Creating a 9.3x62 do it all

[HWL]

"the 9.3x62 to do it all" is the one that has been rechambered to 9.3x64, and uses bullets up to the job.
bruce.

And now, the 9,3x64 Brenneke is the "...do it all" rifle?

"Für alles Wild der Erde/for all game of this planet" was the first advertising of the cartridge....

HWL

 

[HWL]

...have an new candidate for the "do it all rifle",.... a Mannlicher-Schoenauer GK in 9,3x62, Long Tom 65 cm barrel.

Just need a scope,... a 2,5-10x52 Zeiss and a red dot are in my Focus.

HWL

 

[Scrumbag]

...have an new candidate for the "do it all rifle",.... a Mannlicher-Schoenauer GK in 9,3x62, Long Tom 65 cm barrel.

Just need a scope,... a 2,5-10x52 Zeiss and a red dot are in my Focus.

HWL

That sounds a good set up!

 

[Scrumbag]

FWIW for future reference Optics Trade has some two piece Picantinny style scope bases for some rifles. I considered some for Zastava M70 but purchased a one piece for the additional ring position options. Shipping to the USA was about 2 weeks for $10 times & prices in Europe should be better (I think?).

https://www.optics-trade.eu/us/mounts/fixed-mounts/bases/shopby/suitable_for_z-zastava_m70.html

Thanks Mr Zorg. I think I will leave it as it is for now but useful to know about.

Scrummy

 

[MS 9x56]

It went last year and did not disappoint!

WhAt bullets did you use in Africa?

 

[MS 9x56]

...have an new candidate for the "do it all rifle",.... a Mannlicher-Schoenauer GK in 9,3x62, Long Tom 65 cm barrel.

Just need a scope,... a 2,5-10x52 Zeiss and a red dot are in my Focus.

HWL

Now that is a classic rifle in a classic caliber. For European game I would think Norma Oryx bullets in either 232 grain or 286 grain . I have had great luck with them on American deer and wild boar. Enjoy your new rifle and hunt well. Waldmeinshiel

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

...have an new candidate for the "do it all rifle",.... a Mannlicher-Schoenauer GK in 9,3x62, Long Tom 65 cm barrel.

Just need a scope,... a 2,5-10x52 Zeiss and a red dot are in my Focus.

HWL

From the 1954 Stoeger Catalog (US):

From 1960, for those who did not care for the MC or MCA stocks:

 

[Mr. Zorg]

I've seen a few Zastava 20" / 510mm barrel full stock (Mannlicher style, stutzen) carbines for sale on Gunbroker.com over the past 2 years in 375 H&H Magnum, but not 9.3X62mm. A determined individual could get one ordered. That Zastava stock is either Monte Carlo style or straight - is that MCA stock sometimes referred to as American Style? - but not "Pig Back" Continental Style on the 20" barreled examples and obviously less sophisticated.

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

That Zastava stock is either Monte Carlo style or straight - is that MCA stock sometimes referred to as American Style? - but not "Pig Back" Continental Style on the 20" barreled examples and obviously less sophisticated.

If you're referring to the Mannlicher Schoenauer MCA stocks, yes. The Monte Carlo was introduced with the M1956 models and the MCA shortly afterward. The idea was that the MC was for scope use exclusively and the MCA, referred to as 'Monte Carlo All Purpose' or 'Monte Carlo Amerikanisch' depending on catalog origin, would allow use of scope or iron sighting. Stoeger advised their buyers who preferred the traditional stock to order the "GK Model 1952 stock", known in Europe as gerader kolben (straight shaft).

From the 1962 Stoeger:

Detail from 1964 Stoeger:

 

[HWL]

Now that is a classic rifle in a classic caliber. For European game I would think Norma Oryx bullets in either 232 grain or 286 grain . I have had great luck with them on American deer and wild boar. Enjoy your new rifle and hunt well. Waldmeinshiel

You are right for European game and American deer and boar.

But to create the "9,3x62 do it ALL rifle", it should be feed with a heavy for caliber bullet also.

