Best lead expanding mushroom bullet for Buffalo?

[375Fox]

Would any of you use the newer bonded Hornady DGX for Cape Buffalo if that was all that was available ?

Yes, but there is nearly always something else available if you look. Especially from custom loaders like Pendleton, Hendershots, Superior ammo. Practice with cheap stuff, then buy 3 boxes quality bullets for hunt. Bullet performance matters more than tiny groups on target on a buffalo hunt.

 

[Kynadog]

Would any of you use the newer bonded Hornady DGX for Cape Buffalo if that was all that was available ?

Yes, I would have no problem with a DGX if I couldn’t get an A-Frame or TBBC. Hornady addressed the problems with that bullet quite a while ago. It’s interesting how hard it has been for them to shake the bad connotations, though.

 

[375Fox]

Yes, I would have no problem with a DGX if I couldn’t get an A-Frame or TBBC. Hornady addressed the problems with that bullet quite a while ago. It’s interesting how hard it has been for them to shake the bad connotations, though.

They addressed the biggest problem by making a bonded bullet, but it’s still not in same class as Swift A Frame or TBBC. I’ll assume it’s a much cheaper bullet to produce so they stick with it rather than design a similar bullet to compete and give more reliable performance.

 

[Sika98k]

I used Woodleigh 300gr PPSN in my 375 H&H this year on 3 buffalo cows. Two of the cows died within yards of the bullet strike. The 3rd made it maybe 50 yards.

 

[michael458]

Does anybody have any experience using solid fluted bullets on DG? They claim they make larger wound cavities than expanding bullets and many people carry them in pistols for bear protection in the American west. Loaded in a rifle like a 458 win, I would imagine they would be quite potent.

Lehigh Defense Xtreme Penetrator 40 Cal, 10mm (400 Diameter) Bullets

The Xtreme Penetrator (XP) product line, for both handgun and rifles. The progressive nose geometry allows for deep, straight penetration while creating...

www.midwayusa.com

JD Jones gave Lehigh the idea for the Extremes. In 2007 JD and I were working on several different .500 caliber bullets, going through Lehigh to get them made. The first fluid moving Extreme was tested, and then later in 2007 I used it on several buffalo in Zimbabwe to good effect. The ones JD and I did were not nearly as extreme, and performed more as a limited penetration solid, similar to a non expanding North Fork CPS. They did cause more tissue damage than a normal solid, but not significantly more.

I will hand it to Lehigh, they took the bullet to the Extreme for sure, and it works. They did a tremendous job with this bullet and it indeed performs as stated. I have not used the current versions in the field, and if not retired, I most certainly would. It was mentioned that current Lehigh Extremes are too light....... Not so. Do not get caught up in SD with this type bullet, SD does not apply. You would never need a 500 gr 458 Extreme to do the job. Last fall I had a friend that was hunting elk and bison on the same hunt with 458 B&M. I helped him with 250 gr Socom Raptors from CEB for the elk..... But I could not get a 325 CEB Solid to match POI close enough at 50 yards. I helped him with a 250 Lehigh Extreme, that did shoot POI for the Bison. He used it on the bison, velocity was 2900 fps, bison was DRT on the spot, bullet exited.

Lehigh makes a 225, 250 and 325 Extreme in 458 caliber.......... Each one in my test work here shows that penetration here is all Buffalo Capable. I would use the 325 Lehigh Extreme for buffalo without question. These were tested in 458 Super Short.

They make a 350 gr and 420 gr in .500 caliber as well.........

Unfortunately no one has considered them in other calibers. They do work as advertised.

My sincere apology for taking the thread off course, it specifically says "Expanding" and this is not that. But since someone else asked..................

Now, to compare penetration above with absolute known "Expanding Buffalo Capable"........ FYI

Now these would absolutely qualify as "Expanding".................And are Buffalo capable, despite the weight..............

