.458 Lott recoil is no joke

sestoppelman

AH ambassador
Joined
Apr 25, 2010
Messages
7,606
Reaction score
7,430
Media
172
Articles
2
Hunting reports
Africa
3
Member of
NRA, NA Hunt Club
Hunted
Tanzania, Botswana, Zimbabwe (2), Namibia (2), South Africa (2)
Biggest bore No.1 I have had is the .450/400 and shooting .404 Jeff type loads it would give me a recoil headache pretty quickly. As others have said, its the worst platform for heavy kickers. Still have a 9.3x74R and I can manage that but want nothing larger!
 

JPmbogo

Bronze supporter
AH veteran
Joined
Jul 27, 2020
Messages
127
Reaction score
129
Media
6
Member of
NRA, Grays Harbor Rifle and Pistol Club
Hunted
Indiana, Michigan, Alabama, Montana, Alaska, Oregon, Washington, South Africa
I have a Boddington African Series No. 1 in 450 NE. Without my alterations, it came in a 7 1/2 pounds in factory configuration. Why the folks at Ruger have never figured out that big guns require lots of weight to be comfortable to shoot, I don't know - also factory pads are worthless. But I digress. I added a mercury recoil plug in the buttstock which added a pound plus I fitted a Limbsaver pad. Both projects are easy in that the stock is already drilled 7/8 for the stock bolt and Limbsaver makes pad which is pretty much screw on if you aren't obsessed with perfect fit. The result is a very shootable rifle, albeit not for the faint of heart or physique. Probably not going to blow off a couple of boxes at a sitting, either.
 

CBH Australia

AH elite
Joined
Feb 10, 2019
Messages
1,693
Reaction score
2,166
Location
NSW Australia
Media
16
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
Sporting Shooters Association Australia, Africa Hunting website!!!
Hunted
Australia and now South Africa
I have found a Limbsaver makes a noticable difference up to .300wm.
Had a CZ550 in .458wm almost Lott it but sold for a .375H&H its all i need.
Sounds lke the light rifle is a big part of it.
 

hammz

AH senior member
Joined
Jul 31, 2019
Messages
57
Reaction score
72
Media
2
Pic as requested:
IMG_20200824_220559.jpg
 

autofire

AH veteran
Joined
Jan 30, 2018
Messages
155
Reaction score
141
Hunted
Namibia(2), RSA(2), Botswana(2)
Thanks guys! I ordered Limbsaver AirTech and a Pachmayr Decelerator slip on recoil pads and will test them both out on it and see if one works better than the other. The Pachmayr looks more spongy, but we'll see.

Unfortunately I don't reload so I am limited to factory ammo. What would you recommend besides going down to 458 WM for lighter loads? In my 416 Rem I pretty exclusively use Hornady 400gr DGS, and Barnes Vor-TX Safari 400gr TSX.

Out of the Lott I have been shooting Hornady 500gr DGS. I believe Norma makes a 450gr solid that you can buy for the Lott?
Often there are licensed commercial reloading companies that produce quality reloads. They can make reloads to your specifications re type of powder and number of grains.
 

CBH Australia

AH elite
Joined
Feb 10, 2019
Messages
1,693
Reaction score
2,166
Location
NSW Australia
Media
16
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
Sporting Shooters Association Australia, Africa Hunting website!!!
Hunted
Australia and now South Africa
Pretty wood
 

Philip Glass

Lifetime bronze benefactor
AH legend
Joined
Feb 26, 2015
Messages
4,051
Reaction score
6,906
Location
Texas
Website
www.dorper.net
Media
86
Articles
13
Hunting reports
Africa
8
USA/Canada
2
Asia/M.East
2
Member of
NRA, Life SCI, Life DSC, Life EWA
Hunted
RSA, Namibia, Zimbabwe, Cameroon, Mongolia, Kyrgyzstan, Austria, Australia, TX, NM
I'm a big bore junkie and recently had my Ruger No. 1H Tropical re-bored from .458 Win Mag to .458 Lott. I took it out the other day and could only fire 3 rounds before I had to stop. The recoil on it is almost nightmarish. I've never had a gun kick like that before. It probably doesn't help that the butt pad on it is kind of stiff being that the gun was made in 2001 or so.

