6.5 Creedmoor for hunting

[Tradmark]

Fusions, accubond, scirocco, lrx and best yet terminal ascents just need to go thru the vitals to kill as long as they expand. I always found it interesting how many deer ive seen killed with a 44 mag at over 50 yards and sometimes the load did t have 1000fps out of the muzzle. The deer that i have killed with a glock 20 didnt read the sign that getting hit with less than 500fpe shouldnt have killed them. Do the rules on energy only apply to rifles?

 

[375Fox]

Fusions, accubond, scirocco, lrx and best yet terminal ascents just need to go thru the vitals to kill as long as they expand. I always found it interesting how many deer ive seen killed with a 44 mag at over 50 yards and sometimes the load did t have 1000fps out of the muzzle. The deer that i have killed with a glock 20 didnt read the sign that getting hit with less than 500fpe shouldnt have killed them. Do the rules on energy only apply to rifles?

Penetration through vitals is what ultimately kills, but you shoot an animal with a FMJ vs an expanding bullet same cartridge which do you think dies faster and more ethically? A FMJ transfers much less energy into an animal and makes a much smaller wound channel. An expanding bullet transfers a lot more energy and makes a much larger wound channel. Energy is a factor in making an ethical kill with a firearm to me.

 

[Jeff505]

I am trying to formulate an answer that is not skewed in either direction, I can’t. If I was going to hunt and shoot game at hundreds of yards beyond what I would consider sporting than a 6.5 creedmore would be considered an optimal round. To me hunting is getting as close as possible for an ethical shot. I am not discounting the round just the thought process. Those who have a physical aversion to recoil might consider this round a limb saver. To those that are capable, enjoy the recoil as the lethal dose on the other end is more humane. I will now back away as this all important debate may continue.

 

[Doug3006]

I’ve often wondered why the Creedmore gets so much hate. Within 500 yards, it offers no advantage whatsoever versus a ton of other calibers, but that’s no reason to hate. There are dozens of cartridges that will reliably kill deer sized game within 500 yards. I don’t recall any garnering the hate that the 6.5 CM gets. Heck, we have duplicates of duplicates in the cartridge world.

Strangely, I think the hate is entirely due to the only real advantage of the long for caliber CM bullets…..their accuracy at long distance. The old hunting vs shooting debate.

So if you want to hunt with a CM, you should. It’ll do what you want at reasonable distances. Maybe at unreasonable distances too.

 

[Tradmark]

Penetration through vitals is what ultimately kills, but you shoot an animal with a FMJ vs an expanding bullet same cartridge which do you think dies faster and more ethically? A FMJ transfers much less energy into an animal and makes a much smaller wound channel. An expanding bullet transfers a lot more energy and makes a much larger wound channel. Energy is a factor in making an ethical kill with a firearm to me.

 

[Tradmark]

Yeah not much i posted about solids but i get it. If its enough to expand as is every example i gave itll kill the animal pretty handily with less than 1000fpe hence the 44 mag reference.

 

[Mauser78]

I am trying to formulate an answer that is not skewed in either direction, I can’t. If I was going to hunt and shoot game at hundreds of yards beyond what I would consider sporting than a 6.5 creedmore would be considered an optimal round. To me hunting is getting as close as possible for an ethical shot. I am not discounting the round just the thought process. Those who have a physical aversion to recoil might consider this round a limb saver. To those that are capable, enjoy the recoil as the lethal dose on the other end is more humane. I will now back away as this all important debate may continue.

I understand what you say, and i felt the same and did not do this type of hunting for 46 years, and for 5 years even though it was my only option. It is different i know, and that is why I havent shot past 200 yards in the past. For this type of hunting the equipment supports the shots, from chairs, to calibers suitable, high power scopes, open turrets, rangefinders ext. you have time to range ext, but getting closer is not an option. Sometimes it is 50 yards, sometimes 300 plus.

 

[Major Bonkers]

 

[Major Bonkers]

 

[AZDAVE]

The question has been posed several times on how did the creedmoore win the 6.5 popular caliber. It boils down to logistics, when Hornady released it with all the marketing hype they also supported it with rounds and bullets,brass. In a time when you just couldn’t get 6,5x55/54, 260 rem, 264 WM etc. but could buy 6.5 creedmoore everywhere.

It is a very good target round to about 1200 yards. With appropriate bullets as good as the other 6.5’s on antelope and deer, bleskok and smaller African game..

Just remember that logistics wins battles.