 

[DWB]

@michael458 it must have really pained you shooting that 375 bullet out of your 458

 

[Carnivore hunter]

JD Jones gave Lehigh the idea for the Extremes. In 2007 JD and I were working on several different .500 caliber bullets, going through Lehigh to get them made. The first fluid moving Extreme was tested, and then later in 2007 I used it on several buffalo in Zimbabwe to good effect. The ones JD and I did were not nearly as extreme, and performed more as a limited penetration solid, similar to a non expanding North Fork CPS. They did cause more tissue damage than a normal solid, but not significantly more.

View attachment 710779

View attachment 710780

I will hand it to Lehigh, they took the bullet to the Extreme for sure, and it works. They did a tremendous job with this bullet and it indeed performs as stated. I have not used the current versions in the field, and if not retired, I most certainly would. It was mentioned that current Lehigh Extremes are too light....... Not so. Do not get caught up in SD with this type bullet, SD does not apply. You would never need a 500 gr 458 Extreme to do the job. Last fall I had a friend that was hunting elk and bison on the same hunt with 458 B&M. I helped him with 250 gr Socom Raptors from CEB for the elk..... But I could not get a 325 CEB Solid to match POI close enough at 50 yards. I helped him with a 250 Lehigh Extreme, that did shoot POI for the Bison. He used it on the bison, velocity was 2900 fps, bison was DRT on the spot, bullet exited.

Lehigh makes a 225, 250 and 325 Extreme in 458 caliber.......... Each one in my test work here shows that penetration here is all Buffalo Capable. I would use the 325 Lehigh Extreme for buffalo without question. These were tested in 458 Super Short.

View attachment 710796

View attachment 710795

They make a 350 gr and 420 gr in .500 caliber as well.........

View attachment 710794

Unfortunately no one has considered them in other calibers. They do work as advertised.

My sincere apology for taking the thread off course, it specifically says "Expanding" and this is not that. But since someone else asked..................

Now, to compare penetration above with absolute known "Expanding Buffalo Capable"........ FYI

View attachment 710789

View attachment 710777

View attachment 710778

View attachment 710784

View attachment 710783

View attachment 710785

View attachment 710782

View attachment 710781

View attachment 710793

Now these would absolutely qualify as "Expanding".................And are Buffalo capable, despite the weight..............

View attachment 710792

View attachment 710788

View attachment 710787

View attachment 710786

View attachment 710790

View attachment 710791

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How does the Lehigh Defense flat-nosed solid perform? Buffalo Bore loads and sells them.

 

[michael458]

@michael458 it must have really pained you shooting that 375 bullet out of your 458

Hush your nasty mouth.............. That is WEIGHT........ Not Caliber....... But now that you mention it, just had to say that didn't you! Now I will have to make them 350s or something else..... Damn, you are right............. Phewwwww..............I think I am going to be sick now................. HEH HEH......

How does the Lehigh Defense flat-nosed solid perform? Buffalo Bore loads and sells them.

I have only tested the 380 FN Solids, and they are OK, not optimum, but ok. For 45/70 and such. Some of the others the meplat is way way too small to be stable. I can't remember just off hand, but I think there is a 450 or so .458 solid, and the meplat is tiny, I am sure it would not be stable. But I have not messed with them either. I have not kept up with the Lehigh solids, their knowledge base is a little short with those. Credit due however on the Extremes, someone at Lehigh did a number with those.

Again, apology for hi jack ..... I now see it is "Expanding Lead"........ But I did show a good many common conventionals........ Maybe I get forgiveness.

 

[Carnivore hunter]

Again, apology for hi jack ..... I now see it is "Expanding Lead"........ But I did show a good many common conventionals........ Maybe I get forgiveness.

Do you have a personal favorite expanding lead bullet for a broadside shot on cape buffalo?

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Do you have a personal favorite expanding lead bullet for a broadside shot on cape buffalo?

Why do you keep referring to only a broadside shot? Prepare yourself for any situation that might arrive.

 

[michael458]

Do you have a personal favorite expanding lead bullet for a broadside shot on cape buffalo?

Good Question. If I were to ever use another Conventional Premium Expanding Lead Core bullet it would Be the North Forks............. In .458 caliber I like the 450 gr Bullet. My test in the 458 B&M is a little slow for velocity, but is still within spec for buffalo. I could increase that to 2200-2225 fps easy. Penetration would increase by 1-2 inches in the test.

