The Vintage Of These 7×57 mm Mauser Cartridges?

[leslie hetrick]

i gave my dad a sporterized fn 98 mauser carbine in 7x57 with a older 3x weaver on it in the mid 60,s, it was very light and easy to carry as my dad was a slightly built man at 5'4" and 140 lbs. i loaded 154 gr hornady round nose bullets at 2500 fps and he killed a pile of deer and a few black bear with that rifle and load. when he passed in 2007 my sister gave it to her husband and he sold it to pay for truck repairs with out telling me. i have looked for it since then with out finding it.

 

[Shootist43]

Poton, for sure you guys don't want to continue using these anemic 7 x 57 rounds for hunting. For now I'd just pull the bullets (save them for later) neck size the brass and load it with 140 Gn. projectiles if you are short of ammunition. See my PM.

 

[Wyatt Smith]

Major, have you and Mr. Rahman started reloading for rifle yet? If you have, would it be possible to pull the bullets, discard the powder, and put a more appropriate charge of powder in? You would have to resize the necks.

 

[Wyatt Smith]

You and I must have typing at the same time @Shootist43 , I took a phone call and the posted and you beat me to it.

 

[Major Khan]

i gave my dad a sporterized fn 98 mauser carbine in 7x57 with a older 3x weaver on it in the mid 60,s, it was very light and easy to carry as my dad was a slightly built man at 5'4" and 140 lbs. i loaded 154 gr hornady round nose bullets at 2500 fps and he killed a pile of deer and a few black bear with that rifle and load. when he passed in 2007 my sister gave it to her husband and he sold it to pay for truck repairs with out telling me. i have looked for it since then with out finding it.

This is extremely disappointing , Mr. Hetrick . Those Fabrique Nationale Belgian Mauser 98 action rifles were considered the creme de la creme back in the 1950s until 1965 ( when Fabrique Nationale switched them in to push feed models and omitted the bolt guide... in order to save costs ) . My favorite 1 was the variant manufactured by Fabrique Nationale ... chambered in .30-06 Springfield.
It is a shame that you have lost not only such a fine weapon , but also a momento of your late father . There is a hard learned lesson in all of this . A son in law never values a gentle man's possessions ... the way that his own son does.

 

[Major Khan]

Poton, for sure you guys don't want to continue using these anemic 7 x 57 rounds for hunting. For now I'd just pull the bullets (save them for later) neck size the brass and load it with 140 Gn. projectiles if you are short of ammunition. See my PM.

You don't say , Shootist43 ! There is nothing more frustrating than having to follow up a wounded 300 pound Wild Boar ( which has only had 1 of it's lungs ruptured ) through the Sylhet tea gardens at 1:00 AM in the morning ... with only the aid of a pencil torch light . The 175 grain soft point Winchester Super X soft point bullet ruptured only 1 lung of the brute ...and failed to reach the other 1 , even though Kawshik had taken a perfect double lung shot with his BRNO ZKK 600 bolt rifle .

 

[Shootist43]

Did you pull one of those 175 Gn. bullets yet and measure it? The measurement needs to be taken with a caliper and or micrometer capable of reading .000" of an inch.

 

[Major Khan]

Major, have you and Mr. Rahman started reloading for rifle yet? If you have, would it be possible to pull the bullets, discard the powder, and put a more appropriate charge of powder in? You would have to resize the necks.

We could easily do that , Master Smith .
We still have 48 Winchester Super X 175 grain 7x57 mm Mauser soft point cartridges in Kawshik's inventory .
I am 100 % inclined to agree with you , young man . The bullets themselves work excellently, because they open up properly inside the vital organs of the animal being shot . However , the charge of powder inside these Winchester brand Super X cartridges is quite diminutive . The powder charge is too low ... to be capable of achieving a decent velocity with the 175 grain bullet .

 

[Major Khan]

Did you pull one of those 175 Gn. bullets yet and measure it? The measurement needs to be taken with a caliper and or micrometer capable of reading .000" of an inch.

Wait for a bit , Shootist43 . I shall do it by tonight and send you the 100 % accurate measurements .

