Choosing a rifle for a Saskatchewan Bull Moose Hunt - Input Requested

Took a young bull.one year with a .257Roberts IMP with a 100gr. Partition@ 3,480fps. Worked like a charm.

Longwalker said:

You have your "perfect" moose rifle right there. Sako .338. Handy powerful rifle, good scope, and you said you prefer to shoot good controlled expansion bullets in it, so problem solved!
FWIW, I've shot most of my moose with a .308, which was perfect for how I hunt Saskatchewan moose. I've also used 7x57, .30-06, .35 Whelen, .375 H&H, and .45-400 3". Can't say i've actually noticed much difference in effectiveness. But stay away from Hornady SST bullets, and similar types of fast expansion designs. Those things are fragile, make shallow wounds, and are a very poor moose bullet.

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I cannot argue with you at all about the 338. I have used them on a number of game animals and they have all just dropped, no matter which bullet I happened to be using on a given day. The 338 is simply a hammer. But, mine is a good 200-300y rifle with the 1-8x scope. I just lack the confidence in it for longer shots. I will probably take it on the Moose trip but plan to also take the 7mm Mag.

I will play at the range with both at the 300 and 400y tgts. I have not had much luck shooting the 338 past 300y and avoided wasting ammo this winter trying. The 7mm on the other hand is a true 1/2moa rifle with a number of loads and makes long range shooting pretty easy. I need more experience with the 338 at longer ranges before I would consider using it on game that far out. The Sako is a great rifle but is just more picky. It would benefit from hand loading but I do not have the dies for that today.

I also agree with you about the SST. It is an OK deer bullet or for other thin skinned game. I have found it to be even better with the larger calibers. However, for tougher game, I prefer a bonded bullet or a copper mono.

The 7mm is actually a titanium clone of the Sako 85 action, so it has all of the good features of the Sako all rolled into a semi custom package.

The 7mm Mag is more accurate, and has a better optic and is a proven 400y rifle for me that I have more confidence in for longer shots. For live game, I much prefer keeping the shots closer but from what I can learn so far about the hunting terrain on the Cree Nation Rez, it seems to be a lot of open farm land and river bottoms with some wind breaks and other wooded zones. Moose is a big tgt and from what I have gathered, they are not much harder to kill than a whitetail deer as long as the bullet is tough enough to penetrate the larger animal with the larger bone structure. A 160g 7mm Mag trophy bonded bullet or Barnes mono at 2950 fps is not going to be much different than a 200g 338 trophy bonded at 2930 fps or a 225g TTSX at 2850fps. At 500y they both have almost identical velocity at about 2070 fps. And really, I would not take a shot that long. I do like to practice at ranges that far exceed my planned max hunting distance but that is only to boost my confidence when I do get good shots on game. My only complaint with the 7mm is that it is looong. I think it has a 26" bbl and that does detract from its handy nature. The 338 has a 24" bbl which is also long and it weighs about 1.5lb more.

Dhutson said:

The one that you shoot the best. And, if your guide or yourself cant get closer than 350-400 yards to a moose, you aren't a very good hunter. Hunting is about how close you can get to make a good clean kill, not how far you can shoot.

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The recent “prerequisite” to be able to shoot to 400 yards for moose hunting seems to be gaining popularity, though here on the east side the outfitters just want you zero at 100 yds and maybe a 200 yd shot at maximum presents itself.

JG26Irish_2 said:

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The attached photo is a 3shot grp fired from the Husqvarna 30-06 at 400y from a bench. It measured 2.25". Just because we can make a 400y shot does not mean we should take one. I generally limit my shots on game to the distance where my bullet's impact velocity drops below 2000fps. That is about 400y for this rifle but I further limit my shots on game to a range that is well less than that which I use for practice on tgts. Most situations for me make that limit closer to 300y since I usually do not have a bench rest to help me in hunting situations. When possible, I get closer. That insures a clean, quick kill, with less tracking involved.