The velocity in this test is also a little low for 458 Lott........ same applies........

North Forks are a bit Non Conventional in one sense, the more velocity the deeper the penetration. Most all other Conventional Premium Expanding Lead core bullets are the opposite. The more velocity the less penetration.

 

[Luvthunt]

North Fork
Swift A Frame
TBBC

 

[Carnivore hunter]

Why do you keep referring to only a broadside shot? Prepare yourself for any situation that might arrive.

For the first shot on a buffalo, I personally don't believe in a frontal shot or quartering away shot and want to limit the odds of over-penetration so for me, the CEB Safari Raptors and TSX's are a no go for a first shot.

I would hope that the PH I'm with puts me in the best position with sticks to make a broadside shot. I'm not one to put myself, the PH or trackers in a dangerous position with bad angle shots and take unnecessary risks.

Having listened to different interviews by PH's and also Kevin Robertson and Tim Sundles with horror stories of bad angle shots and wounded buffalo, I don't want to make those mistakes.

Tim Sundles recommends for follow-up shots on running away/quartering away buffalo the Barnes TSX in at least 400gr.

I've thought about filling the entire magazine with North Fork SS to reduce the odds of any bullets penetrating completely through the buffalo.

 

[WAB]

Exact same point of impact in my rifle. You can mix them up and shoot sub 1” groups every time.

I should have finished that sentence ‘with my rifle’. There is no guarantee the POI will be the same in another rifle.

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

For the first shot on a buffalo, I personally don't believe in a frontal shot or quartering away shot and want to limit the odds of over-penetration so for me, the CEB Safari Raptors and TSX's are a no go for a first shot.

I would hope that the PH I'm with puts me in the best position with sticks to make a broadside shot. I'm not one to put myself, the PH or trackers in a dangerous position with bad angle shots and take unnecessary risks.

Having listened to different interviews by PH's and also Kevin Robertson and Tim Sundles with horror stories of bad angle shots and wounded buffalo, I don't want to make those mistakes.

Tim Sundles recommends for follow-up shots on running away/quartering away buffalo the Barnes TSX in at least 400gr.

I've thought about filling the entire magazine with North Fork SS to reduce the odds of any bullets penetrating completely through the buffalo.

Well, I can tell you that I would go as far as say that up to 80% of buff hunted are frontal/qaurtering on shots. I think in 20 years, I can count on one hand how many has been broadside shots.
Its not shopping. Train hard, battle easy.

 

[Rick HOlbert]

For Cape Buffalo for the first broadside shot, which lead expanding mushroom bullet has been the best for quickest kill with the least amount of tracking that does not require multiple follow up shots? Everything else being equal i.e. shot at 50 yards at most, caliber etc. I ask because I want to know how to limit or eliminate the chances of a wounded buffalo that runs off and needs to be pursued and tracked down which is extremely dangerous.

Your experiences with Cape Buffalo and lead expanding mushrooming bullets would be appreciated.

It seems from this website, the most popular lead expanding mushrooming bullets for cape buffalo below are...

North Fork Semi Spitz SS.
Swift A-Frame.
Federal Trophy Bonded Bear Claw (TBBC).

Nosler Partitions ? Some praise it's performance on cape buffalo like Ray Atkinson while others do not.

Kevin Robertson highly recommends for the 416 Rigby/Remington the North Fork SS in 430gr and says it's devastating and more effective than the 400gr with it's larger diameter and larger wound channel.

Personally my first choice would be the Swift A-Frames followed by the North Fork Protected Point. The Federal TBBC's are great bullets also. I would also look at the Woodleigh bonded softs as they are now available in the US and have a great reputation for holding together. As good a bullet as the Nosler Partition is, for me, not on buffalo. On bullets, don't skimp. They are the cheapest part of your gear and your life could hinge on how they preform. that's a tough animal and a rare occasion to scotch him with a single shot and have him drop on the spot.

