Politics

[Alistair]

The Department of Education recently canceled $3.9 billion in student debt for people who were defrauded by ITT Technical Institute. Biden is poised to extend the freeze on debt repayments once again. The closely held progressive belief is that all college loans should be forgiven. Which means the taxpayers, who got nothing in return, get the honor of paying the student‘s bill.

What is it about student debt that makes it so special that the government wants to waive its magic wand and make it disappear? I think debt forgiveness is a bad idea regardless, but if we do it, why not absolve all debt? What about all the people who’ve borrowed money to start a business? Or, pay medical bills? Or…..you get the picture. Again, why student loans?

The only reason I can think of is that people who attend college are more likely to vote Democrat. The ultimate vote buying move. It’s the Dems version of trickle down economics.

For context….I went to college twice. My parents paid for my undergraduate degree. I paid for my masters, by working full time and going to night school. So I am not arguing against higher Ed. I just think people should pay for the stuff they purchase.

I'm with you on this. I have some student debt from my first degree (the interest is low so I'm in no rush to repay it), but college is supposed to be an investment in yourself. If you choose wisely and it pays off, you'll repay the debt anyway. If you don't, you wont.

But either way, it's a choice freely made by supposedly intelligent adults. If you make the wrong choice, you own that. Writing off the debt just encourages people to do stupid degrees with a poor ROI and further devalues the degree itself. I can't endorse that.

Really, the government, if they want to make education accessible, should be subsidizing degrees in fields that the country needs (medicine, STEM, IT, business and law perhaps). These degrees provide value. But then, people doing them have a very high chance of paying off their student loan anyway, so long as they're willing to work a bit. All they're doing right now is actively encouraging people to do degrees that don't deliver value, because, hey, it's free so why not spend 3 or 4 years dossing around doing a degree in rap history and partying?

 

[RTG]

It is ridiculous! Shifting their debt to the taxpayers makes fools out of all of us who paid our way, or paid our kids way through college (or both in our cases!) …as well as the people who took loans and paid those loans off.

It's about rewarding bad decisions. Removing things like 'responsibility' and 'accountability' from the scales of social economics. Look at the people pushing these ideas. What do they want? Basically, communism. If you read their words, it's what they want. Their symbols for communism don't have the hammer and sickle anymore, because they don't want the labor, but their objective is sameness.

Rewarding bad decisions (gifts from government) while punishing good decisions (taxes and no gifts from government) will see millions in the next generation choosing the wrong path because it's easier, and more rewarded by society.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

If “individuals” (not team players) need their collage loans paid off by the US taxpayers such as me, I ask what are they going to do for me?

How about a Government program in which those individuals would sign a contract and put their, although often useless, degrees to work. The program could be $XX thousand dollars for Y years service. Along with their loan repayment, the individuals would receive salaries in line with those in other entry level public service occupations.

To those individuals, I ask, "If you want my tax dollars, why don’t you get to work and earn them?"

 

[mdwest]

How about a Government program in which those individuals would sign a contract and put their, although often useless, degrees to work. The program could be $XX thousand dollars for Y years service. Along with their loan repayment, the individuals would receive salaries in line with those in other entry level public service occupations.

Something like USAFA, USMA, USNA, etc... but for other career fields...

I could go for that...

Wanna be a doctor? Not a problem.. the USG will pay 100% of your tuition.. upon graduation, you will work for XXX years either as a civilian doctor at a US Military hospital or at the VA.... when your service is up you're free to do whatever you like... leave service early, not a problem.. you owe 100% of your tuition back, with interest, within YYYY years..

The problem would be when "I wanna be a Gender Studies Specialist" or "I wanna get a liberal arts degree in ancient viking symbolism".. and because you cant employ me within the USG.. you're a racist/bigot/homophobe/nameoftheday and I now wanna sue..

Im amazed at the number of people these days that knowingly and willingly went and got some degree that has somewhere between little and zero career application.. that amassed tens of thousands of dollars in debt... that now are upset because no one other than Starbucks or Walmart will employ them... and they cant afford to pay the debt because.... "UNFAIR!!!!!"....

Well... if you wanted to get paid like an engineer.. you probably should have thought about an engineering degree... if you wanted to do the work of a business executive.. maybe a BBA would have been a prudent route... if you wanted to design computer animation.. maybe some sort of certificate or training program in... wait for it... COMPUTER ANIMATION would have been a good idea...

What exactly did you think you were going to do for a living with a BA from Cal State at San Marcos in Womens Sexuality Studies? And if there is a career field for that degree (working as a social worker? or at a battered women shelter?) how many people do you think are actually employed in that field? and... how many of those jobs are filled by people with.. I dunno.. degrees in sociology, psychology, clinical counseling, etc?

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

I just remembered of a friend of my wife, which for this public forum, we will call C. C had school loans that she took out to become a Nurse Practitioner. C being an intelligent, hard working person took action to repay her loans. After four or five years, C is now a Captain in the US Air Force practicing as a Nurse Practitioner.

It seems that the USAF needed her skills and offered to repay some or most of her loans in return for service. Presently, C is approaching her end of active service (EAS) and will then leave the USAF.

C and the Air Force made a fair exchange.

 

[Hogpatrol]

And he didn't even need to go to Africa!