I know many hunters take game at longer ranges and good for them. That is not my MO. We always have a choice when taking or passing on a shot. I care little if I kill an animal or not when hunting. For me, the fun is in the preparation and execution of the hunt. The actual shot is rather academic and is the sad period at the end of the story.

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Here on the east side up until a few years ago I still hunted exclusively peep sights, and even then we zero at 50 yards but practice out to 100.
Now that I’ve delved into scope world, 300 seems to be a good MAX.
I’ve shot further but I’ll tell you what, in Montana on a spring bear hunt we had a bear 420 yards, it didn’t even feel like hunting.
I got to 180 yards and one shot through the vitals is all it took.
Some of us are used to hunting further and some of us are up close and personal kind of hunters.

Last week of September to end of 1st week of October, called in to 10yards - easy peazy.
300yard shot, 300 WTBY 180gr. and a 10 yard shot with a bow. The 300yard shot was anti-climatic, while the 10 yard shot will never fade from memory.

Daryl S said:

Last week of September to end of 1st week of October, called in to 10yards - easy peazy.
300yard shot, 300 WTBY 180gr. and a 10 yard shot with a bow. The 300yard shot was anti-climatic, while the 10 yard shot will never fade from memory.

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The closer the better, the adrenaline leaves a mark in the memory to never be forgotten!

45-70guy said:

The recent “prerequisite” to be able to shoot to 400 yards for moose hunting seems to be gaining popularity, though here on the east side the outfitters just want you zero at 100 yds and maybe a 200 yd shot at maximum presents itself.

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I understand. I am from the Eastern woods of KY and until a few years back had mostly only hunted in KY, WV and a little in East TN. The longest shot I had made on big game was 200y and change and only shot a varmints for longer shots. The vast majority was <100y. I know out West things can be different but it is still a bit foreign to me. Normally, all of my hunting rifles are zeroed at 200y and that makes most of them 2" high at 100, zero out to 250 or so, and a couple or three inches low at 300 and honestly, I never shoot further if I can help it. The longest shot ever on a non-varmint game animal was 314y. I have taken prairie dogs out to 575y but that is a different situation. Coyotes and other similar size varmints out to 400y but normally, I take my deer at less than 100y. So yeah, I get it. I also agree that if I have only a shot at 500y, I will pass as I should be able to get closer. Still, if the terrain is wide open, it seems prudent to practice and take a rifle capable of longer shots than I plan to take during the hunt. When I take a shot on game, I like to know that I can make the shot because I have done it before, over and over. Not, I think I can. "I know I can".

JG26Irish_2 said:

I understand. I am from the Eastern woods of KY and until a few years back had mostly only hunted in KY, WV and a little in East TN. The longest shot I had made on big game was 200y and change and only shot a varmints for longer shots. The vast majority was <100y. I know out West things can be different but it is still a bit foreign to me. Normally, all of my hunting rifles are zeroed at 200y and that makes most of them 2" high at 100, zero out to 250 or so, and a couple or three inches low at 300 and honestly, I never shoot further if I can help it. The longest shot ever on a non-varmint game animal was 314y. I have taken prairie dogs out to 575y but that is a different situation. Coyotes and other similar size varmints out to 400y but normally, I take my deer at less than 100y. So yeah, I get it. I also agree that if I have only a shot at 500y, I will pass as I should be able to get closer. Still, if the terrain is wide open, it seems prudent to practice and take a rifle capable of longer shots than I plan to take during the hunt. When I take a shot on game, I like to know that I can make the shot because I have done it before, over and over. Not, I think I can. "I know I can".

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True, I believe just like in archery you should at least practice further than your anticipated shot distance so as to make those shots in the range seem like a cake walk.

All this discussion about shooting moose at long distances with a precision rifle is misguided. In my experience it is irrelevant and distracting. What matters is being able to shoot quickly, accurately, FROM FIELD POSITIONS, and supported only by sticks, resting alongside a tree, kneeling, or offhand.