 

[Philip Glass]

I generally agree. However, that damage, like the projectile and what launched it, can be proportional to the animal and still very lethal. Like @Philip Glass, on almost any deer sized game I would much rather have a .30 inch hole going and .31 inch hole leaving from a tough heavy bullet through what matters than an explosive exit wound. Animals die just as quickly with a lot less destruction of meat or pelt. Such a bullet also causes significantly more tissue damage than any arrow (yes, I use to hunt fairly extensively with a bow).

I have used a 6.5 on a lot of European game in the form of 6.5x57 and 6.5x57R. The traditional heavy for caliber 154 gr loads in those drill pencil size entrance wounds and slightly larger than pencil size exit wounds on roe deer in Europe and whitetail in this country. The load is extremely lethal, and causes minimum destructive tissue damage to what does not matter.

Most recently in Zambia, I used my .275 with a traditional heavy for caliber 170 gr load for everything from bushbuck to a sable. That load, in this case Oryx, performs exactly the same.

What I find of zero interest to me, at least with respect to game, are fast light for caliber loads. They are needlessly destructive, too often do not exit, and have a far higher potential for not penetrating sufficiently. So yes, the Creedmoor can be a fine choice - with the right load.

A side note that comes to mind is the possibility of lead in the meat. These bullets that come apart can create this scenario. With the lead ammo bans we've been fighting (SCI) the government over it makes it hard to make the case. I was told by some SCI friends from Michigan that they have to X-ray carcasses to be donated to charity due to this issue. Just a thought.

 

[WAB]

To be clear, my issue with the Creedmore is not that there is anything wrong with it, it's that as a target rifle (with high BC, lighter weight bullets) it's not suitable for hunting, and as a hunting rifle with the higher weight bullets, it doesn't do anything a 6.5X55 doesn't do. So I can't wrap my mind around the marketing hype. It just strikes me as a nasty, flash, gimcrack thing that I don't need.

Full disclosure: my whitetail rifle is a 6.5X54. Now, as much as I love that rifle, it has its limitations. The 160 grain bullet is effective (on a lot of things) but its blunt nose not only means it drops quickly, but also loses velocity quickly. I "know" intellectually it can be effective on any of the Hochwild I hunted in Europe, but it does not meet the game laws in places like Germany or Poland that need 2,000 joules at 100 meters. The 140 grain bullets have a higher BC, and will do that, but I just haven't played with them enough. I'm playing with the 156 grain Oryx "just to see what I can do with it".

Honestly, I am not that recoil sensitive, so I rely on my .30-06 for most of the things the Creedmore can do. I mean, they were shooting 1,000 yard matches at Camp Perry with the '06 way before anyone thought of a Creedmore, and if that means I have to think a little more about elevation changes on the scope before firing, well, I'm not going to hunt at 1,000 yards, so why worry? Maximum Point Blank Range is a thing. As the guy said in Fast Times at Ridgemont High: "Learn it. Know it. Live it."

I've often said my ammunition choices include the .45 ACP (1911), 9X19 mm (1908), .30-06 (1906), 6.5X54 (1903) 9.5X57 (1910), and I'm starting to play with 7X57 (1892). I'm starting to consider a .300 H&H, but I'm really not sure I'm ready for anything as modern as 1925. If I'm going to get on the belted magnum bandwagon, maybe I should start with a .275 H&H Magnum first.

There's old school class for you: a traveller rifle with a .275 H&H for deerstalking, and a .375 barrel for everything else in the world. One receiver, two barrels. I need to look into that. But I think only Hawk Bullets and Woodleigh would make the appropriate .287" bullet. Maybe I'll just neck it down to .284" and call it good.

My eyes were opened at a recent long range shooting school that @cbvanb and I attended. The school guns were Barbour Creed 6.5 Creedmore

That's not what I said. What I said was: "as a target rifle (with high BC, lighter weight bullets) it's not suitable for hunting, and as a hunting rifle with the higher weight bullets, it doesn't do anything a 6.5X55 doesn't do."

In other words, THIS bullet is not suitable for hunting:

6.5 Creedmoor 120 gr ELD® Match - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

This bullet is a 129 grain bullet, and yes, it's suitable for whitetail:

6.5 Creedmoor 129 gr. InterLock® American Whitetail® - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

For those who do not want to click on the link, it's a 129 grain pill leaving the muzzle at 2820 fps, and still moving at 2232 fps at 300 yards.

