577 NE double rifles

[Red Leg]

You specifically asked how many it has killed . I have told you. Thanks for your view .

I am pretty sure I "specifically" typed,

"A .577 Nitro express load generates pressures of 33K to 40K PSI. That is creating a potential bomb out of a BPE rifle, I don't care how many buffalo your friend has killed with it."

That is an accurate statement with which I am confident both the London and Birmingham proof houses would agree.

Look, should someone want to own a BPE, then by all means purchase one. I am simply suggesting that loading it and using it as it was intended is probably a good idea.

 

[50Gunner]

SSTC, way, way different animals, my little Holland 500-450 Nitro's old load was 480gr bullets at 2148 fps over 106grs of powder, really close to your 470 NE with 500gr bullets, I could fire that little Holland off my forehead, the 577 with real and full Nitro loads with 750 grs at 2076 fps over 133grs of powder is an all together different animal, recoil impulse, torque and velocity is off the charts.

You really have to concentrate to stay in the gun to shoot it well, you will also use your tongue to repack that pinch of smokeless snuff in your lip ; ]

Thanks Matt.

 

[matt85]

You really have to concentrate to stay in the gun to shoot it well, you will also use your tongue to repack that pinch of smokeless snuff in your lip ; ]

The bigger guns take a great deal of concentration and practice to shoot well! My old Jeffery double will shoot very well if you can keep your head in the game.

 

[AZDAVE]

The thing that surprised me the most the first time I shot a 577 NE wasn't the recoil (It was a bit more than a maiden's kiss) was the amount of torque than came through the hand on the forend and a shift of the butt stock an bit to the right. Took a while to master.

 

[SStomcat]

The thing that surprised me the most the first time I shot a 577 NE wasn't the recoil (It was a bit more than a maiden's kiss) was the amount of torque than came through the hand on the forend and a shift of the butt stock an bit to the right. Took a while to master.

I'm curious about the torque factor on the foreend. Is this something related to the calibre or the gun or something else?

 

[AZDAVE]

It is the torque that comes from the bullet going down the barrel. All rifles have it but isn't really enough to affect what you feel. Where I have felt it start is the heavy bullets in the .50 cal and bigger. I have also experienced it in the 10-8 bore rifles shooting conical bullets more than round balls.

Kinda think of a hand held drill, you feel it torquing your hand and wrist, it goes up as the bit get bigger.

 

[SStomcat]

It is the torque that comes from the bullet going down the barrel. All rifles have it but isn't really enough to affect what you feel. Where I have felt it start is the heavy bullets in the .50 cal and bigger. I have also experienced it in the 10-8 bore rifles shooting conical bullets more than round balls.

Kinda think of a hand held drill, you feel it torquing your hand and wrist, it goes up as the bit get bigger.

Yes, understood. Must really be the heavy hitters, as I have not noticed it in my 470. `

 

[Pondoro]

I have one of the late .577BPE´s, a Lyon & Lyon that came from India in the early seventies.. I would not contemplate hunting buffalo with it.. What is the point when one have nitro doubles..?

2 norwegian hunters hunted British East Africa from dec. 1913 until aug.1914.. Before they shipped themselves from Marseille to Mombasa they bought a Jeffery double rifle .450/400 3" each in London..

One of them wrote a book about this journey...they camped for a while with a british officer who repetedly tried to bag buffalo with a .577BPE..to no avail. The paper patched lead bullets simply did not penetrate.

The Jeffery doubles bagged elephant, buffalo and rhino with modern solids..

 

[Red Leg]

Yes, understood. Must really be the heavy hitters, as I have not noticed it in my 470. `

Newton's Third Law applied to rotation. For every rotational force imparted on the bullet by the rifling, an equal and opposite rotational inertia (torque) is imparted to the rifle itself. Rifling has to exert 50% more rotational force on that 750 gr bullet than a 470 does on a 500 gr bullet. I am not sure that history supports translating that to heavier hitting, but it certainly does to heavier "twisting."

 

[rookhawk]

This one has been on Comsignment for a year here in Canada. No clue if its a good deal as thats half of what I bought my house for. But a nice looking double at the very least

Consign - Butch Searcy & Co. - 577NE - Dangerous Game Double Rifle - dark straight grain walnut stock w/shadowline cheekpiece/matte stainless boxlock receiver/Blued Finish, 24-1/8"Barrels - see description for more details

Prophet River Firearms

store.prophetriver.com

I don't think @matt85 is likely to buy another Searcy. The poor guy got put through the ringer once already!

 

[Red Leg]

I have one of the late .577BPE´s, a Lyon & Lyon that came from India in the early seventies.. I would not contemplate hunting buffalo with it.. What is the point when one have nitro doubles..?

2 norwegian hunters hunted British East Africa from dec. 1913 until aug.1914.. Before they shipped themselves from Marseille to Mombasa they bought a Jeffery double rifle .450/400 3" each in London..

One of them wrote a book about this journey...they camped for a while with a british officer who repetedly tried to bag buffalo with a .577BPE..to no avail. The paper patched lead bullets simply did not penetrate.

The Jeffery doubles bagged elephant, buffalo and rhino with modern solids..