 

[Woodcarver]

 

[Red Leg]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1560323865703636992

 

[Ray B]

Why are the DemonRats going about things in such incremental steps. Why just cancel student loan debt? Just think of the programs the government could support if it didn't have interest payments on the National Debt.
I'm surprised that AOC, priscella, CutsiePie, Berney or even Payapal haven come up with the idea of:
CANCEL THE NATIONAL DEBT. Set the account back to $0. We could even follow with an amendment requiring a balanced budget, but let's not get ahead of ourselves, one thing at a time.

 

[Sabattiboy]

It's about rewarding bad decisions. Removing things like 'responsibility' and 'accountability' from the scales of social economics. Look at the people pushing these ideas. What do they want? Basically, communism. If you read their words, it's what they want. Their symbols for communism don't have the hammer and sickle anymore, because they don't want the labor, but their objective is sameness.

Rewarding bad decisions (gifts from government) while punishing good decisions (taxes and no gifts from government) will see millions in the next generation choosing the wrong path because it's easier, and more rewarded by society.

Is there a parallel of bad government decisions resulting in enormous debt then they will die of old age and never be held responsible?

 

[Sabattiboy]

If “individuals” (not team players) need their collage loans paid off by the US taxpayers such as me, I ask what are they going to do for me?

How about a Government program in which those individuals would sign a contract and put their, although often useless, degrees to work. The program could be $XX thousand dollars for Y years service. Along with their loan repayment, the individuals would receive salaries in line with those in other entry level public service occupations.

To those individuals, I ask, "If you want my tax dollars, why don’t you get to work and earn them?"

Long have there been programs for graduates to teach in urban schools and in exchange for X years teaching the loans will be paid.

 

[wesheltonj]

. . . What is it about student debt that makes it so special that the government wants to waive its magic wand and make it disappear? I think debt forgiveness is a bad idea regardless, but if we do it, why not absolve all debt? What about all the people who’ve borrowed money to start a business? Or, pay medical bills? Or…..you get the picture. Again, why student loans?

The only reason I can think of is that people who attend college are more likely to vote Democrat. The ultimate vote buying move. . . .

Correct, that group tend to vote D by a large majority.

Student debt. I paid for my Bachelor's and Master's degrees. My Law degree, I paid for all but one semester which my parents paid as not wanting me to be a burden on my new wife (married in my last year of law school). And my wife and I are now pay for my daughter Bachelor's degree. My wife, her parents paid for her Bachelor's and her employer paid for her Master's. Both of us no debt, just different ways. My daughter will have not debt upon graduating with her Bachelor's degree. How many more degree do I have to pay for? Apparently, a lot so the D's can buy vote.

 

[jpr9954]

I just remembered of a friend of my wife, which for this public forum, we will call C. C had school loans that she took out to become a Nurse Practitioner. C being an intelligent, hard working person took action to repay her loans. After four or five years, C is now a Captain in the US Air Force practicing as a Nurse Practitioner.

It seems that the USAF needed her skills and offered to repay some or most of her loans in return for service. Presently, C is approaching her end of active service (EAS) and will then leave the USAF.

C and the Air Force made a fair exchange.

If you have government backed loans, are willing to work for certain non-profits/governmental institutions in areas that are underserved, pay a nominal amount every month for 10 years, you will have the remaining balance waived. I have a number of physician clients doing this now.

My younger daughter got a scholarship-loan for her last two years of college in order to be an elementary school teacher. In exchange, she agreed to teach one year for each year of the loan-scholarship. It was a nominal amount - $4000 a year - but it helped.

I had a couple of clients who were nurses go back to get their MSN. North Carolina subsidized their degree if they went into nursing education when finished. It is hard to get nursing professors when the average experienced nurse makes more while working 3 12-hours shifts a week.

I agree with loan-scholarship programs where the forgiveness is based upon working in certain, underserved but necessary fields for X amount of years.

That does not include law. If you go to a marginal law school with a low Bar pass rate and rack up $300K in debt over 3 years, you are an idiot! The field has too many lawyers as it is.

 

[wesheltonj]

. . . That does not include law. If you go to a marginal law school with a low Bar pass rate and rack up $300K in debt over 3 years, you are an idiot! The field has too many lawyers as it is.

It's not marginal law schools, it's the courses they take. Last bar I took (and its been a long time and I intend to never take another one), there was exactly nothing from a course taught in Spanish - Doing Business in Mexico. Or the first year course "Into to Law" where the Dean and facility "taught" nothing and it's required reading The Bramble Bush. It's their own fault if they don't take courses that are on the bar exam or at least can make them some money when they get out.

Another problem is the schools don't want to fail out student as they want the tuition money flowing. When I went, they made it quite clear, that 25% were going to fail out and another 10% would leave on their own. The following year, that class was told at least 1/3 would fail out and another 10% gone on your own. I suspect, if students were wiped out after the first year, the problem might go away on its own.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

 

[Wheels]

 

[Wheels]

 

[Hogpatrol]

View attachment 483988

And not one journalist in the bunch.

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

Long have there been programs for graduates to teach in urban schools and in exchange for X years teaching the loans will be paid.

I’d be happy with any kind of service to pay off federal loans. Like a reverse GI bill.

They could mop hospitals or schools part time or do something productive in exchange for debt relief. At least society would get something out of it and they would be taking some responsibility for the debt.

 

[cpr0312]

And not one journalist in the bunch.

That's a big 10-4!