The most troublesome .458 I've ever owned...

Hi,

I thought I'd do a little write-up about the most troublesome, finicky .458 I've ever owned.
Previous to this particular rifle, I thought I had a bit of knowledge on the .458 Winchester Magnum having now owned 6 rifles in this cartridge, but this one nearly beat me...

This particular rifle was previously owned by Bob Penfold/Matt Cameron of Hunt Australia, and was then purchase by a mate, and as I had read about these rifles in magazines when the opportunity came up to own one, I jumped on it.

When I bought it, it looked like this...



I had always wanted a short-barreled .458 with a black synthetic stock with a white spiderweb pattern on it, so that's what I made...



I was happy... until I fired it. Using Winchester 510gn factory ammo, it keyholed. This really worried me, as I had no idea about how much use (abuse) this rifle had endured in its life. The bore looked ok, but there was obviously a problem.
So I loaded up some Woodleigh 480gn projectiles that came with the rifle, and using my standard load of 74gn of AR2206H I got good velocity and good accuracy. And the projectiles were stabalised properly.

.458WM loaded with the 480gn Woodleigh



Good speed



Good accuracy



I was happy again... until I went to sight this load in. At the same location, same temperature, same altitude, using the same reloads, it was now tumbling again.
I was frustrated again and really worried I may need a new barrel.
I really didn't want to do that – not just because of the cost, but because I didn't want to alter the rifle.
So I went to Plan B: change projectiles.
I contacted Atomic29 and ordered some 400gn and 450gn of their copper hollowpoints. As a sidenote, Cameron recommended the 400gn projectile for the .458WM as the 450gn are very long and take up a lot of space in the case. But he said both will work.
So I loaded up some 400gn projectiles and headed to the range...

Loaded with the Atomic29 projectiles, they now looked like this



The good news is that these projectiles stabalised beautifully... the bad news was they were way overpressure. I was using new Bertram brass and 2206H powder, a powder I had always used and had great success with.
I was using a load that was 2gn under the book max for this projectile, and I worked my way all the way down from 75gn to 69gn. - and at 69gn I was still showing signs of pressure.
This was really weird, and I had never experienced these kinds of problems with either the .458WM cartridge or with 2206H powder.
What was also weird was that dropping 6gn only affected the velocity by 50fps or so.
At 75gn I was averaging 2290fps with the 400gn projectile, and dropping it down to 69gn I was averaging 2240fps. This surprised me, as the pressure it was showing I thought the velocity would be higher. I have a shorter barrel but still thought it would be higher.

I was starting to get really puzzled now (and frustrated), and I was starting to think that this rifle was cursed...
The reason I say that is because while I was doing load development, 2 things occurred to me that have never happened to me before: I shot my chronograph, and I had a case stuck in my FLS die.
The first scenario required me buying a new chronograph, and the second required a new press, as my old one (and one I've owned for my whole reloading journey) broke while trying to get the case out of the die. Luckily I eventually got the case out with no damage to the die.
But I took the hint and called someone for advice...

I gave Anthony (Farmboy) a call and explained what was going on. Farmboy runs NT Firearms Gove and he was the one that built my 425 Express for me. He's a really nice guy and extremely knowledgeable on all things firearms.
After a few chats and many messages, he made a few suggestions, and one of those was trying 2208 powder instead. That was his go-to powder for the .458 and this was one of the things he recommended I try first.
So after buying a bottle I loaded up some Bertram and Winchester cases with the 400gn projectile to see what happened.
As 2208 usually has a lower PSI than 2206H for the same charge, I started with 70gn in both cases and went to the range...