But it is a nightmarish rifle to shoot. I have a 416 Rem Mag Model 70 that I love to shoot and have put 40 rounds through it in a range session, and I've owned a .375 H&H and found that to be pretty easy to shoot. But the Lott just seems like it's on a whole 'nother level in terms of ferocity. It seriously makes my 416 Rem feel like kind of a sissy gun, and that gun/round is absolutely a beast in and of itself. But the Lott is just on a whole 'nother tier.

What's the best way to reduce the recoil on it? I'm thinking of a Limbsaver or Pachmayr Decelerator pad... something spongy. Don't really want to brake it since I may take it hunting out west for moose or grizzly at some point in the future, but if that's necessary I may have to. If I can't find anything to reduce the recoil I may just have to sell this ferocious monster.
I would put a new recoil pad on it and send the stock to Edwards Recoil Reducer and have them install one of their reducers. You will be amazed at what it can do without adding hardly any weight. I have probably 10 of them.
Philip
 

Professor Mawla

AH fanatic
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
783
Reaction score
2,234
Media
58
Articles
13
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the original .458 Winchester Magnum . Please use the following hand load formula :
Bullet - 475 grain South African PMP monolithic solid bulllet
Gunpowder- 60 grains of Somchem S325 + 10 grains of Somchem S265
Velocity - 2180 to 2200 feet per second ( depending upon barrel length . My .458 WM uses a 25 inch Douglas Premium barrel . From it , I got a chronographed velocity of 2196 feet per second . From a 23 inch barrel , you will get a chronographed velocity of 2183 feet per second ) .

Somchem gunpowders are South African . If you would like the formula with Australian gunpowder or American gunpowder , please let me know . I can also give you the formula with Continental European gunpowder , but I am afraid that I have not actually trialed that one .
 

Forrest Halley

AH fanatic
Joined
Jul 28, 2019
Messages
877
Reaction score
1,241
Location
VA, USA
Media
25
I do believe that these .458 Winchester proponents may well be the ones to get me to buy a chronograph.
 

Nhoro

AH enthusiast
Joined
Sep 16, 2014
Messages
391
Reaction score
491
Media
26
By the way, how was the recoil of the .458 Win Mag? I am contemplating building some loads in that to see how they shoot. You have the unique experience of having shot both in the same rifle.
My rifle started as a win mag. I have shot 450 gr peregrine copper mono @ 2250 fps and 480 gr same @ 2143 fps win mag ammo + 500 gr cast lead @2000 fps. All pretty similar recoil. The 450 gr did seem a little sharper or maybe faster. Then Lott I am loading 515 gr &500 gr peregrine copper monos from 2000 fps up to 2350 fps. Subjective opinion is the win mag was the same as the Lott at similar velocities. I cant tell the difference between a 480 gr and 515 gr recoil at the same velocity. The 2350 fps/515 gr was noticeably heavier. I felt a little ache or sting from the recoil while the slower rounds are just a thumping shove. 12 rounds of the win mag at my PH shooting test left me with a purple/green bruise all over my shoulder pocket but the Lott (3 rounds) didn't leave a mark. I think practice helps your body adjust. Bottom line- lower velocity and lighter bullets reduce recoil. And I think velocity has more impact on felt recoil.
 

hammz

AH senior member
Joined
Jul 31, 2019
Messages
57
Reaction score
72
Media
2
Took it out today with the Limbsaver AirTech pad on it. Happy to report that the recoil pad helped a TON. Pretty much feels like it cut the recoil almost in half. It felt much more like a 375 H&H with the pad on it. Very happy with it now and glad that I found something that mitigates the ferocity of the Lott.
 

