Discussion in 'Up To .375' started by Jeff Garcia, Jun 5, 2015.
never confuse oryx with partition.
they are very different.
Not confusing them. Just listing them as the type of performance I'd like out of RNSP type of bullets. I find the Oryx holding up very well and penetrating deeply (but I only used it in 9.3x62). The partition I have used in 30-06 and my friends us them in 25-06 and variety of .270-.30 cal. Mushrooms more but penetrates very well also. At least on deer, elk and moose. Never hit bone with one, so not sure how it does there. Oryx seems to not care. but then I only hit soft bones with it. GMX (completely different bullet) I had bend on a hip joint of an elk cow. Was supposed to be anchoring shot. It kind of worked but 1) was not necessary and 2) the bullet glanced off the bone and destroyed quite a bit of meat.
How do you find them very different?
170 gr Rhino is what I use
My Rigby had 140 grains engraved onto the barrel but I used 175 grain Woodleigh PPSNs which accounted for many huge boars and buffalos, as well as wild dogs and donkeys.
I have not used oryx, but go on reports her by those who do.
they seem to expand and retain a fair percentage of weight, penetrating in a straight line well.
I have use partitions a fair bit.
in anything with speed they bow the noses off, and shaping like a wadcutter nose.
having lost a fair bit of their weight they lose penetrating potential.
when the noses blow off the explosiveness of this can deflect the bullet.
as you might have read, I consider the n.p. to be a good bullet for making a bigger gun shoot smaller game, as the blowing nose is effective on light game for lung shots side on, and the will penetrate light game from angles.
shooting them head to head against swift aframes aon game there is a clear and obvious difference in favour of the swift.
this comes from culling operations firing 60 rounds of each in an engagement.
my own preference is that I would take a Woodleigh before a nosler.
the oryx sounds a bit like the Woodleigh compared to the partition.
I have shot swift head to head with Woodleigh and it is hard to compare the results for similarity, other than that woodleighs can be made to fail shooting dead things for testing, while swifts cannot.
that testing was before ben kk told me about woodleighs tougher bullets.
My a fault for forgetting this is African Hunting forum. 1) I was thinking my own hunting here in Alberta, so deer, elk and moose. 2) I was simply wanting a round nose soft point that could be pushed a bit more than 2500 fps out of 7x57 and not blow up at less than 100m shots, especially should you hit bone. So I thought of the partition. Because the partition will penetrate enough on our softer animals, yet will still expand at farther ranges. The Oryx is great but in 9.3 it over-penetrates. Great on Oryx, not so good on whitetail. Soft, thin jackets may hold together better once you reach farther and the velocity goes down (even the light SST i shoot killed and penetrated well at 300+ meters), but they will still come apart when you nick a bone or if you are too close and have a hot load. While I think there are many good bullets to choose from, I would just like something like NP or Oryx in terms of construction but in long, heavy, round nose, with lots of exposed lead (think quartering shots on moose/elk). So I can have one load for everything. Old school stuff. Just to try it. Otherwise I'm sure I can live with current choices. I can have lighter SSTs or Nosler partitions for whitetail and heavy Oryx or A-Frame for elk and moose.
No experience with Swift bullets but have only heard good stuff about A-Frames and Siroccos.
For your needs, or wants, to me there are no better bullet than a 175 grs Nosler Partition. Period. It is my favorite big game bullet in the 7x57 . I use for hunting and reload the 7mm Mauser for the last 45 years. As I said, to ME, there are no better bullet than this.
It is one of the softest and, at the same time, toughest bullet around. Always expands at VERY low velocities, and airways penetrates at VERY high velocities. Tell me what other hunting bullet do the same, with consistence...
Ah! By the way, I load this 7mm 175 grs Nosler Partition in my 60 cm (23,7") barrel lenght 1935 Mauser very easy, with R22 and absolutely normal pressures, at 2600 f/s.
You may want to investigate the Federal Edge TLR 7mm 155 grain component bullet. It's what I plan to have loaded in 7X64mm Brenneke for my purposes. While not a round nose, they show good terminal performance from 15 yards to 900+ yards in .300 WM in several articles and YouTube video reviews.
FWIW the Norma factory 7X57mm factory ammo with 156 grain Oryx projectile is what I purchased to use in my 20" 7X57mm rifle.
I have recently acquired three boxes of vintage Lapua 7X57mm factory ammo loaded with the (now discontinued) 170 grain RNSP Mega bullet. You could hunt around for those in Canada, they are packaged in a green box. This auction includes one such box for reference.