The first thing that was interesting was that even though both the Bertram and Winchester cases had the same case volume (I checked), the Winchester cases showed lower pressure. It took 2gns less powder in the Bertram case to have similar pressure and velocity as the Winchester case. I actually preferred the Winchester cases, as they were less finicky and 70gn of 2208 powder in the Winchester case pushed the 400gn projectile at 2070fps. The cases showed no signs of pressure and just fell out of the chamber.
Now, the velocity was low – but it was a full 7gns under book max, and it was a place to start from. Over the next few sessions I slowly worked up to the book max of 77gns, and this load still showed signs of normal pressure and gave a velocity of 2275fps.
I could go more and start compressing the powder, but I was happy with this load.
From the start I told myself that if I got 2250fps or over, I'd be happy. Firstly, I had a shorter barrel, and secondly, I was confident that a 450gn copper hollowpoint at this speed would be enough for any buffalo I encounter.

So I finally had the load sorted for my .458, 77gn of AR2208 in a Winchester case firing the 400gn Atomic29 projectile at 2275fps. I also had my backup load which was 75gn of AR2208 in a Bertram case which gave the same speed.
Both of these loads delivered 4600 ft/lbs of energy – which would be the least powerful .458 load I've used, but this particular rifle is easily the lightest and handiest .458 I've owned so I'll happily take the trade-off with the shorter barrel and lower velocity.
It also shot well too. I had 6 rounds left on my last trip and wanted to see if that would be enough to get the scope dialled in. I wanted it to be 2" high at 50m and the first 3 were high. The next 2 were low, and the last one was spot on! All I need now is a second shot to confirm, and then I'm all set.



So I'm going to touch wood and say I finally got it sorted. It took a while, and this one fought me more than any other .458 has, or any other rifle has – but I think I got it.
But I am still confused why AR2206H – a powder that I have used many, many times... a powder that has been my go-to powder for the .458... and a powder that I have used for various bullet weights with complete success – didn't perform for me this time?
And I'm also confused why on one day a particular load shot well, and then on the very next day, it didn't?
Interesting...

This rifle is now part of my trio of black rifles that, if dreams were to come true, I would hunt the world with.
These rifles are my Weatherby MkV in .300Wby, my Zastava 425 Express and lastly 'Black Mac' my affectionately named .458 that this story is about.
None of these rifles have beautiful, fancy walnut stocks – and even worse, they are chambered in the dreaded, miserable belted magnum cartridges, but I just love all 3.




All that's left now is a hunt report. I have a booked sambar hunt planned in a month, and depending on the terrain, this just might be the rifle I take.
And if I do take it, just like I've been honest about it so far in this article, I'll be honest about how it goes in the field.
But I'm confident it'll perform well... surely when it comes to this rifle, surely, I'm finally due for some good luck!

Thanks for reading

Russ.

A real diamond in the rough.
Suits you to a tee Russ .

I'm glad you persisted with it and didn't give up.
No, it's no Westley Richards or bespoke custom rifle but it's definitely enough and more than functional and now you have a personal connection with it.

It will, without any doubt whatsoever knock any buffalo you come across into next week so long as you put that pill somewhere vital.
You have a small piece of Australian safari industry history there, carry it and use it with confidence and pride.

P.S you might want to edit your opening post as the next previous owner was Mat Graham, not Cameron.

Thanks for posting.

Hi Russ, glad you came right in the end. Do you have a bore scope or maybe access to one? 2 things come to mind. Maybe you have a carbon ring at the end of the chamber that stages your bullet down and drives up pressure? Maybe also make the bullet unstable. And maybe check the turn rate of your rifling ?

I always have to figure out what causes these anomalies. I would guess the 450 gr coppers are probably similar length to the lead core 510 gr. You would think similar spin rates but perhaps the increased velocity of the lighter projectile.

PaulT said:

A real diamond in the rough.
Suits you to a tee Russ .

I'm glad you persisted with it and didn't give up.
No, it's no Westley Richards or bespoke custom rifle but it's definitely enough and more than functional and now you have a personal connection with it.

It will, without any doubt whatsoever knock any buffalo you come across into next week so long as you put that pill somewhere vital.
You have a small piece of Australian safari industry history there, carry it and use it with confidence and pride.

