Dangerous Game Solid Bullet Recommendations

[IvW]

I used the Hydro's in my 416 Rigby to take a cape Buff and two Elephant. The Hydro does more internal damage than most solids but not quite as much as a soft point but penetrates way deep then Softs. Also it has a good reputation for straight line penetration even after hitting trees, bones. I have not seen one or heard of one deviating off course, not saying it is not possible just that I am not aware of it.

They shot to the same point of impact as my softs in the 416 Rigby and use the same powder load, just come out 100fps faster. Go figure. Same in my 375H&H and my 358/338RUM. What's not to like.

Only thing not to like is when hydros are used for the second shot on buffalo and it exits and hits another in the arse....one buffalo will suddenly cost double irrespective if the second is found or not......

 

[Rule 303]

Only thing not to like is when hydros are used for the second shot on buffalo and it exits and hits another in the arse....one buffalo will suddenly cost double irrespective if the second is found or not......

Yes that can be a problem. Have heard of similar with metplate solids and at least one occasion with an A Frame.

 

[mikecatt13]

I think I've decided on the Swift Breakaway solids. Should be easy to get to match POI with my aframes and swift has great support on loading etc.

Blaser said they dont have any restrictions on the S2 for solids like some traditional, soldered doubles do but the lead core will be easy on the barrels anyway.

 

[Bert the Turtle]

Only thing not to like is when hydros are used for the second shot on buffalo and it exits and hits another in the arse....one buffalo will suddenly cost double irrespective if the second is found or not......

And pissing off a second one while your eyes are on the first isn’t the best idea.

I’ll never use solids on buffalo again. I followed the advice of the PH. I’d never hunted with him before and being my first buffalo hunt, I didn’t feel I was in a position to argue. A modern soft is plenty of penetration for buffalo. A modern solid is too much. Perhaps if hunting a small bachelor group or something it would be fine (albeit essentially pointless), but absolutely never again in a herd.

 

[IvW]

And pissing off a second one while your eyes are on the first isn’t the best idea.

I’ll never use solids on buffalo again. I followed the advice of the PH. I’d never hunted with him before and being my first buffalo hunt, I didn’t feel I was in a position to argue. A modern soft is plenty of penetration for buffalo. A modern solid is too much. Perhaps if hunting a small bachelor group or something it would be fine (albeit essentially pointless), but absolutely never again in a herd.

Exactly..

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

And pissing off a second one while your eyes are on the first isn’t the best idea.

I’ll never use solids on buffalo again. I followed the advice of the PH. I’d never hunted with him before and being my first buffalo hunt, I didn’t feel I was in a position to argue. A modern soft is plenty of penetration for buffalo. A modern solid is too much. Perhaps if hunting a small bachelor group or something it would be fine (albeit essentially pointless), but absolutely never again in a herd.

No one ever mentioned that the solid will be used as the first or the back up shot in Mike's case. There is however a case to have 3 or so on your belt should you need one. Shooting a Buff with a solid first up is moronic to say the least.

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Exactly..

You do things your way, I do things my way. I always have a hunter have a few solids on the belt. I have never had anyone fire a solid at a Buffalo, but if I need him to shoot his wounded Buff from behind, there is no soft that will penetrate to the vitals from a direct facing away shot.
As I said, I have never needed anyone to use a solid, but I will rather go into the situation with ALL tools I could possibly need.

 

[Mwag]

X2 on Aframes is all you need for Buffalo from 416.
I recovered both aframe bullets from last buffalo. Both traveled through 4+ ft of beast. They did expand to almost twice original diameter, and lost very little weight through process.

 

[Bert the Turtle]

You do things your way, I do things my way. I always have a hunter have a few solids on the belt. I have never had anyone fire a solid at a Buffalo, but if I need him to shoot his wounded Buff from behind, there is no soft that will penetrate to the vitals from a direct facing away shot.
As I said, I have never needed anyone to use a solid, but I will rather go into the situation with ALL tools I could possibly need.