 

[Shootist43]

Ok. It is 10:53 A.M. so I'm going to get started on some other projects.

 

[Dirtdart]

Any one have experience with this ammunition?

 

[Ray B]

A son in law never values a gentle man's possessions ... the way that his own son does.

This is a false generalization; for proof of which I submit the following:

My wife's father had a family heirloom, a Winchester Model 1894 made when McKinley was president. He had received it following the death of his older brother who had been a sheep rancher during the 1920s & 30s in Oregon. the rifle was used while herding the sheep in combination with the good sheep dog to ward-off or eliminate coyotes and possibly a remaining wolf. My wife has a brother but he has little interest in firearms, and recognizing that I would give it the respect it deserved, her father gave it to me. Over 40 years later I still have it. I obtained dies and moulds and load it with low pressure lead loads which cause little wear on the rifle. My brother-in-law has even enjoyed visits where we have taken it out to shoot. There is no jealousy on his part as he is glad to have me provide the care for the firearm that it deserves.

Exhibit 2.

On nearing his death of cancer my father divided his gun collection between my brother and me. My brother was older and as such was always dad's favorite. As such the really nice guns went to my brother. Some are irreplaceable such as an early production Browning superposed with Twin triggers (not double triggers), a Spencer .56 carbine from the Civil War and a few other really collectable items. One of my brother's personality characteristics is the need for instant gratification and he is willing to get rid of any future value for something now. this has led to him divesting virtually all of dad's guns. He did this without any notification to me or any offer for me to purchase them from him. Some of them were sold so cheaply that I would have gladly doubled the price that he got. But since he always resented me (he was dad's favorite but I was mom's favorite), he felt justified in preventing me from getting anything I valued.


So there you have two situations with an in-law or blood relative. Too bad the fathers didn't recognize the values of their decendents and taken steps to have a better result.

 

[Major Khan]

This is a false generalization; for proof of which I submit the following:

My wife's father had a family heirloom, a Winchester Model 1894 made when McKinley was president. He had received it following the death of his older brother who had been a sheep rancher during the 1920s & 30s in Oregon. the rifle was used while herding the sheep in combination with the good sheep dog to ward-off or eliminate coyotes and possibly a remaining wolf. My wife has a brother but he has little interest in firearms, and recognizing that I would give it the respect it deserved, her father gave it to me. Over 40 years later I still have it. I obtained dies and moulds and load it with low pressure lead loads which cause little wear on the rifle. My brother-in-law has even enjoyed visits where we have taken it out to shoot. There is no jealousy on his part as he is glad to have me provide the care for the firearm that it deserves.

Exhibit 2.

On nearing his death of cancer my father divided his gun collection between my brother and me. My brother was older and as such was always dad's favorite. As such the really nice guns went to my brother. Some are irreplaceable such as an early production Browning superposed with Twin triggers (not double triggers), a Spencer .56 carbine from the Civil War and a few other really collectable items. One of my brother's personality characteristics is the need for instant gratification and he is willing to get rid of any future value for something now. this has led to him divesting virtually all of dad's guns. He did this without any notification to me or any offer for me to purchase them from him. Some of them were sold so cheaply that I would have gladly doubled the price that he got. But since he always resented me (he was dad's favorite but I was mom's favorite), he felt justified in preventing me from getting anything I valued.


So there you have two situations with an in-law or blood relative. Too bad the fathers didn't recognize the values of their decendents and taken steps to have a better result.

You have made a believer out of me. Nothing is set in stone ... I suppose , sir . I can relate to your examples . My maternal grand father was closer to me than my own father .

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Why , Long Walker ... your observations mirror exactly my own . The velocity of these cartridges was indeed 2228 feet per second when old Kawshik and I chronographed them today . In Kawshik's hands ... these cartridges certainly are devastatingly effective on cheetal deer .
I would , however prefer the powder charge to be somewhat higher if the operator intended to use them on our large sambhur deer .
In my old ( and admittedly antiquated) view , the very best factory loaded cartridges for the 7x57 mm Mauser calibre were the original German RWS brand 175 grain soft point and solid metal covered cartridges. They had a fairly higher velocity and out clients routinely even used them against 200 pound forest panthers and 500 pound male royal Bengal tigers with utter impunity ( and critical shot placement , of course ) .
1990s seems like an extremely sensible assumption for the vintage of these cartridges.