The British officer would have been in good company during that period. Sir Samuel Baker, Frederick Courtney Selous, and Arthur H. Neumann who were contemporaries of your Norwegian author all condemned the .577 BPE (and its ammunition) for use on thick skinned dangerous game. Selous (see "A Hunter's Wanderings in Africa") specifically reserved his BPE for lion, giraffe, and plains game. All three employed hardened lead round ball ammunition from 4 and 8 bore guns for thick skinned game.

If you can get access to the DVD, there is an episode in "Sunset on Botswana" where Bill Jones is using Earnest Hemingway's .577 NE rifle on a bull elephant with Boddington. Let me hasten to add that a .577 NE absolutely will kill an elephant (if hit in the right place), but Jones's ammunition was running lower velocity - essentially a BPE load with a modern solid. Jones fires twice for a frontal brain shot, the bull was not shocked into submission, but instead simply turned and headed off. Later he was finally put down by a heart lung shot. Subsequently it was discovered the bullets were stopped before reaching the brain.

 

[SStomcat]

Newton's Third Law applied to rotation. For every rotational force imparted on the bullet by the rifling, an equal and opposite rotational inertia (torque) is imparted to the rifle itself. Rifling has to exert 50% more rotational force on that 750 gr bullet than a 470 does on a 500 gr bullet. I am not sure that history supports translating that to heavier hitting, but it certainly does to heavier "twisting."

Yes Newtons third law of motion comes to mind- every action has an equal and opposite reaction .
The reason I asked was I do not feel it while firing my 470 but do agree a 577 is a different beast.

 

[Miletic]

Exactly, Now imagine how you would look at it after spending eight hours in the hot son tryin to catch up with a group of buffalo.

Dear Red Leg, I dream of chasing a herd of buffs in the hot sun all day!!!!!!!

 

[matt85]

I don't think @matt85 is likely to buy another Searcy. The poor guy got put through the ringer once already!

Aside from my STRONG personal dislike of Searcy and his guns, there is also this in that ad " Rifle weighs 11 pounds, 14 ounces". That is stupidly light for a 577 NE 3" and my bet is that gun will kick the snot out of the shooter.

 

[rookhawk]

Aside from my STRONG personal dislike of Searcy and his guns, there is also this in that ad " Rifle weighs 11 pounds, 14 ounces". That is stupidly light for a 577 NE 3" and my bet is that gun will kick the snot out of the shooter.

Yikes! It should be 13.5lbs-14lbs to produce more than 100lbs of recoil. At that weight, it would be putting out somewhere around 150lbs of recoil...that will cause concussions!

 

[matt85]

Yikes! It should be 13.5lbs-14lbs to produce more than 100lbs of recoil. At that weight, it would be putting out somewhere around 150lbs of recoil...that will cause concussions!

I would pass on any gun under 14lb. I think I would prefer 14.5-15lb. I like my guns to be fun to shoot.

 

[Red Leg]

Dear Red Leg, I dream of chasing a herd of buffs in the hot sun all day!!!!!!!

For sure - but only if a gun bearer is lugging the .577.

 

[Miletic]

For sure - but only if a gun bearer is lugging the .577.

I have some friends from the neighborhood who do nothing. I would take one to see Africa

 

[50Gunner]

The bigger guns take a great deal of concentration and practice to shoot well! My old Jeffery double will shoot very well if you can keep your head in the game.

Matt, you bet they do, thought has always been if a man is going to show up with a big gun he best know how to run it, same/same with my '74 Sharps rifles, black powder with paper patch bullets, or even S Hawken pattern rifle in 58 cal with Holy Black and round balls, after shooting completely through every deer or wild pig I've hit with any of them I no longer get strange looks at camp from my BIL's friends I didn;t know at the time.

One guy said after I hit an old barren in the withers grey faced doe, "Sir, I didn't want to say anything, but I didn't even think that rifle would go off when I saw you this morning" I said, that rifle only looks 150 years old young buck.

AZDAVE is correct, torque is very real, it comes from 750grs slamming into the rifling, it will turn the rifle in your hands, I grab the barrels, not the forearm, double rifles recoil up out and over left and right with both barrels, just hang on and let the rifle do what it was designed to do, if one tried to shoot a 577 Nitro holding the forearm like you would a regular bolt action rifle it could fly over your head backwards and knock the beer outta the hand of the man 20 feet behind you sitting a in a lawn chair ; ]

Red Leg also has a handle on it, for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, also, Momentum, it's the easiest of the Newton/Physics scales to understand, it is simply mass in motion, I believe in it, it is a very real thing.

My 577 weighed 14.5lbs when I got it, carried it 100 miles in Tanzania, came home and pulled that 1LB mercury recoil reducer from the buttstock and gave it to my Gunsmith, these rifles are carried much more than they are fired, making the first shot count requires much less shooting, no rodeos, as it should be.

 

[matt85]

My 577 weighed 14.5lbs when I got it, carried it 100 miles in Tanzania, came home and pulled that 1LB mercury recoil reducer from the buttstock and gave it to my Gunsmith, these rifles are carried much more than they are fired, making the first shot count requires much less shooting, no rodeos, as it should be.

I suppose it's a matter of priorities (and money).

My rifles are shot MUCH more than they are carried! If things go well, I "might" get to hunt with my heavy double once in my life. On the other hand, I can shoot it in the woods near my home any time I like. I probably fire my 8-bore around 60 times a year.