 

[skydiver386]

JD Jones gave Lehigh the idea for the Extremes. In 2007 JD and I were working on several different .500 caliber bullets, going through Lehigh to get them made. The first fluid moving Extreme was tested, and then later in 2007 I used it on several buffalo in Zimbabwe to good effect. The ones JD and I did were not nearly as extreme, and performed more as a limited penetration solid, similar to a non expanding North Fork CPS. They did cause more tissue damage than a normal solid, but not significantly more.

View attachment 710779

View attachment 710780

I will hand it to Lehigh, they took the bullet to the Extreme for sure, and it works. They did a tremendous job with this bullet and it indeed performs as stated. I have not used the current versions in the field, and if not retired, I most certainly would. It was mentioned that current Lehigh Extremes are too light....... Not so. Do not get caught up in SD with this type bullet, SD does not apply. You would never need a 500 gr 458 Extreme to do the job. Last fall I had a friend that was hunting elk and bison on the same hunt with 458 B&M. I helped him with 250 gr Socom Raptors from CEB for the elk..... But I could not get a 325 CEB Solid to match POI close enough at 50 yards. I helped him with a 250 Lehigh Extreme, that did shoot POI for the Bison. He used it on the bison, velocity was 2900 fps, bison was DRT on the spot, bullet exited.

Lehigh makes a 225, 250 and 325 Extreme in 458 caliber.......... Each one in my test work here shows that penetration here is all Buffalo Capable. I would use the 325 Lehigh Extreme for buffalo without question. These were tested in 458 Super Short.

View attachment 710796

View attachment 710795

They make a 350 gr and 420 gr in .500 caliber as well.........

View attachment 710794

Unfortunately no one has considered them in other calibers. They do work as advertised.

My sincere apology for taking the thread off course, it specifically says "Expanding" and this is not that. But since someone else asked..................

Now, to compare penetration above with absolute known "Expanding Buffalo Capable"........ FYI

View attachment 710789

View attachment 710777

View attachment 710778

View attachment 710784

View attachment 710783

View attachment 710785

View attachment 710782

View attachment 710781

View attachment 710793

Now these would absolutely qualify as "Expanding".................And are Buffalo capable, despite the weight..............

View attachment 710792

View attachment 710788

View attachment 710787

View attachment 710786

View attachment 710790

View attachment 710791

View attachment 710775

View attachment 710776

Michael, until I read your post, using a 300gr .458 bullet on Buff would have never occurred to me. In calibers like my 450 Rigby, velocity with a 300gr bullet could be pushed well over 2500fps, and for me, this is uncharted territory.

For most of us, including the OP, using what others have had success with over the years only makes sense. Are the Raptors in their present configuration something you would advise trying, or do you think they need more development before hand loaders should try them in the field?

I'd feel comfortable trying a 400gr .458 Raptor at 2400fps on a Buff, but a 300gr I'd have to see before I had faith in it.

 

[DrHirsch]

Woodlleigh or Degol

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Personally my first choice would be the Swift A-Frames followed by the North Fork Protected Point. The Federal TBBC's are great bullets also. I would also look at the Woodleigh bonded softs as they are now available in the US and have a great reputation for holding together. As good a bullet as the Nosler Partition is, for me, not on buffalo. On bullets, don't skimp. They are the cheapest part of your gear and your life could hinge on how they preform. that's a tough animal and a rare occasion to scotch him with a single shot and have him drop on the spot.

The North Fork PP (I think it's actually Percussion Point) would probably be fine too on a buffalo. That said, the PP is intended for more rapid expansion, for primary use in the big cats. The SS version of the bullet for its less rapid expansion would be a better choice for buffalo.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Yes, I would have no problem with a DGX if I couldn’t get an A-Frame or TBBC. Hornady addressed the problems with that bullet quite a while ago. It’s interesting how hard it has been for them to shake the bad connotations, though.

The DGX bonded bullet attempts to address the issue and it seems to have done that. However it was only after a butt load of field failures were reported. Furthermore, my understanding is Mr. Hornady made some statement to the effect of the original DGX didn't need improvement, they only made the change to pacify us hunters. That comes across quite arrogant to me and I'm guessing many others.

I'll stick with North Forks primarily and occasionally A-Frames.