Forrest Halley

AH fanatic
Joined
Jul 28, 2019
Messages
877
Reaction score
1,241
Location
VA, USA
Media
25
Took it out today with the Limbsaver AirTech pad on it. Happy to report that the recoil pad helped a TON. Pretty much feels like it cut the recoil almost in half. It felt much more like a 375 H&H with the pad on it. Very happy with it now and glad that I found something that mitigates the ferocity of the Lott.
This post needs pictures! I am so glad to hear that someone on this forum is burning powder on the regular. I was beginning to grow tired of the gun oil smell from all the clean unfired guns.
 

CAustin

Bronze supporter
AH ambassador
Joined
May 7, 2013
Messages
14,463
Reaction score
11,782
Media
258
Hunting reports
Africa
7
Member of
Courtney Hunting Club, NRA Life Member, SCI Kansas City Chapter
Hunted
South Africa, KwaZulu Natal, Kalahari, Northwest, Limpopo, Gauteng, APNR Kruger Area. USA Georgia, South Carolina, Arkansas, New Mexico, North Carolina and Texas
Pachmayr Decelerator recoil pad would be good. Another to look at would be adding some weight to the stock.

Exactly what. Put on mine!
 

colorado

AH elite
Joined
May 8, 2011
Messages
1,194
Reaction score
1,303
Media
59
Initially I was looking at a Ruger #1 for my first big bore rifle. They are beautiful. Many comments on the recoil due to the stock design convinced me to go with a CZ 550 which I've been very happy with. I hope you can tame yours.
 

machinistbutler

Silver supporter
AH enthusiast
Joined
Feb 16, 2012
Messages
419
Reaction score
785
Location
Alberta Canada
Media
62
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Hunted
Canada Namibia
I have been shooting my Lott in the CZ 550 a fair bit. Quite happy the rifle weighs a bit, recoil isn't that bad. I have a fairly heavy scope on it as well so that may help a bit.

Some people complain about the size of the cz , that it is too bulky and heavy. I have hunted with a CZ in 375 for almost 20 years , with no complaints, so moving to a CZ in the Lott was very easy.
 

Forrest Halley

AH fanatic
Joined
Jul 28, 2019
Messages
877
Reaction score
1,241
Location
VA, USA
Media
25
I have a Boddington African Series No. 1 in 450 NE. Without my alterations, it came in a 7 1/2 pounds in factory configuration. Why the folks at Ruger have never figured out that big guns require lots of weight to be comfortable to shoot, I don't know - also factory pads are worthless. But I digress. I added a mercury recoil plug in the buttstock which added a pound plus I fitted a Limbsaver pad. Both projects are easy in that the stock is already drilled 7/8 for the stock bolt and Limbsaver makes pad which is pretty much screw on if you aren't obsessed with perfect fit. The result is a very shootable rifle, albeit not for the faint of heart or physique. Probably not going to blow off a couple of boxes at a sitting, either.
I was interested in this chambering when I first got started down this road. Buying a .375 H&H #1 was clearly the dumbest thing I have ever done as is was nothing but a gateway to other boomers. The .450 is a tough sell though as all the conversions are highly expensive and the boddington guns are expensive too. I'm not sure what was the thought with these guns. I think they found a guy to slap a name on it and then they cut manufacturing costs in the wake of it. The matte finish is not for me and I don't think the wood is all that nice on them for what's being asked. From the sound of your account they slapped a lightweight barrel on the thing and made it nearly unshootable out of the box. My Lott has an oil pipe for a barrel on it. What's with the avoidance of the Legendary Arms Works safety on this model? They should have bought or licensed the design buy now. Same with the Canjar triggers. Quit rebuffing the cottage industry improvements and start incorporating them.

The #1 has a proud lineage and this series did it no favors except maybe to get us a line for fixed express sights and not have to mill in a 16mm dovetail.
 

