Ammunition company will not sell to people that voted for Biden

Cam Moon

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I find this all very interesting. Let me tell you how it is here in Canada. We have three different classifications of firearms. We have prohibited, restricted, and non-restricted.

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In order for us to own a firearm of any kind we need to take a safety course and get a Possession Acquisition License (PAL) If we want to own a restricted firearm we need to take a separate course dedicated to restricted firearms. Once the course(s) is/are completed and we have passed the exam we can apply for a PAL. Here we must fill out information going back 5 years. We are asked not only about being convicted and having a criminal record, but also if we were ever even charged, accused etc. We also have to answer questions regarding our mental Health and treatments if applicable. Hell, we even have to answer whether or not we have been divorced (or dissolved a similar relationship ie: broke up with girlfriend), if we've been fired or lost our employment, if any family members have been charged, accused, or convicted of any crime, etc... We need to provide character witnesses and references. We have to provide contact information for our ex spouse, etc. The list goes on. They do a full and complete background check. Then, there is a minimum 1 month waiting period before they will even start to look into processing anything.
Months later, after a thorough background check and investigation, if all of your information is verified correctly you will receive your PAL. We need this even to purchase ammunition.
ALL firearms must be locked and stored properly when not in use. Ammunition must not be readily available (locked/stored separately) They must also be locked during transport.

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The only place we can use a restricted firearm is at an approved and licensed facility (firing range) and the firearm(s) must be taken directly there and back, following all safe storage and transportation regulations, and then locked back up at home. We cannot use a restricted firearm such as a handgun or an AR-15 anywhere else. The maximum amount of rounds a centerfire rifle can hold in Canada is five. Anyone who has a PAL is also subject to daily checks by police to see if they have been charged with anything or are under investigation. If one own's a restricted firearm, the police do not even need a warrant to enter your home, with or without your presence, consent, or knowledge. By law they are even allowed to damage your personal belongings (without compensation) if they are searching for a firearm.
And even with all of this, they are cracking down even more. They are now BANNING anything that has a military style look to it. They have a barrel bore limit, an energy limit, etc. Our prime minister closed down Parliament (said it was because of covid) and then, without anyone there to be able to oppose him, he banned over 1,500 "military style" firearms through an order in council. And this list grows bigger every day.
I don't really have any issues with laws that actually protect innocent people, even if it makes things a little inconvenient for me. But I truly cannot for the life of me understand how these new laws are going to save any lives whatsoever. And now the idiot has decided to reduce mandatory sentencing for gun smugglers, violent offenders, and even repeat offenders who have used firearms to commit a crime or to hurt others. This makes absolutely no sense to me, and because I cannot fathom how it will make our country any safer I have to conclude that it is one more step that our government is taking to disarm its citizens. I fear the same thing maybe happening south of the border in the neighboring United States of America. I totally understand those of you who would like to see a change in policy to make your country a safer place to live. But I do caution you to make sure that you gather all the information you can and make sure that you truly feel that is the true motivation behind the actions being taken. If it's not truly making any difference as far as making your country safer, reducing crime, and getting criminals off the streets, then what is the REAL purpose? And I urge you to put an awful lot of thought into this, because it is not something that will be easily undone.
 
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1dirthawker

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This is my last post in this thread so it can wind down. Regarding this site, it is a hunting forum not a US 2nd amendment, defense, or tactical forum. I enjoy talking about african hunting and hunting firearms; it seems I am in the right place here.

I agree, that you are in the right place re: this site. this site is here to discuss africa hunting and fire arms. (and THOSE fire arms could be affected as well) full metal jacket bullets ARE armor or body armor piercing ammunition.

i am a little surprised that you were unable to come up with a real solution for actually curbing criminal use of firearms, one that i could stand beside you and agree on.

i am not surprised that you decided to not address several real concerns i had listed above on only a few of the very real concerns of all gun owners.

the OP started with a funny but true story of an ammo company that did not want to sell its goods to individuals that support a political agenda (aka voted for Biden) that wants to remove their access to said goods (ammo). an ironic story, especially for some to then say that constricting our second amendment rights is a good or appropriate idea.
 

Newboomer

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A few observations:
1. Gun control laws have never worked, don't now and never will. If they did why is the crime and murder rate so high in places with the most restrictions and so low in places with little or no restriction? They restrict only the honest citizen who tries to abide by such assininity.
2. High capacity mags. Because many courses of fire in competition require more than 10 rounds. Sometimes more rounds are necessary in a firefight and reloading may not be possible.
3. Gun free zones are a beacon for evildoers because they know their quarry is helpless and they are safe from retaliation.
4. Background checks are ineffective and only inconvenience the honest citizen. The idiocy of having every firearm sale go through an FFL dealer is impossible to enforce. How can sales between two private parties be monitored? Someone bent on criminal activity can still pass a check and go about his evil intentions. If he can't pass, there is always the black market.
5. The debacle at Congress was not instigated by the President. He tried to defuse it. It was an inside job. Security at the Capitol is impenetrable. There have been numerous attempts over the years, all of which failed. Someone let the rioters in and a good number of the rioters were blm and antifa among others.
6. The election fraud. How could the judicial system, which is supposed to be fair and unbiased, condone such activity which is in direct conflict with election law? I wonder what the payoff was for the judges. Or were they afraid of retaliation from the left?
7. It leaves a real negative opinion of someone who postulates one thing and then does just the opposite--self proclaimed hunters and gun owners who vote for those who are bent on destroying our freedoms and way of life.

