358 Norma Magnum

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

+1 on the .416 Taylor! No need for a .358! Ha! Ha! Ha!

@CoElkHunter
Young grasshopper I can see your education needs to be continued.
Get ready for the tutu and ballet slippers mate
Bob

 

[bruce moulds]

@bruce moulds
Don't be silly, a 9.3 ain't a 35 and who wants to pay 260 dollars for a hundred cases when of you get stuck you can make Norma brass out of 338 win mag.
Bob.

i do want to get those cases.
nothing as good as rws brass, and that includes lapua.
if you want to go cheaper neck 338 up to 9.3 and you have arrived.
actually ceh is in a good position.
he might have a fair bit of 338 brass that would suit reforming.
bruce.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Same bullet diameter as the 35 Whelen and has a bit more grunt, 250gr @ 2756fps and for the Whelen 250gr @ 2523fps - both conservative loads. I think the 35 Whelen may have more bullet options but not sure. The Whelen will handle all the plains games with ease. It's an option to think about.

@Cervus elaphas
In my Whelen I get 2,700 fps with the 250s and 2,900 fps with the 225s.
Where the Norma really shines is with the 275 to 310 grainers.
Nothing that can be loaded into the Whelen can equal the punch of the heavies. A 275 Woodleigh @26 to 2,700 fps out of the Norma is going to put some serious hurt on bigger game.
Bob.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

but the 9.3x64 is a rung up the ladder again.
bruce.

@bruce moulds
You are funny man Mr bruce.
The rungs must be pretty close together. The difference is .008 inches so velly small ladder missa bruce.
Bob

 

[Cervus elaphus]

@Cervus elaphas
In my Whelen I get 2,700 fps with the 250s and 2,900 fps with the 225s.
Where the Norma really shines is with the 275 to 310 grainers.
Nothing that can be loaded into the Whelen can equal the punch of the heavies. A 275 Woodleigh @26 to 2,700 fps out of the Norma is going to put some serious hurt on bigger game.
Bob.

Indeed, I got my ballistics from (presumably) factory loads.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

i do want to get those cases.
nothing as good as rws brass, and that includes lapua.
if you want to go cheaper neck 338 up to 9.3 and you have arrived.
actually ceh is in a good position.
he might have a fair bit of 338 brass that would suit reforming.
bruce.

@bruce moulds
@CoElkHunter is in the naughty corner at the moment for being rude about the 35s.
Instead of necking op the 338 cases to 9.3 he should be made to Make @philip 1976 a hundred 358 Norma cases out of the 338 cases he has accumulated and give them to him free of charge all while he is dressed in the dreaded pink tutu and ballet slippers.
Bob

 

[CoElkHunter]

i do want to get those cases.
nothing as good as rws brass, and that includes lapua.
if you want to go cheaper neck 338 up to 9.3 and you have arrived.
actually ceh is in a good position.
he might have a fair bit of 338 brass that would suit reforming.
bruce.

Bruce,
The only reforming I'll be doing with regards to the .338, is reforming your and Bob's thoughts of why one would want a .35 or .366 anything, when the .338 Winchester Magnum is powerful enough to take ANY game in our galaxy. Ha! Ha! Ha!
CEH

 

[CoElkHunter]

@bruce moulds
@CoElkHunter is in the naughty corner at the moment for being rude about the 35s.
Instead of necking op the 338 cases to 9.3 he should be made to Make @philip 1976 a hundred 358 Norma cases out of the 338 cases he has accumulated and give them to him free of charge all while he is dressed in the dreaded pink tutu and ballet slippers.
Bob

Bob,
Philip1976 should by a .338WM and quit fooling around with the .358 Norma! Although, I would have had a .358 Norma rifle awhile back at a fair price, but was talked out of it by a couple of "experts" here. Now, the price of a similar rifle is more than I want to pay. Anyway, Philip1976 gets a .338, and then re barrels his .358 to .416 Taylor and he and everyone else here on this thread is in rifle cartridge paradise. No need for further stressful debate?
Ha! Ha! Ha!
CEH

 

[dchamp]

I have thought the .358 Norma to be an interesting caliber. After reading through this thread I decided to run a little comparison between it and some other calibers mentioned. I used a computer program - QuickLoad - to run the numbers so as to leave out any of Merlins Magic.

I used Woodleigh PP bullets throughout the modeling and I took the listed Max Pressure and rounded down to the nearest thousand psi for acquiring a powder and charge weight. The two powders in the table were listed as the top performers throughout the comparison. I also used 24 inches for barrel length. Note: Woodleigh lists 1900fps as a minimum velocity.

I was pleasantly surprised by the .358 Norma Mag.