I am thinking about the 293 gr Brenneke TUG, the 320 gr Woodleigh Soft Point Round Nose, or even the 325 Norma Oryx.

Properly loaded, the heavy 9,3s from a 65cm barrel should push the cartridge to its limits.

Waidmannsheil

HWL

 

[HWL]

Stoeger advised their buyers who preferred the traditional stock to order the "GK Model 1952 stock", known in Europe as gerader kolben (straight shaft).

Sorry, you are wrong with your "GK" interpretation.

"GK" does not describe any stock design.

"GK" means "gekrümmter Kammerstaengel", curved bolt handle...... witch was an innovation in 1952.

Later on, for differentiation they also stamped "NO", means "normal(er)" or "gerader" Kammerstaengel, straight bolt handle.

Ironically, when the magnums appeared in 1956, 6,5x68, 8x68S and so on, they had a straight bolt handle and they designated it "GK" also!

The Magnums were easer to operate with the straigth bolt handle.

Meanwhile, the phrase "GK" had become a symbol of innovative design and sold well.

So they sold their straight handled magnums as "GK" too.

To complicate all this, at time, Steyr designated its rifles with year of introduction, stock shape and shape of bolt handle.

Don't be confused....

...and sorry for hijacking the thread.




HWL

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

Sorry, you are wrong with your "GK" interpretation.

"GK" does not describe any stock design.

"GK" means "gekrümmter Kammerstaengel", curved bolt handle...... witch was an innovation in 1952.

Later on, for differentiation they also stamped "NO", means "normal(er)" or "gerader" Kammerstaengel, straight bolt handle.

HWL

The information I have comes from several sources, including member Kuduae (Axel Eichendorff), who has written several times that GK = gerader kolben and indicates the straight shaft (stock) as opposed to MC or MCA.

Here is a post of his to another 'site from last February:
The model GK was merely a stock and finish shape of the post-1952 Mannlicher – Schoenauer, made to European tastes. GKs share all the metal work with the "American" models MC and MCA, though the bolts are blued on GKs, polished bright on the others. Late versions of all three "models" have wimpy, sheet metal tang safeties instead of the earlier side safeties. IMHO "GK" stnds for Gerader Kolben = straight buttstock. This stock shape is the distinguishing feature of the GK. Model GK rifles in 7x64 are now the most often encountered Mannlicher – Schoenauers here in Germany. The GK designation is so common here that Germans often call any old split bridge, true Mannlicher-Schoenauer a "GK" to distinguish it from earlier and later Steyr products. The MC and MCA stock variations were not even offered in Germany.
The model NO is quite confusing. Apparently Steyr called all sorts of special order, not catalogued versions NO. So NOs come in many different configurations, some with straight bolt handles when bent ones were standard, some with bent ones.

The thread:

Kuduae in 2014:
Yes, it's a GK, gerader Kolben = straight buttstock, with blued bolt. Should be marked "Modell GK / 7x64" on the receiver ring. The most common Mannlicher-Schoenauer version and chambering found in Germany.

And this one, from the same thread:
Quote:
Kuduae, where the M-S model name NO comes ? I read somewhere that GK means "gebogene kammerstengel" i.e. bent bolt handle. I´m not sure if that version is correct but it sounds rational.


The other post-1952 M-S standard catalog models were named for their buttstock shape: MC = Monte Carlo, MCA = Monte Carlo Amerikanisch. These models had the same bent bolt handles too. So there is no logic in naming the GK for the bent bolt handle instead of the stock shape like the other contemporary catalog models.
I don't know what the meaning of "Modell NO" is, maybe "nicht ordinär". I have seen several NO marked Mannlicher-Schoenauers, all post-1952. The only thing they have in common: Their configurations are listed in no Steyr catalog. Some examples: One is a late post-52 action with secondary sliding tang safety, 24" rifle length barrel in 9.3x62, buttstock like a GK, but full stocked to the muzzle like a Stutzen.