IvW

AH legend
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
3,594
Reaction score
7,011
Location
South Africa
Media
62
Articles
3
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
BASA, CHASA
Hunted
South Africa, Zimbabwe, Mozambique, Botswana, Namibia,Zambia
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the original .458 Winchester Magnum . Please use the following hand load formula :
Bullet - 475 grain South African PMP monolithic solid bulllet
Gunpowder- 60 grains of Somchem S325 + 10 grains of Somchem S265
Velocity - 2180 to 2200 feet per second ( depending upon barrel length . My .458 WM uses a 25 inch Douglas Premium barrel . From it , I got a chronographed velocity of 2196 feet per second . From a 23 inch barrel , you will get a chronographed velocity of 2183 feet per second ) .

Somchem gunpowders are South African . If you would like the formula with Australian gunpowder or American gunpowder , please let me know . I can also give you the formula with Continental European gunpowder , but I am afraid that I have not actually trialed that one .

I would be very reluctant to use any of these recommendations, especially in a rifle case with limited capacity...providing loading date should not be allowed in my opinion...

Somchem S325 does not exist, never heard of it....
Somchem S265 is a Slow burning extruded propellant for magnum revolvers not rifles....

Making duplex loads is not a good idea.....

Somchem S321 is recommended by Somchem for monolithic bullets in the 458WM, nothing else....
 

Professor Mawla

AH fanatic
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
783
Reaction score
2,234
Media
58
Articles
13
I would be very reluctant to use any of these recommendations, especially in a rifle case with limited capacity...providing loading date should not be allowed in my opinion...

Somchem S325 does not exist, never heard of it....
Somchem S265 is a Slow burning extruded propellant for magnum revolvers not rifles....

Making duplex loads is not a good idea.....

Somchem S321 is recommended by Somchem for monolithic bullets in the 458WM, nothing else....
@IvW
That’s right . Somchem S325 does not exist . I meant to write S335 . The correct load data is as follows :

60 grains of Somchem S335 topped with 10 grains of Somchem S265 . Bullet is a 475 grain South African PMP monolithic solid bullet .

From the 25 inch Douglas Premium barrel of my .458 WM , the chronographed velocity was 2196 feet per second . And yes , I am willing to stand behind my claim . It is a duplex load ( ie two different gunpowders are used ) . But duplex loads have never bothered me . If you do not like duplex loads , then I can give you the load data in IMR 3031 gunpowder ( however I have only tried it with 500 grain Hornady bullets ) .

I have heard of Somchem S321 , but I have not used it yet .
 

Forum statistics

Threads
37,373
Messages
713,002
Members
66,649
Latest member
nnwaowheng1
 

 

 

Latest posts

Latest profile posts

degoins wrote on Treemantwo's profile.
I have a like new VC .450 I might part with. I had it built in 2013 and it has served me well. Also have a VC fitted leather trunk case for it along with the plastic case it came with. I'll take 14000 for all of it.
Matt W wrote on Jody's profile.
Hi Jody,
I have been looking for ideas on the best way to display my European mounts from Africa. I came across some of your shield work and was wondering if you would be willing to make one for me? If so, please let me know the cost. I like the shield with the two spears that you built for a member years ago. Thanks.
cal pappas wrote on Mnelson2's profile.
Nelson. Is this message a PM format. I want to send you my email, but don't know if this is the cirrect way to do it. I'm at <pappas@mtaonline.net> Send me an email with your phone and I will call you about a skull I have. I went to school in Boston and am from Bernardston in the west part of the state. Moved to Alaska in 1984 adn never looked back.
BeeMaa wrote on Justbryan's profile.
Sold a Blaser scope mount to him. He was a pleasure to do business with.
BeeMaa wrote on 375Fox's profile.
Sold a Blaser scope mount to him. Was a pleasure to do business with.
 
Top