 

[Philip1976]

LOL, after seeing the chart, and nothing against the .338 win mag, but every other house in Nebraska has one, the fact that I can get heavier bullets to shove harder from the .358 Norma mag makes me want it even more.
I also have eight 16 gauges and a 28 gauge, along with the best 6.5 ever built in the Swede.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Bruce,
The only reforming I'll be doing with regards to the .338, is reforming your and Bob's thoughts of why one would want a .35 or .366 anything, when the .338 Winchester Magnum is powerful enough to take ANY game in our galaxy. Ha! Ha! Ha!
CEH

@CoElkHunter
Young grasshopper have you been dipping into the wacky backy jar agin. The 338 on the scale of useless cartridges is running 3rd behind the 243, 270 then the 338. Dang even @Bruce moulds has got something better in the 9.3, but none of them are a 358.
Lesson 1 grasshopper

Now you have read this you can progress to lesson 2 again
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Bob,
Philip1976 should by a .338WM and quit fooling around with the .358 Norma! Although, I would have had a .358 Norma rifle awhile back at a fair price, but was talked out of it by a couple of "experts" here. Now, the price of a similar rifle is more than I want to pay. Anyway, Philip1976 gets a .338, and then re barrels his .358 to .416 Taylor and he and everyone else here on this thread is in rifle cartridge paradise. No need for further stressful debate?
Ha! Ha! Ha!
CEH

@CoElkHunter
You should have been slapped silly for not buy the 358. If you did we wouldn't have been having this conversation. We would have been sitting around a bbq at your place with me bringing the Bundy Rum and discussing the virtues of the 358 and wondering why others are using sub calibers for real world hunting
Those so called experts did you a great disservice by suggesting you get the 338.
Grasshopper next time we talk I will get your wife to trade the 338 for a Whelen and your true journey in life can begin.
Bob

 

[PerH]

And the other way that make the .358 very interesting is .357 pistol or revolver bullets. 180 grain JHP is a very good lightning flash.

And if one want a flat trajectory to cope with the most 225 Accubond ,that is one bullet that should have been out many years earlier.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I have thought the .358 Norma to be an interesting caliber. After reading through this thread I decided to run a little comparison between it and some other calibers mentioned. I used a computer program - QuickLoad - to run the numbers so as to leave out any of Merlins Magic.

I used Woodleigh PP bullets throughout the modeling and I took the listed Max Pressure and rounded down to the nearest thousand psi for acquiring a powder and charge weight. The two powders in the table were listed as the top performers throughout the comparison. I also used 24 inches for barrel length. Note: Woodleigh lists 1900fps as a minimum velocity.

I was pleasantly surprised by the .358 Norma Mag.
View attachment 405745

@dchamp
I noticed the 35 Whelen and the 9.3 loads are running quite a few thousand psi less than the others. Bring them up to the same pressure and run the Whelen at a realistic 2,700 fps with the 250s and over 2,500 with the 275s and make it fair. Then you have the Whelen loaded to its potential and see what the difference is.
Bob

 

[dchamp]

@dchamp
I noticed the 35 Whelen and the 9.3 loads are running quite a few thousand psi less than the others. Bring them up to the same pressure and run the Whelen at a realistic 2,700 fps with the 250s and over 2,500 with the 275s and make it fair. Then you have the Whelen loaded to its potential and see what the difference is.
Bob

The reason behind the lower pressure is because the listed max pressure for those calibers is lower than the others. 56,565 psi for the 9.3x62 and 58,015 psi for the .35 Whelen. If I rand everything at 65,000psi then I would have been injecting Merlins Magic and things would not be realistic.

 

[dchamp]

Here is what QuickLoad suggests for running at 65,000 psi.
.35 Whelen, 250 Woodleigh PP, 60.7gr BL-C2, MV 2668 fps, 65,000 psi, 24" barrel

 

[sambarhunter]

I was pleasantly surprised by the .358 Norma Mag.

As an owner of such for many years I am not surprised at all. It is one of the great undervalued calibres and often never heard of. Others talk up other calibres at will and hardly ever mention the .358NM.
I use a 9.3 x 64 also and as your chart attests the 35 is also a hammer in comparison.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

LOL, after seeing the chart, and nothing against the .338 win mag, but every other house in Nebraska has one, the fact that I can get heavier bullets to shove harder from the .358 Norma mag makes me want it even more.
I also have eight 16 gauges and a 28 gauge, along with the best 6.5 ever built in the Swede.

@philip 1976
@dchamp writes with forked pen and give unfair comparison.
The Whelen loaded properly gives 2,700+ fps with 250 grainers putting it in the 338 class and just fractionally behind the Norma.
The 275s can do over 2,500 fps in the Whelen and that will change the out come.
I didn't notice any loads for the 275 grain 338 but that's not surprising.
Those that like the 338 will skew the figures to suit themselves a 225 grain accubond in the Whelen @2,900 fps leaves the 338 in its wake. In the 358 Norma it is even further behind. You need to choose the right powder for the big Swede and I don't think Re17 is it but I could be wrong.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Here is what QuickLoad suggests for running at 65,000 psi.
.35 Whelen, 250 Woodleigh PP, 60.7gr BL-C2, MV 2668 fps, 65,000 psi, 24" barrel

@dchamp
With blc2 you are correct but there are better powders out there that will get 2,700+ fps with 250s in the Whelen
My chronoed load is a smidge over 2,700.

Directly from the Speer reloading site.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

The reason behind the lower pressure is because the listed max pressure for those calibers is lower than the others. 56,565 psi for the 9.3x62 and 58,015 psi for the .35 Whelen. If I rand everything at 65,000psi then I would have been injecting Merlins Magic and things would not be realistic.

@dchamp
There ain't no Merlin magic
The Whelen and the 9.3 can both run SAFELY at 62,000 psi in MODERN rifles. The 270 has been doing it for years and that is the same parent case.
Bob