest challenge is I'm not positive which shot the bullet came from although I know it was one of two.

    The bullet was found at the base of the neck near the spine. The shots in question were as follows.

    1. Straight on frontal brain shot at 15 yards or under. It certainly didn't hit the jaw nor anything else of substance from this angle... This was the killing shot by the way.

    2. Going away hip shot (taken the evening before). This shot would have gone through the hip and then travelled the length of the bull and tumbled I guess as the bullet was found facing the rear of the elephant. If so, the penetration was awesome but the deformation surprising even hitting the hip I would think? Distance was probably 50 yards or so at time of shot.

    The rifle was a .458 Lott shooting at a muzzle velocity of 2250 fps. I'd love to get your feedback as the bullets are highly accurate but the deformation was concerning.

    By the way, there was a third shot that went through both lungs and even creased the heart and was total pass through. How that didn't kill the bull (first shot) I have no idea! Amazing....

    If you want entrance pictures I have those as well. Let me know if there is anything else you need. Thanks !

    Hello Royal,

    I believe you retrieved the second shot, or the hip shot. An ele brain will not deform the bullet as bad as you have shown unless it hits were the tusk and the upper jaw come together. A frontal brain shot does not have the bone density to cause deformation and mostly like passed completely through.

    The hip is a very hard and strong bone as one might expect from such a large animal of that weight. With that shot, I don't believe any bullet would not have any deformation. Copper is not strong (compared to steel) but very tough and does not want to come apart unless something really hard causes the copper to smear, as what I have seen from your picture. I would have expected the performance and penetration you witnessed even with the hip shot.

    If the bullet was close to underneath the skin when recovered, it probably experienced the "trampoline" affect where the skin stretches and snaps back. The bullet no longer has the speed and usually the nose is larger, preventing complete penetration of the skin. The trampoline affect will usually cause the bullet to look as though it tumbled. From the penetration you witnessed, the bullet did not tumble until the end, otherwise, its ability to travel the length of the bull would not have been possible.

    You have experienced why we always recommend the FPS on elephants. They are large, tough animals, whose ability to absorb bullets is quite amazing. Having deep, straight line penetration of a large caliber is the most important thing to have for this type of animal (over speed and expansion).

    Thank you for your report.

    Regards,

    John
     

  9. Ridgewalker

    Ridgewalker AH ENABLER LIFETIME BRONZE BENEFACTOR AH Legend

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    Thanks for pursuing and posting this Royal! Good info!
     
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  10. Rule 303

    Rule 303 AH Fanatic

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    That is good logical info. Explains things I think.
     

  11. flat8

    flat8 AH Enthusiast

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    Bullet- Nosler Trophy Grade .270 Win 130 grain AccuBond
    Calibre - .270 Winchester
    Muzzle velocity - 2950 fps
    Muzzle energy - 2511 ft-lbs
    Impact velocity - 2548 fps
    Impact energy - 1875 ft-lbs
    Range - approx 200 yards
    Species - Pronghorn
    Shot placement - quartering away towards my left, the shot went in behind the left shoulder and traversed the vitals before coming to rest in the shoulder on the animal's right side. Animal traveled about 10 yards before he expired.

    IMG_8840.JPG
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 29, 2017
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  12. MAdcox

    MAdcox GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    Can’t get much better than that.
     
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  13. flat8

    flat8 AH Enthusiast

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    IMG_8826.JPG

    Still appreciating that animal - dinner last night.
     
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  14. MAdcox

    MAdcox GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    I just made my first shot on game with the Norma Oryx 100gr 243win.
    Results were excellent. Whitetail at 160 yards, broadside. Bullet slipped between on side ribs and got lungs and broke offside rib and exited. Buck went 30 yards and locked up. Just as I was steadying for follow up, he shook twice and fell over. He was dead when I walked to him.
     
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  15. hgr2

    hgr2 AH Member

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    NM Elk 17

    I really like TSX bullets so far, no performance issues to report. Have used them to take a few critters over the years from TX, NM to Zimbabwe. 300 WSM to 376 Steyr.

    FN/Win M70 PBR 24” 185 yards, 1 shot and done.
    300 WSM-168 TSX @ 3120 FPS 68 gr. H-4350 new FC case


    ELK.jpg 168 TSX.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 4, 2017
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  16. hgr2

    hgr2 AH Member

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    The .416 cal. 400 gr Swift A-Frame @ 2375 fps is a spectacular bullet also.
    Recovered on the off side arm pit after taking out both lungs at around 120 yards.

    10616641_938948702798831_6735522160075254055_n.jpg A-Frame.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 5, 2017

  17. 008

    008 AH Veteran

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    What do you shoot the 376 out of? I had a steyr scout chambered in it and the recoil was stout to say the least.
     

  18. hgr2

    hgr2 AH Member

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    008,
    My 376 is a Steyr Scout with a VX-6 1 X 6 mounted over the bolt. It shoots really well with Factory 270 gr but my hunting load is a 300 gr TSX at a solid 2300 fps loaded with H-4895.

    This rifle will hold +-1 ¼” groups at 100 yards, some times better. I figure I would most likely limit myself to around 200 yards with this setup and didn't take a farther shot than that.

    I was able to let the air out of a few smaller critters with instant kills, no bullets recovered. The little rifle will wear you out shooting from the bench but off sticks or offhand I have zero complaints.
     

  19. 008

    008 AH Veteran

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    Very cool. Haven’t known anyone else to have one. Is ammo tough to come by now?
     

  20. Neale

    Neale AH Enthusiast

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    Hi @hgr2 , Where did you hunt your Buff?. Looks like the type of country I would like to hunt.
     

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