I have a couple of boxes of vintage Western 7X57 175 grain RNSP factory ammo as well, this auction for reference if you want to try to find them in Canada.
These aren't exorbitantly priced relative to most places selling Federal Power Shock 7X57mm 175 grain RNSP ammo, when they are available.
The 7mm 170 grain Norma Oryx component bullet used for a custom load you develop may be something you want to consider as well, if available in Canada. Again, for reference.
I purchased a box of the 7mm 170 grain Oryx bullets thinking I would try them in a custom load for my 7X57mm rifle, but now that I own a 7X64mm rifle, I'll use them for 7X64mm cartridges instead.
Thanks for all the suggestions. I will most likely use the NP and Oryx. But I was hunting for RNSP. I do have the Winchester X and Federal Power Shock RNSP, but have not hunted with them yet. Plus I think they'd be on the thin jacket side of things.
@Mr. Zorg...I do like the Lapua ammo in that group.
To my knoledge lapua mega is still in production. At least as components. I have a friend using exclusively lapua mega in
I beleive that, it is only a matter of import, and local retail.. However - I do not know if they are producing 7x57 factory ammo with that bullet.
Thanks. I will look into it.
There was a time where I would never have used anything other than barnes but the way the oryx performs my 275 will never be fouled by copper, mark my words!
Joking aside they are great and you will do well with them.
With the barnes, people find pushing them fast is the key. That means hot-loading some of the classics. I'm not totally against that but would prefer to stay within velocities below max. The PH I hunted with likes 30-06 or .300 WM for plains game and TSX and TTSX bullets. But he uses 165/168gr in the 06 and 180 gr in the 300. Not the heaviest bullets for caliber. And he pushes them fast. I believe he said 2900+ fps for the 06. Who knows? I will eventually load some NP, Oryx and Mega if I can find it and then I will see. Hopefully over winter.
Some may find pushing the TSX bullet fast is the "key"- but I'm not sure the key to what? I have loaded TSXs from normal to slightly below normal velocities in several calibers and have not noticed any reduction in accuracy or performance on game. Seems that "over cooking" the load for any bullet and/or cartridge is usually what leads to problems, either pressure related or bullet related, not the other way around.
One thing about the 7x57, because of the age of some of the firearms so chambered, is basic load data and factory ammo is purposefully ballistically somewhat conservative which may account for it's consistently good reputation over the years as a game getter within its range of capabilities. Even older bullet designs tend to do OK if they are slowed down a little and have good sectional density.
Yes bullet performance and range... regarding the T/TSX.
I used to use Black Talon/Failsafe and found no need to improve things. Those things were deadly and all long before the plastic tips. Out of factory 30-06 and .338 WM too. I assumed TSX would be the same but I also tend not to argue with results and this guy gets good results and swears the extra little speed helps at farther ranges. I also heard or read the same from others. Not sure if that is a myth then, like other Internet propagated info. I'm just going by this guy.
I think 7x57 at slightly faster than factory loads should be OK too. This more for better ballistics than better bullet performance, but that's why my previous comment about wanting better RNSP. I do not use Mauser 93/95 actions so I'm pretty sure they will be OK especially if we "know" the ammo is under-loaded. Or is that a myth too? I do not find the Euro ammo much hotter, at least not S&B compared to Federal in 175 gr. Both under 2400 fps. Both hotter than old military rounds listed at under 2300 fps. I never chronographed any to see. I will chrono my handloads and then we will see. Never used RWS ammo either which seems to be loaded hotter that these but with 163gr bullet. I may give those a try.
Both the 7mm 170 grain Laupa Mega bullet and Lapua factory 7X57mm ammunition loaded with that bullet ceased production some years ago.
Lapua still manufactures the Mega bullet in 6.5mm, .308 caliber, and 9.3mm sizes.
So all Lapua 7mm stuff is vintage now.
FWIW, for reference, Hendershots' says the 7mm 170 grain Oryx bullet performs well at 7X57mm velocities.
If you look at Norma factory ammo, not all 7X57mm European loads are the same. The 2640 fps muzzle velocity Norma publishes for its 7X57mm ammo loaded with the 156 grain Oryx projectile is about the same muzzle velocity PPU & S&B publish for their 7X57mm ammo loaded with 139 - 140 grain projectiles.
I misspoke. Lapua offers 7X64mm & 7X65Rmm ammo with their lead free Naturlis projectile. Anything with the 7mm Mega projectile is vintage.
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