Your effective range is the range at which you can place all your bullets in a paper plate, quickly, with no dithering and no fumbling. The handling qualities of your rifle matter way more than its accuracy off a bench. Next most important is the quality of the bullets you're using. Deep penetrating, controlled expansion bullets are far superior to a fragile bullet that may be a little more accurate.

After your rifle is sighted in, for maximum point blank range, step away from the bench rest. Shoot only off hand, or from sticks, or kneeling or sitting as you practise. Even better, have someone with a stop watch time your response from "shoot" to the bullet hitting that pie plate. Accurate is good, but fast and accurate is better! I've killed several moose that would have been lost if I was not able to take a quick, aimed shot at the animal as it trotted across a clearing but paused momentarily before it disappeared into thick bush.

Which rifle you choose only matters if it helps you shoot a good bullet with a minimum of fuss and bother. Leave the attached bipods at home, range finders too. If you think you need a range finder the moose can be stalked closer.

Use the one that you shoot most accurately. A good bullet is what counts.

Longwalker said:

All this discussion about shooting moose at long distances with a precision rifle is misguided. In my experience it is irrelevant and distracting. What matters is being able to shoot quickly, accurately, FROM FIELD POSITIONS, and supported only by sticks, resting alongside a tree, kneeling, or offhand.

Your effective range is the range at which you can place all your bullets in a paper plate, quickly, with no dithering and no fumbling. The handling qualities of your rifle matter way more than its accuracy off a bench. Next most important is the quality of the bullets you're using. Deep penetrating, controlled expansion bullets are far superior to a fragile bullet that may be a little more accurate.

After your rifle is sighted in, for maximum point blank range, step away from the bench rest. Shoot only off hand, or from sticks, or kneeling or sitting as you practise. Even better, have someone with a stop watch time your response from "shoot" to the bullet hitting that pie plate. Accurate is good, but fast and accurate is better! I've killed several moose that would have been lost if I was not able to take a quick, aimed shot at the animal as it trotted across a clearing but paused momentarily before it disappeared into thick bush.

Which rifle you choose only matters if it helps you shoot a good bullet with a minimum of fuss and bother. Leave the attached bipods at home, range finders too. If you think you need a range finder the moose can be stalked closer.

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You had me until...leave the rangefinder at home.

A rangerfinder should be the second most important item after choice of weapon and ammo.

Had a fellow archery shooter at a 3D tournament. He joked about misjudging a 3D life-size elk by 20 yards and still hitting it. He misjudged the elk target by 20 yards and missed it. The elk target was 40 yards away.

I was muzzleloading black bear forgot my rangefinder back at the truck. Two black bears came up the other side of the open draw from me. I misjudged at them at 80+ yards and beyond my range with my 61.5 cal smoothbore flintlock. They were at +/- 58 yards well within my range.

First 2 trips to Africa I relied on my PHs to judge the animals ranges. Missed several animals because they misjudged to distances over 150 yards. Since then past 100 yards they use my rangefinder and I make the shot.

A rangefinder and 2 extra batteries is a must have item.

My best friend in Alaaka borrowed my 338 win mag model 70 with a boss .It shot 3/4 inch at 200 yards with speer 250 gr grandslam bullets .He shot 7 moose dead in their tracks from 15 yarda to 350 yards all flopped over dead .He had used 3006 before and said ir would take 5 to 7 shots per moose .He did shoot a charging grizzly that took 7 shots with 338 win mag tough animals .My 338s do not like hornady bullets or ammo or nosler accubonds .They do like nosler partitions , speer grand slams , winchester power points .Moose are usually near water lots of times and you want to drop them before they get in water or you have a hard job cleaning them .

Longwalker said:

All this discussion about shooting moose at long distances with a precision rifle is misguided. In my experience it is irrelevant and distracting. What matters is being able to shoot quickly, accurately, FROM FIELD POSITIONS, and supported only by sticks, resting alongside a tree, kneeling, or offhand.