P.S you might want to edit your opening post as the next previous owner was Mat Graham, not Cameron.

Thanks for posting.

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Oh my gosh, Paul, you're right; I mixed 2 names together!

Of course it's Mat Graham... Matt Cameron was the drummer from Soundgarden/Pearl Jam!

You see, this rifle has taken its toll on me...

And as always mate, thank you for your support.

Russ

Nhoro said:

Hi Russ, glad you came right in the end. Do you have a bore scope or maybe access to one? 2 things come to mind. Maybe you have a carbon ring at the end of the chamber that stages your bullet down and drives up pressure? Maybe also make the bullet unstable. And maybe check the turn rate of your rifling ?

I always have to figure out what causes these anomalies. I would guess the 450 gr coppers are probably similar length to the lead core 510 gr. You would think similar spin rates but perhaps the increased velocity of the lighter projectile.

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Hi mate,

Thank you for your reply. I didn't think of a carbon ring... I'll look into that.

I did consider the rifling twist, as that would make sense about the keyholing. But I also assumed that surely (?) when it was built, they would've chosen a twist to suit a conventional 480-500gn projectile?

But I'll look into that as well, as at my age you think I would've learnt what happens when you assume things...

Russ

Another Sambar smacker, I’m glad it came good in the end.

good job staying with the gun and figuring it out. i suspect your sambar will be a bang, flop kind of hunt when using a 458. i found that it was plenty for black tailed deer!

I see that you like .458 Winchester Magnums, young man.

Someday, you need to get your hands on a Mannlicher Schoenauer in this caliber. Only 77 built in the entire world.

Like @1dirthawker said, kudos for knowing what you like and sticking with it.

Hunter-Habib said:

I see that you like .458 Winchester Magnums, young man.

Someday, you need to get your hands on a Mannlicher Schoenauer in this caliber. Only 77 built in the entire world.
View attachment 800918

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Yes, I guess I do have a soft spot for .458s... even ones that were as frustrating as this one was!

In my humble opinion, the .458WM isn't too big, and it's not too small... they got it just right.
And that's the reason why I've never owned another .458 cartridge (Lott, etc...), I've always been perfectly satisfied with the good old Win Mag.

I really, really like the Mannlicher .458 rifles – and I'm sure a member on here has one...?
I remember reading about his journey with it... hopefully he'll pop in and say hello!

Sheeet.
$7.60 for a 20 box of .458's !

I'd be whacking, packing and stacking buffalo three feet deep with ammo at that cost
Around the same cost per round now.

What's the date on that catalogue H.H ?

PaulT said:

Sheeet.
$7.60 for a 20 box of .458's !

I'd be whacking, packing and stacking buffalo three feet deep with ammo at that cost
Around the same cost per round now.

What's the date on that catalogue H.H ?

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Paul T, this is from 1958. In 1960, Mannlicher began to offer their .458 Winchester Magnum variants with a single trigger too (which is very smart, because you don't want to hunt dangerous game with double set triggers for obvious reasons).

Hunter-Habib said:

Paul T, this is from 1958. In 1960, Mannlicher began to offer their .458 Winchester Magnum variants with a single trigger too (which is very smart, because you don't want to hunt dangerous game with double set triggers for obvious reasons).

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Well it certainly didn't take MS long to see the light, the .458 was only legitimised in 1956.
They were straight on it.
Pity they don't still make them.

I remember reading of one of the more well known Elephant cullers in Zimbabwe relying on the MS as his primary culling tool. I just can't for the life of me remember his name.

Thanks for posting that H.H.

And people say they get into reloading to save money. What are the chances of it shooting well if you had just bought factory loaded ammo?

Glad you got it sorted. Good luck with the Sambar.

PaulT said:

Well it certainly didn't take MS long to see the light, the .458 was only legitimised in 1956.
They were straight on it.
Pity they don't still make them.