I know having a solid for a Texas heart shot on a departing buffalo is standard advice but it seems to me that people haven’t really thought it through. If that scenario did come up, what do you suppose the odds are that you’ll recognize the need to switch to a solid, tell the client to switch, he will hear and register what you are saying, eject the soft in his chamber, correctly pull a solid off his belt, chamber said solid, properly aim, and execute the shot before the buffalo is out of range and/ or has changed direction? The effort for a client would be better spent learning to shoot a hip joint or base of the spine with the soft in his rifle.

If a PH decides to keep a solid in his rifle for such a scenario, he’s got the reverse problem of being prepared for a departing shot (when the buffalo is least dangerous and is becoming less of a threat with every step) and needing to switch to a soft for the more likely shots. If he has a double with two triggers and can choose a bullet to meet the present need, fine, but if you’ve never had the need to have someone use a solid, perhaps the risk of a mixup isn’t worth the unlikely benefit.

If the scenario you are planning for were shooting an inbound buffalo and you wanted a solid due to the concern that a soft wouldn’t penetrate to the brain, I may debate if that is correct or not, but at least in that scenario, a solid in the PHs rifle makes some sense if the game plan is that he is not going to shoot other than for directly inbound (or outbound, which based on your never had to have someone use a solid, is perhaps unlikely)


I’m all for being prepared and in fact had a separate ammo holder for solids on my belt as we were also on the lookout for elephant. The solids were kept on my non-dominant side in a covered holder while the softs were on my dominant side in and open-topped holder. Prepared, but unlikely to have a mixup.

Following my PH’s (bad) advice, I had my magazine loaded with solids. In the future, I will follow my own plan of having solids in a specific holder. If I have a departing buffalo stand still and upright after I’ve emptied my magazine of softs into his spine and hips, I won’t hesitate to chamber a solid and put on in his heart. Makes a lot more sense than dicking around taking a round out of the chamber while I’ve got a wounded buffalo to deal with and hoping he doesn’t decide that’s a good time to go on offense before I get a solid chambered.

Preparing for an unlikely scenario at the expense of increasing the risk of likely scenarios is, to use your word, moronic

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

I know having a solid for a Texas heart shot on a departing buffalo is standard advice but it seems to me that people haven’t really thought it through. If that scenario did come up, what do you suppose the odds are that you’ll recognize the need to switch to a solid, tell the client to switch, he will hear and register what you are saying, eject the soft in his chamber, correctly pull a solid off his belt, chamber said solid, properly aim, and execute the shot before the buffalo is out of range and/ or has changed direction? The effort for a client would be better spent learning to shoot a hip joint or base of the spine with the soft in his rifle.

If a PH decides to keep a solid in his rifle for such a scenario, he’s got the reverse problem of being prepared for a departing shot (when the buffalo is least dangerous and is becoming less of a threat with every step) and needing to switch to a soft for the more likely shots. If he has a double with two triggers and can choose a bullet to meet the present need, fine, but if you’ve never had the need to have someone use a solid, perhaps the risk of a mixup isn’t worth the unlikely benefit.

If the scenario you are planning for were shooting an inbound buffalo and you wanted a solid due to the concern that a soft wouldn’t penetrate to the brain, I may debate if that is correct or not, but at least in that scenario, a solid in the PHs rifle makes some sense if the game plan is that he is not going to shoot other than for directly inbound (or outbound, which based on your never had to have someone use a solid, is perhaps unlikely)


I’m all for being prepared and in fact had a separate ammo holder for solids on my belt as we were also on the lookout for elephant. The solids were kept on my non-dominant side in a covered holder while the softs were on my dominant side in and open-topped holder. If I had a departing buffalo stand still and upright after I’ve emptied my magazine into his spine and hips, I wouldn’t hesitate to chamber a solid and put on in his heart. Makes a lot more sense than dicking around taking a round out of the chamber while I’ve got a wounded buffalo to deal with and hoping he doesn’t decide that’s a good time to go on offense before I get a solid chambered.