Your effective range is the range at which you can place all your bullets in a paper plate, quickly, with no dithering and no fumbling. The handling qualities of your rifle matter way more than its accuracy off a bench. Next most important is the quality of the bullets you're using. Deep penetrating, controlled expansion bullets are far superior to a fragile bullet that may be a little more accurate.

After your rifle is sighted in, for maximum point blank range, step away from the bench rest. Shoot only off hand, or from sticks, or kneeling or sitting as you practise. Even better, have someone with a stop watch time your response from "shoot" to the bullet hitting that pie plate. Accurate is good, but fast and accurate is better! I've killed several moose that would have been lost if I was not able to take a quick, aimed shot at the animal as it trotted across a clearing but paused momentarily before it disappeared into thick bush.

Which rifle you choose only matters if it helps you shoot a good bullet with a minimum of fuss and bother. Leave the attached bipods at home, range finders too. If you think you need a range finder the moose can be stalked closer.

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Not applying only to moose, but that’s what many guides now claim as a “prerequisite”.
One guide told me that I should be able to shoot out to 400 yards, I asked him if that’s necessary to hunt them that far.
I mentioned at the time the farthest I had ever shot was 200 yards and to be clear I’ve never seen an animal past 100 on the entire east side of the country.

He said it would allow for more opportunities shooting across some of the ponds.

So clearly the push is to be as effective as possible but that kills much of the “hunt” experience as our forefathers experienced years back.

200 yards shooting an animal was far enough to pay attention to the shot, sitting on a cliff side , basically leaning/standing from sliding down.
But it was close enough the bear could sense me/ use his senses.
It may also be the fact I can go on a hunt and not take an animal and still get the full experience and want to come back.
Seems like most guys are rushed and on a time limit to tag an animal and get out

I have only bagged a few moose in my life, but all with the cartridge 9,3x64 Brenneke. I am not so sure if you need such a large caliber, because other hunters have achieved the same results with the cartridge 30-06 Springfield.

7mm with the Barnes ammo, 168 LRX is excellent.
338 win mag with 225 TTSX.
Either will do the job at the range you are talking about

Ridge Runner said:

You had me until...leave the rangefinder at home.

First 2 trips to Africa I relied on my PHs to judge the animals ranges. Missed several animals because they misjudged to distances over 150 yards. Since then past 100 yards they use my rangefinder and I make the shot.

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I think his point was that out to about 300y with most rifles, the shot is more or less point blank and a range finder is less of a necessity. I know they can be useful, but it is not a total fail safe either.

In Africa, my PH and I would play a game that went like this.... I would ask, How far do you think it is to that tree line? He would replay, Oh about 500y. Then I would estimate it to be 475y and we would laser it to see who got the closest. I noticed that at his main concession where he hunted the most, he was much better than when on a different concession. I am terrible at judging range out past about 200y since most of my hunting is closer then that. At 350-450y I can be off as much as 80y if the terrain is very open and there are not many objects to use to help judge the distance.

I recall that in Africa in the Free State we were prepping for a shot and as I mounted the sticks, I judged the range to be close to 400y. I asked the PH to judge it and then laser it. He judged 450y but the laser said 314y. 300y was still within my rifle's max range so we began readying for the shot. He lasered it a 2nd time and confirmed the distance to be 314-320y. I aimed about 0.5mil to allow for drop and sent the shot. It killed the animal but the point of impact was much lower than expected. Turned out the tall grass in front of the prey had given us a false reading with the laser and we would have been better off trusting our judgement as the actual range was closer to 425y. I was "Lucky" to have been shooting a fairly flat shooting rifle which save me from a bad outcome.

Point being we sometimes rely too much on tech aids. I have taken to using my laser to range my surroundings when still hunting as soon as I arrive so it is not needed later. I also use it to fine tune my visual judgment so that most shots do not require its use in the field so much.