I remember reading of one of the more well known Elephant cullers in Zimbabwe relying on the MS as his primary culling tool. I just can't for the life of me remember his name.

Thanks for posting that H.H.

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Richard Harland
Ken Worseley
Donnie Jan Bredenkamp

All three of them were posted at a Park's Station in Rhodesia/Zimbabwe where there was a Mannlicher Schoenauer .458 Winchester Magnum in the armory. I believe all three of them used the very same rifle.

My dearly departed friend and retired Tanzanian white hunter (also Honorary Game Ranger) Terry Irwin had a Mannlicher Schoenauer .458 Winchester Magnum made to order for him in 1964 which he sold in 1993. He shot upwards of a thousand elephant with that rifle (his last elephant being in 1969) and over 300 lions (his last being in 1987). He loved that rifle so much that he used it exclusively for dangerous game hunting.

The late white hunter Paddy Curtis also owned one early in his career before he became a double rifle man.

BeeMaa said:

And people say they get into reloading to save money. What are the chances of it shooting well if you had just bought factory loaded ammo?

Glad you got it sorted. Good luck with the Sambar.

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Hi BeeMaa,

I did try factory ammo – that was the first load I tried in it. I tried Winchester 510gn in the late era silver box just before Winchester stopped making .458 ammo.

I tried it, and it keyholed.
And unfortunately in Australia, apart from Norma and Hornady, there aren't really other options for factory .458 ammunition.
And the price ranges from $238 to $432 a box, so really, reloading is the most practical way... for me at least.

And thank you; I'm so, so happy that it's a shooter now. And I plan to get a sambar to blood it! (For me at least!)

Russ

Badboymelvin said:

Hi BeeMaa,

I did try factory ammo – that was the first load I tried in it. I tried Winchester 510gn in the late era silver box just before Winchester stopped making .458 ammo.

I tried it, and it keyholed.
And unfortunately in Australia, apart from Norma and Hornady, there aren't really other options for factory .458 ammunition.
And the price ranges from $238 to $432 a box, so really, reloading is the most practical way... for me at least.

And thank you; I'm so, so happy that it's a shooter now. And I plan to get a sambar to blood it! (For me at least!)

Russ

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Do you guys get access to Federal or Barnes ?

I remember when I first hunted in Australia in 1975. The most popular brand of ammunition there, was Winchester Australia.

My elder sister's husband worked at the Winchester Australia factory in Geelong back in those days.

Back in those days, the four most popular rifle calibers amongst Australian sportsmen in the Northern Territory were:
.308 Winchester
.303 British
.30-30 Winchester
.458 Winchester Magnum (mostly amongst water buffalo, banteng & scrub bull hunters).

A .30-06 Springfield caliber rifle was a very rare sight at an Australian gun shop back in 1975.

@Badboymelvin,

sounds like the barrel twist is not fast enough to stabilize longer bullets. you could get the twist rate checked and verify it for your peace of mind. that said, i suspect that with a 400 gr mono bullet soft or solid that you will have no problems at all with penetration on anything that walks the planet. have fun with the new rifle.

Hunter-Habib said:

Do you guys get access to Federal or Barnes ?

I remember when I first hunted in Australia in 1975. The most popular brand of ammunition there, was Winchester Australia.

My elder sister's husband worked at the Winchester Australia factory in Geelong back in those days.

Back in those days, the four most popular rifle calibers amongst Australian sportsmen in the Northern Territory were:
.308 Winchester
.303 British
.30-30 Winchester
.458 Winchester Magnum (mostly amongst water buffalo, banteng & scrub bull hunters).

A .30-06 Springfield caliber rifle was a very rare sight at an Australian gun shop back in 1975.

Click to expand...

I live in Geelong and l knew quite a few people who worked at Winchester - when it was thriving down here…
They made all the .22 PowerPoint ammo that was so highly regarded in the day.
I think Winchester are still operating down here, but nothing like they used to be… :-(

Rusd