Preparing for an unlikely scenario at the expense of increasing the risk of likely scenarios is, to use your word, moronic

My scenario where I would instruct my hunter to change over, is where the Buffalo is stationary in the thick stuff. Not departing. We will have time to switch to a solid after identifying that we are looking at the wounded individual.

The moronic statement was aimed at your PH instructing you to use solids as a first shot. Not aimed at you at all.
I don't even have my hunters load solids behind softs. First up, quality softs down the magazine all the way. There will be time to switch over, should we really need it. It is a very special situation, however minute of a chance, where the solids will be needed and for that reason, I do at least want 3 or so on my belt.

 

[Rule 303]

No one ever mentioned that the solid will be used as the first or the back up shot in Mike's case. There is however a case to have 3 or so on your belt should you need one. Shooting a Buff with a solid first up is moronic to say the least.

In your opinion and with your background I do respect that. However there are solids and there are solids. One of the Guides in the NT of Australia recommends nothing but Hydros for Water Buff. I used a Hydro -these are not conventional solids - for mine as he was in vines and a soft nose is more likely to deflect miss or wound if it hits a vine, the Hydro wont. The PH I was with used Hydros from his 458Lott on Buff for front on shots, that is when one is charging at them.

As I said the Hydro creates a wound channel greater than a conventional solid but not as great as a soft nose.

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

In your opinion and with your background I do respect that. However there are solids and there are solids. One of the Guides in the NT of Australia recommends nothing but Hydros for Water Buff. I used a Hydro -these are not conventional solids - for mine as he was in vines and a soft nose is more likely to deflect miss or wound if it hits a vine, the Hydro wont. The PH I was with used Hydros from his 458Lott on Buff for front on shots, that is when one is charging at them.

As I said the Hydro creates a wound channel greater than a conventional solid but not as great as a soft nose.

The Hydros is an interesting one for sure. I have heard these claims regarding the Hydros and not quite sure where I sit on them as an out and out solid. One of the Aussies here on the site are using them on an Elephant hunt with me next year. I've never had anyone use them on Elephant, but we got feedback from some very respected PH's who has and said that the Hydros got the job done.

 

[IvW]

Departing buffalo it is better to shoot at what you can see which is the spine just above the root of the tail or one of the hip bones. An expanding premium bullet will shatter this and anchor the bull. A solid up the arse will not reach the vitals most of the time.....where exactly do you aim to achieve that shot if the vitals could bot be hit with the initial shot?

I agree that if the buff is visible and the only shot is through brush and he is alone after being wounded you will have time to open the bolt load a solid and take the shot....
Other than that premiun expanders are the way to go....

With my 500 Jeff I do not need to switch to a solid to take any of the above mentioned shots.

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

I agree that if the buff is visible and the only shot is through brush and he is alone after being wounded you will have time to open the bolt load a solid and take the shot....
Other than that premiun expanders are the way to go....

I agree with everything you say, but when the above situation occurs, I want to have to option other than a soft.
Anything else, the Swift A Frames from my 500NE will deal with it.

 

[IvW]

I agree with everything you say, but when the above situation occurs, I want to have to option other than a soft.
Anything else, the Swift A Frames from my 500NE will deal with it.

And of course using a hammer in the .510 category makes a huge differance....

 

[Rule 303]

The Hydros is an interesting one for sure. I have heard these claims regarding the Hydros and not quite sure where I sit on them as an out and out solid. One of the Aussies here on the site are using them on an Elephant hunt with me next year. I've never had anyone use them on Elephant, but we got feedback from some very respected PH's who has and said that the Hydros got the job done.

I have taken 2 Elephants with them. Both brain shots. The last one went down that quick my PH said he had never seen an El. drop that quick. Mind you that could just be the exact shot placement in the brain as much as the bullet.