JG26Irish_2 said:

I think his point was that out to about 300y with most rifles, the shot is more or less point blank and a range finder is less of a necessity. I know they can be useful, but it is not a total fail safe either.

In Africa, my PH and I would play a game that went like this.... I would ask, How far do you think it is to that tree line? He would replay, Oh about 500y. Then I would estimate it to be 475y and we would laser it to see who got the closest. I noticed that at his main concession where he hunted the most, he was much better than when on a different concession. I am terrible at judging range out past about 200y since most of my hunting is closer then that. At 350-450y I can be off as much as 80y if the terrain is very open and there are not many objects to use to help judge the distance.

I recall that in Africa in the Free State we were prepping for a shot and as I mounted the sticks, I judged the range to be close to 400y. I asked the PH to judge it and then laser it. He judged 450y but the laser said 314y. 300y was still within my rifle's max range so we began readying for the shot. He lasered it a 2nd time and confirmed the distance to be 314-320y. I aimed about 0.5mil to allow for drop and sent the shot. It killed the animal but the point of impact was much lower than expected. Turned out the tall grass in front of the prey had given us a false reading with the laser and we would have been better off trusting our judgement as the actual range was closer to 425y. I was "Lucky" to have been shooting a fairly flat shooting rifle which save me from a bad outcome.

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It's not just tall grass; fog, limbs, leaves, and brush also throws a rangefinder off. Rangefinders aren't fool proof. But they are an aid in deciding if the animal is inside or outside a hunter's shooting comfort zone.

JG26Irish_2 said:

Point being we sometimes rely too much on tech aids. I have taken to using my laser to range my surroundings when still hunting as soon as I arrive so it is not needed later. I also use it to fine tune my visual judgment so that most shots do not require its use in the field so much.

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+1 ....I do the same especially when archery hunting and shotguning turkeys.

Excellent collection of rifles, and every single one of them is up to the task. I wish I could answer your question but if I were in your shoes I’d be in the same dilemma.

JG26Irish_2 said:

My 338wm Barnes load is fast and is still running 2402fps at 300y. The 200g Fed load is 2366fps at 300y. Both still exceed 2000fps at 400y as well. They hit hard. I hit a Nilgai at 237y off sticks with the Barnes load and shot a coyote with the 200g load at about 150y which nearly tore him in half.

I want to take the 7mm Mag but only because it is more accurate and works well at longer ranges. It is not as fast as the 338 with the heavier bullets. 2680fps MV for the 175g Fusion load and 2950fps for the 160g TTSX load.

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Go for it ! 7mm Mag is good medicine.

archer36 said:

Use the one that you shoot most accurately. A good bullet is what counts.

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archer36, you're a bow hunter so I hope you don't take offence at my rant. You know what works from your experience while bow hunting ! And I mostly agree.

I disagree most emphatically with the actual wording of this statement. Sorry, but moose are not paper targets. And they are very large!

I can agree that bullet placement in an animal is MOST important, BUT the performance of a bullet IN the game the size of moose is far more important than any amount of fractional accuracy claims on paper.

In my woefully limited experience, the results of a bullet placed somewhere in a Moose's rather large vital area, depends not on that bullets precision, but on it's ability to hit the vitals, expand enough to do considerable damage along the way, and penetrate deeply - on a very large animal. "A good bullet is what counts" Yes!

Ability to hit large bone and continue on to the original purpose are prerequisites, Not an addendum.

Way too many hunters parrot accuracy as a goal. Effectiveness takes a back seat, due to inexperience of the practical realities. 95% of all moose are shot at under 200 meters. Precision accuracy is irrelevant if a bullet is not up to the task of hitting bone and continuing on to destroy the vital organs.

AND the ability to shoot a hole in a moose to begin with has much more to do with hunting ability, athletics and training than any amount of a rifles' accuracy off a bench rest.