Friend Ponton
I would have no hesitation using them on sambar out to 100+ yards.
A fringe of mine uses a 303 British loaded to the same velocity with 215 grain Woodleigh round nose soft points and usually puts a big hole in one on its way out and a lot of damage on the way thru.
Go and use them with confidence my friend
Cheers my Friend
Bob Nelson

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

You traitor ! You should be ashamed of yourself ! Stock piling Winchester Australia’s 12 Bore AAA cartridges for years , without ONCE telling me that they even exist ! Up until yesterday ... I did not have even the slightest clue that Winchester ever actually manufactured Australian AAA shot size cartridges . It is most fortunate that I finally came across those 2 boxes yesterday and purchased them both . Otherwise , you might have later swung by at the store and nabbed them , from right under my nose .

Friend Ponton.
If I could I would gladly send you some Winchester 9 pellet buck shot but unfortunately cannot .
My favorite close range pig load

 

[CBH Australia]

30 years give or take seems like packaging I knew when I was licensed 30 years ago.
Is a lot of your ammunition old inventory or are these just a rare finds in small stores?

 

[Major Khan]

30 years give or take seems like packaging I knew when I was licensed 30 years ago.
Is a lot of your ammunition old inventory or are these just a rare finds in small stores?

These are quite rare finds , found in the backs of cabinets in some fire arms stores across the country , CBH Australia.
The owners of the shops offer old stock ammunition at discount prices in bulk .
They want to get rid of them , quickly.
Occasionally , we end up purchasing them .... if we like what we are seeing .
Take AAA cartridges , for instance .
To my knowledge ... the only company currently manufacturing actual English size AAA cartridges at the moment ... is Lyalvale Express ( They offer it in their " Super Game " line in a 2.75 inch 36 gram cartridge ) . AAA is an extremely popular shot size in Bangladesh . Local shikarees use this shot size for Greylag Geese , Kakar deer and even foxes .
Thus , Lyalvale Express " Super Game " 36 gram AAA cartridges are an extremely popular imported shotgun cartridge in Bangladesh. So , suppose if the fire arms shop has a few boxes of old stock Winchester Australia 12 Bore 32 gram AAA cartridges still remaining unsold in his inventory . He will offer them at half the price of the Lyalvale Express Super Game 36 gram AAA cartridges ... in bulk.

 

[Major Khan]

Friend Ponton.
If I could I would gladly send you some Winchester 9 pellet buck shot but unfortunately cannot .
My favorite close range pig load
View attachment 343062 View attachment 343063

I am truly touched by your heart felt offer , Bob. You are a friend ... who is unrivaled in kindness and proves it time and again . Fortunately for you ...
The only buck shot size which I actually have any use for , is the AAA shot size . I use it extensively for hunting Greylag Geese , kakar deer and foxes ... routinely through out the year . For the shikar of larger game ( such as cheetal deer , Wild Boars , crocodiles or the occasional Asian Sloth Bear )... I prefer to use my hand loaded 3 inch Eley Alphamax magnum " High Brass " spherical ball cartridges .

 

[Major Khan]

Friend Ponton
I would have no hesitation using them on sambar out to 100+ yards.
A fringe of mine uses a 303 British loaded to the same velocity with 215 grain Woodleigh round nose soft points and usually puts a big hole in one on its way out and a lot of damage on the way thru.
Go and use them with confidence my friend
Cheers my Friend
Bob Nelson

That is extremely re assuring , Bob . Believe me .... The last thing a shikaree wants is a sambhur deer or Wild Boar ( or indeed , ANY game animal ) to be hit through only 1 of it's lungs .
The tracking job is .... well , " Ghastly " would be quite the understatement .

 

[Shootist43]

Poton, how did the new load work out?