These are a few that come to mind right now. However, it sickens me when I read some of the ludicrous fantasies that some members spit out.
 

Rocco490

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This thread really shouldn't cause so much division among fellow hunters and firearm owners. The post was of an ammunition company whose business is ONLINE AMMUNITION SALES and the current administration has said specifically it intends to BAN the sales of ammunition and firearms online. There business and very livelihood is at stake. That must be very frustrating and also pretty scary so I understand them not wanting to do business with someone who is responsible for putting the administration in place that is very likely going to put them out of business.
 

TTundra

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This thread really shouldn't cause so much division among fellow hunters and firearm owners. The post was of an ammunition company whose business is ONLINE AMMUNITION SALES and the current administration has said specifically it intends to BAN the sales of ammunition and firearms online. There business and very livelihood is at stake. That must be very frustrating and also pretty scary so I understand them not wanting to do business with someone who is responsible for putting the administration in place that is very likely going to put them out of business.
Valid points, but I would add...

The reality to that is there are more than a few cartridges (let alone accessories) that we use in our hunts that have bounced back from obscurity due to increased "online sales" and their ability to reach users that the Biden administration is looking to ban. How many components (loaded, bullets, primers, powder, etc) do we all purchase online as our local stores just don't carry them. Print catalogs are costly and I don't see us moving backwards. Online presence for small manufactures and their e-comm retail outlets whether direct or thru a distribution apparatus lets our industry flourish with . So yes, voting for party that would severly harm if not completely abolish our ability to fulfill our passions in hunting is personal and will understandably elicit certain responses.
 

Rocco490

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Why would anyone who voted for this administration be shopping online for ammunition anyways that's kinda hypocritical..... They voted to elect an administration that said plainly there intent if elected was to take that right away and many others. As for myself I dont like the idea of any of it. I have no interested in giving away any of my rights. You know how hard it's going to be for me and many others to find 458 lott ammo or any other number of dangerous game calibers in stock at local gun stores. I will have to have it special ordered if they will even do that for me and its going to cost me up the a**. Yeah thanks a lot!
 

Rocco490

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Valid points, but I would add...

The reality to that is there are more than a few cartridges (let alone accessories) that we use in our hunts that have bounced back from obscurity due to increased "online sales" and their ability to reach users that the Biden administration is looking to ban. How many components (loaded, bullets, primers, powder, etc) do we all purchase online as our local stores just don't carry them. Print catalogs are costly and I don't see us moving backwards. Online presence for small manufactures and their e-comm retail outlets whether direct or thru a distribution apparatus lets our industry flourish with . So yes, voting for party that would severly harm if not completely abolish our ability to fulfill our passions in hunting is personal and will understandably elicit certain responses.
Right.
 

Rocco490

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And the online ammo sales is just one piece of there agenda. The online firearms sales is another. I sold a CZ 550 American Safari Magnum custom built in 500 a square because I was able to post it for sale online on this site actually. It never would of sold around here locally. If I want to buy or sell for my collection without online firearm sales in my area I am going to be limited to small bores. There is just not much of a market here for any of the larger calibers. I also sold 5 30 round magazines and some ammo. Say I had kept those 5 30 round magazines did you know the cost to have them registered is $200 each if the administration gets their assault weapon ban
 

Newboomer

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This gun ban crap is nothing new. The commucrats have been blathering about it since well before slick willy's 1968 fiasco. They just keep on puking up the same old tired fantasies. Just about everything they dream up has no chance of doing what they think. It's unenforcible and most law enforcement departments won't try--except in commucrat localities.
 

Woodcarver

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The big issues at hand are background checks and high capacity arms

Regarding the background checks, I believe every single gun purchase should be ran through a background check - something that 90-95% of Americans belief should happen. However, apparently that's too much to ask for. I can privately sell a gun to literally anyone, not ask their name, not anything. That is insane! Now, are most of these buyers legitimate buyers who want to take advantage of used prices? Sure. It's also entirely possible I am selling a gun to a convicted felon who can't pass a background check or to their slightly cleaner looking family member who buys it for them. You have to know the person who you are selling a gun to isn't going to commit a crime with it. A universal background check which takes 30 minutes and 30 dollars at a gunshop is entirely reasonable.

Large capacity magazines and assault weapons. Why the hell are they needed? To shoot as many school children, theater goers, or concert attendants as possible? The bottom line is a person does not need more than 10 shots to defend themselves. I'm sorry to ruin people's fun, but folks do not need to play soldier at the shooting range. Your fun should not cost dozens of people their lives in a matter of minutes.