Hornady doesn't sell a 140 grain Creedmore, except as a custom. I'm picking on Hornady to keep things comparable.

THIS bullet https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/rifle/6-5-x-55-swedish-mauser-140-gr-sst-superformance#!/
Leaves the muzzle at 2735 fps, and is moving at 2237 at 300 yards.

I do not own a creedmoor, but I shot one extensively from 500 to 1550 at Barbour Creek shooting school. If I were looking to hunt with one, I would use the 143 gr Norma Bondstrike ammo. It retains killing energy for mid sized game well beyond the capability of 99% of hunters.

 

[Hogpatrol]

A side note that comes to mind is the possibility of lead in the meat. These bullets that come apart can create this scenario. With the lead ammo bans we've been fighting (SCI) the government over it makes it hard to make the case. I was told by some SCI friends from Michigan that they have to X-ray carcasses to be donated to charity due to this issue. Just a thought.

You haven't lived until you bite down on a piece of lead shot left over from the pheasant your father shot. I can still remember the clink sound as it dropped from my mouth on to the plate.

 

[Hogpatrol]

My 2¢ on the 6.5 CM. It's heavily supported. I hunted Africa numerous times with a 6.5x47 Lapua. Try getting good, accurate ammo for that cartridge or any of the others like the Swede, 260 Remington, etc. Hornady, formerly a bullet company, did it right, developed the cartridge, supplied loaded ammo, marketed it and kept improving on it. This year, I hunted with my PHs BIL, a young man, and he used a 6 CM.

 

[SaintPanzer]

It retains killing energy for mid sized game well beyond the capability of 99% of hunters.

I'm hunting, not sniping. Get closer.

I'm not by any means a "long range shooter". I really have no interest in it. But, once, if I remember well, I could hit a man sized target using iron sights with a bone stock .223.

And I guess that's the point. I never said it's not capable, for anything. I said as a hunting round, it doesn't do anything other hunting rounds do.

It's kind of like a meme I once saw.

 

[WAB]

I'm hunting, not sniping. Get closer.

I'm not by any means a "long range shooter". I really have no interest in it. But, once, if I remember well, I could hit a man sized target using iron sights with a bone stock .223.

And I guess that's the point. I never said it's not capable, for anything. I said as a hunting round, it doesn't do anything other hunting rounds do.

It's kind of like a meme I once saw. View attachment 687476

Like I said, I don’t own one. If I did, I would use the norma bullet I mentioned.

I don’t get all the animas toward the cartridge. It has gotten a lot of folks into shooting, which can’t be a bad thing.

 

[Cowboy777]

I have a 16” barrel and shoot a 143eldx. It’s taken everything with ease, 1 shot: whitetail, impala, lechwe, baboon, warthog, jackal, all these at 200 yards or in. Blesbuck at 336 and a golden wildebeest at 416 yards

 

[CZDiesel]

The question has been posed several times on how did the creedmoore win the 6.5 popular caliber. It boils down to logistics, when Hornady released it with all the marketing hype they also supported it with rounds and bullets,brass. In a time when you just couldn’t get 6,5x55/54, 260 rem, 264 WM etc. but could buy 6.5 creedmoore everywhere.

It is a very good target round to about 1200 yards. With appropriate bullets as good as the other 6.5’s on antelope and deer, bleskok and smaller African game..

Just remember that logistics wins battles.

Naaaaa It’s just a cartridge those that haven’t hit puberty

My eyes were opened at a recent long range shooting school that @cbvanb and I attended. The school guns were Barbour Creed 6.5 Creedmore

I do not own a creedmoor, but I shot one extensively from 500 to 1550 at Barbour Creek shooting school. If I were looking to hunt with one, I would use the 143 gr Norma Bondstrike ammo. It retains killing energy for mid sized game well beyond the capability of 99% of hunters.

That 143gr Bondstrike is what I have for the 264WinMag…

 

[Tradmark]

Though i do mostly hunt with a 6.5/300 and its pretty wicked. Roght bullets and load and its >60 inches flatter to 1000 with less wind drift than the 7prc with a crappy hunting bullet

 

[CZDiesel]

Though i do mostly hunt with a 6.5/300 and its pretty wicked. Roght bullets and load and its >60 inches flatter to 1000 with less wind drift than the 7prc with a crappy hunting bullet

Preach brother!!! With a 34mm scope tube anyone can fling just about any round out to long distances but your 6.5/300 and my 264WinMag are actual long range cartridges!