Also, I realize Stoeger is an American catalog, but:

This is from the Mannlicher Collectors Assn: https://www.mannlicher.org/mannlicher-characteristics.html
Throughout the MCA production run, European "NO" models with straight handled blue bolts and "GK" style stocks were produced in assorted metric calibers (6.5x55, 6.5x57, 7X64, 8x57, 9.3x62) and some US calibers. The NO may also have been available in the MC serial number series.

I'm not quick to 'second guess' Kuduae, but I am finding where others have opined that GK indicates a swept bolt handle. Perhaps we should, indeed, start a thread on this and chase down a conclusive answer?
Does anyone here have 1950s era Steyr literature to compare?

 

[HWL]

The information I have comes from several sources, including member Kuduae (Axel Eichendorff), who has written several times that GK = gerader kolben and indicates the straight shaft (stock) as opposed to MC or MCA.

Sorry, Brian, you are still wrong.

Sometimes even wiki is helpfull.

At he first picture you will see, they explain GK as "gekrümmter Kammerstengel".

And further below, they explain the "GK-gekrümmeter Kammerstengel" was offered with straigth stock and later on with monte carlo stock also!

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mannlicher-Sch%C3%B6nauer

At the time, when the "GK" appeared first, all Schönauer stocks were straight, and so, there was no need to designate a model "Straight Stock - gerader Kolben"!!!

MC and MCA appeared years later!

In every reliable European source, where they talk about the Mannlicher-Schoenauer, you will find GK = gekrümmter Kammerstengel.

And for thouse who still do not believe, call the Stey Company in Austria, witch I did.

They will tell you: ....... "gerader Kolben" is fake news.....


...sorry

HWL

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

At the time, when the "GK" appeared first, all Schönauer stocks were straight, and so, there was no need to designate a model "Straight Stock - gerader Kolben"!!!

MC and MCA appeared years later!

In every reliable European source, where they talk about the Mannlicher-Schoenauer, you will find GK = gekrümmter Kammerstengel.

HWL

Were they designated 'GK' in European catalog listings and / or Steyr literature prior to 1956?

 

[HWL]

Were they designated 'GK' in European catalog listings and / or Steyr literature prior to 1956?

I do not have a catalog from between 1952 and 1956, but I have some rifles, I can check the reality, delivered to the customer.

There is an Model 1950, that has features from the Model 1952, and I have a Model 1952, that has features from the GK.

It seems to be, that improvements were put into production as soon and as fast as possible.

In the 50's, the US was the most important market for Steyr and they produced, whatever Stoeger ordered.

.458, .338, .358 .308 .264 are examples.

The saying goes...., the M1950 had a very slim and filigree stock, made for a light rifle to hunt the Austrian montains.

This stock often was brocken, especially in the rough hands of American soldiers in Europe.

Instead of "Mannlicher-Schoenauer", it quickly it earned its nickname "Mannlicher-Schaftbruch" (Mannlicher-Stock break).

Stoeger spoke a word of power, and the stock of the M1952 was made much more durable.

Sorry for capturing the thread again.

My "Do it all 9,3x62 MS", stock finished and new blueing, waiting vor a new scope.

HWL

 

[BobT]

What a beauty!

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

I do not have a catalog from between 1952 and 1956, but I have some rifles, I can check the reality, delivered to the customer.

There is an Model 1950, that has features from the Model 1952, and I have a Model 1952, that has features from the GK.

It seems to be, that improvements were put into production as soon and as fast as possible.

In the 50's, the US was the most important market for Steyr and they produced, whatever Stoeger ordered.

HWL

That's a very impressive lineup!

Stoeger did not mention the designation 'GK' until 1956, and then only to differentiate the stock shape from that of the MC and MCA, advising customers that they could also be ordered with the "GK-Model 1952 Stock". Stoeger had also, however, not used the original MS designations of M1903, M1905, M1908, M1910, M1924 during the pre WW2 period.

What is the proof date on your earliest MS with 'GK' marked receiver?

 

[HWL]

When I am back home, I will check this.... but we are wrong here.

We should have a MS thread.

HWL