Or maybe you need lots of firepower to try to overthrow the government like the despicable acts of right wing terrorism we saw inside our nation's capital in January. We always from our friends on the Right that we need guns to over-throw the government some day. Well they tried to - they lost an election fair and square and then listened to their Facist leader who is trying avoid prison time for the numerous felonies he has committed over the past decades, including time in office as President. Hell, even his own FBI said the greatest threat to American democracy are Right Wing Terrorists

I firmly believe even the most hardened guncontrol advocates have good intentions - they don't want people to die because of gun violence. Now, could they be going about it wrong? Sure. Would it be beneficial to have conversations across lines to come up with a bipartisan plan to address the gun violence in this country? You bet. But the NRA won't let that happen; they have money to launder. You can't launder money if you aren't presenting mass conspiracy theories to the paying members.

The bottom line is the NRA represents fewer than 10% of gun owners. 40% of gun owners are left or left-leaning voters - a number that is consistently confirmed in exit polling. Sure, its 60-40 in favor of the right and the right has 100% of the money. Now, the Right believe 99% of gunowners agree with them. Obvouusly not true. They just go on hunting and shooting forums and declare victory bc they yell and bully the loudest to the point where reasonable folks either ignore political threads or just leave all together.

I've been shooting and hunting all my life. I'm here to tell you that it's not fun any more.
You must really like that kool-aid, it appears you went back for multiple glasses.
I truly hope you read the response from @Opposite Pole as they have lived it down under. In case you missed it, I quoted it below.
As to your view of the NRA, without them, we would look like Oz already in this regard.
It is truly unfortunate that someone who hunts or just enjoys target shooting can't see the reality of what the anti-gun/anti-hunter's agenda is; they publish it. It's also unfortunate that you no longer find it fun. Perhaps it is time for you to quit being a hypocrite; that might be the reason it's not fun for you.
Might I suggest you find a copy of the Federalist Papers. And the Constitution. You will find that hunting is not listed in either one in the discussion of, or the adoption of, the 2nd Amendment. Excellent read, both of them. I highly recommend them.

I’m not an American and have no bone to pick in this fight. But I am a dual citizen with a total of 5 firearm permits between my two countries, and here is my warning to those who believe firearm control measures actually benefit people and do not negatively affect law-abiding shooters. The total cost of getting my permits ran into thousands of dollars. I also had to jump through hoops and pass some absurd exams that have nothing whatsoever to do with safety (and admittedly, some that did focus on safety). The gun control lobby states clearly and openly that their goal is to ban guns completely bit by bit. It’s not the extra few rounds in the mag that make the world unsafe. Antis come up with rules that are dumb and not based on any facts or reason. Look at OZ, you are not allowed a pump-action shotgun, but a pump-action rifle is fine. In Poland, on a hunting permit, you can have a semi-auto 50BMG rifle but not a single shot rimfire. Or the NSW ban on “Any firearm that substantially duplicates in APPEARENCE (regardless of calibre or manner of operation) a firearm referred to in item 1, 5 or 6.” (that is “military-style” firearm). It’s like saying that banning white stripes on a car or any other decor that looks “sporty” will improve road safety. It’s utter nonsense. In a free country, any and all limitations enforced upon citizens should be based on facts, not emotions and opinions. When it comes to gun control, I am yet to see firearm control laws that are logical and actually improve safety. If you think that banning high capacity magazines can stop murders, look at what happened in Paris. Machine guns are not legal to buy in Europe, and yet a couple of blokes bought some AK47s and shot up a concert hall using high capacity mags. But of course, that could not have possibly happened because it’s illegal and therefore impossible to obtain such firearms. A criminal will make a high capacity magazine or increase a small magazine's capacity when they choose to do so. This is not a difficult thing. Murder is illegal. Since this was signed into law, did murders stop?

Experience from around the world shows that if you give the antis a finger, they won’t just take your hand, they’ll take you and those standing near you too.

Have a look at the graph below. It proves how pointless gun control is.
View attachment 392018
 

Woodcarver

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I am from Australia and I have to admit I do try to take in alternative views, however those of the Democrats in the last 12 years has left me dumb founded. They support anarchy. Trump said lets LAWFULLY .... yet he is painted as being responsible for the storming of the capitol.

If any US citizen reads the following and still thinks the Democrats has your or anybody other than their own agenda at heart you would have to be a fool.
To understand the situation, we need to hear it from the Democrat's own mouths.

Chuck Schumer: "Time and again, we find progressive laws getting struck down. And it's always - always - the ones the Constitution is against. These right-wing judges don't think for themselves, they just do whatever the Constitution says. And it's time for that to end."

Elizabeth Warren: " We need judges to be advocates of progressive laws, not people who will bow to the whims of the Constitution, pitting it's extremist values of freedom of speech and freedom of religion against our agenda."

Cory Booker: "We're sick and tired of the Constitution sitting in the National Archives, manipulating everything we do."

To me the above is nothing short of treacherous. Look up the true definition.
I had to quote this so I could "like" it again. Thank you. It's always good to point out what the horses ass actually said. And those 3 definitely qualify.
 

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