KYRGYZSTAN: WARNING: International Hunts Beware Of Scam With Aska-Tur Europa & Extrem-Tours

[Gregoire Girard]

International hunts: avoiding SCAM
Like several other hunters who dealt with Aska-Tur and Extrem-Tours, I never received my Marco Polo trophy, fully paid including the shipping, that I shot more than 2 years ago in Kyrgyzstan. At the end of the hunt I wanted to take my trophy with me but Adilet insisted he would ship it in three weeks time, which he never did.
While I was waiting in vain for my trophy, three other hunters barely escaped FRAUD with the same Igor Kantsev, Adilet (Adyl) Ulukmanov and his father Ulan. Here are the e-mails they exchanged, with my comments. I have modified the names of the hunters and their e-mail addresses but I have not edited Igor and Adilet English.
I have lost track of these swindlers and I don’t know if they are still operating under different names and in other countries: be careful.
From Paul, a prospective hunter, to Aska-Tur Europa (Aug 5, 2013)
Hello
We are three hunters that are considering a trip in October or November to hunt for Marco Polo and Ibex. To help us in our decision would it be possible to answer the following questions:
Are the dates available? How many hunters you had last fall for these two species? What was their success and the size of their trophies? Were there any problems these hunters encountered? Can I communicate with them? What would be the total cost for the two species? What is the method of payment for the hunt?
Appreciate your help,
Paul
From: Aska-Tur EUROPA Date: Monday, August 5, 2013 Hello Paul! Thanks for e-mail. Are you from USA? If you american hunters, so we need privide the import permitsfor USA For other countries you need only CITES for Kyrgyzstan and lizenz , but for USA you need the import permit from USFWS. Do you whant to take 3 argalie an 3 ibexes? Yes you can have references from hunters. I am just out of house and will send information tomorrow. I need the information about : 1. physical condition of hunters 2. did you hunted in the mountans? horsrback? 3. the possible shot distance Best regards Igor
My comments:
Please notice that the question by Paul: “Were there any problems these hunters encountered?” has been ignored, even though at least three hunters that I know of were arrested by the Kyrgyz police at the end of their hunt with Aska-tur.
Hi Igor, (08-09)
We are Canadian hunters, middle aged, in good physical condition, we can shoot and ride horse back; we plan to take 3 argalies and 3 Ibexes. We are waiting to receive the list of the hunters that hunted with Aska-Tur in Kyrgyzstan last fall, with their success and size of trophies. Please respond to our questions. We are especially interested in knowing of any potential problems (i.e. importing of firearms, hunting, trophy shipping). We will communicate with these hunters and would also like to write directly to your local Kyrgyz partner.
Appreciate your help,
Paul
Dear Paul, (Aug 18)
My name is Adilet; I'm an outfitter from Kyrgyzstan. Please accept my apologies for the delay in response. I was very busy with preparations for the beginning of the hunting season 2013. On the first day of new season (Aug 15th) group of Ibex hunters arrived.
As my partner in Germany Igor told me you are interested in mixed hunt Marco Polo/Ibex. What exact dates is comfortable for you? I think we can discuss and find the proper date for your group. Last year we did not have much clients for mixed hunt, I think it is due to world economy. There are more people willing to hunt Ibex then the sheep. The size of the trophies vary about 42-49 inches.
Our Firm is providing with all documents for a legal hunting as follows: • Gun import permit, • Veterinary certificate, • Kyrgyzstan export permission, • Re-export permission (CITES). • Hunting Protocol • Trophy list
The price for Marco Polo/Ibex tour is 18 500 $ USD
The price include: (Prices quoted are for 1 person)

• Meeting at the airport
• Land transportation
• Marco Polo/Ibex Permit
• Gun import permit
• All documents for the export of the trophy (Kyrgyz CITES, Kyrgyzstan export permission, Trophy List, Hunting protocol, Veterinary Certificate etc.)
• Processing and packing trophy

• Accommodation in camp
• Meals in camp
• Guides and horses
• Interpreters

The price not includes:

• All airfares
• Tips-Trip insurance
• Excess baggage charges and gratuities
• Airline changes
• Hotel in Bishkek

Here are the list of hunters you can contact to:
Joseph XXX (Canada) XXXjoseph@YYYY.ca
Vince XXX (USA) vinceXXX@austin.YY.ZZZ
Jay XXX (USA) jXXX@humbleYYY.ZZZ
Mike XXX (New Zealand) myk.XXX@YYYY.co.nz
Please feel free to e-mail me anytime with comments or additional details. I'm happy to answer your questions or provide you with any additional information you might need.
I look forward to hearing from you! My Very Best Regards,
Adileta.ulukmanov@gmail.com (Aug 18)
My comments:
The question : “We are waiting to receive the list of the hunters that hunted with Aska-Tur in Kyrgyzstan last fall, with their success and size of trophies” has been answered partially, with a list of chosen references.
The other question : “We are especially interested in knowing of any potential problems (i.e. importing of firearms, hunting, trophy shipping)” has been ignored.
Hello Adilet (Aug 19)
We have no exact dates and will let you choose the best. The price of 18 500 $ USD per hunter is OK. Sheep is our main target and we expect to see good numbers of them; the size you mention (up to 49 inches) is OK.
Before we send almost 60 000 $ we have to repeat a few questions, if you please.
We want the list of your hunters from August to December (above all sheep hunters but also Ibex) with their individual success, including size of trophy. We will decide which ones we will contact.
We want to know if any of them experienced any problem, more precisely if all of them got their trophies home in good condition, without any legal hassle; also what is your normal delay to ship the trophies.
We want to know the method of payment.
We want to know if Extrem-Tours and your company are licensed and bonded; if affirmative, we want to know the license number and the amount of the bond.
Once we will have cleared these important points we will be ready to discuss the dates, book the hunt and send you a deposit.
Thank you,
Paul
Hi Paul, (Aug 24) - Except my German partner Igor (Extrem - Tours) I also have US partner. This two partnerships are quite differs. With Igor we are working as a one team - our price is the same (USD$ 18 500) and in this case I have a chance to contact with clients from him before the hunt, also after the hunt I can use those clients for reference. With my American partner is another story, as we have our own set price just between me and US agent, so I have no idea the final price. Last time I was in Reno on SCI convention it was about USD$ 25 000 for the same hunt on my hunting areas. Also it is not allowed for me to use those hunters for the reference. After last advertising Igor gave on US market (USD$ 17 000) my US partner is not happy. I'll give you the list of hunters only from Igor. I'll attache some pictures from the last fall with my clients from American partner, but I'm sorry to say that you can't contact to them (as I do not have their contact details) or perhaps you will recognize somebody and you know him personally and in this case you can contact to. As the hunting world is so small. Stefan XXX (Germany) Aug 20-31/2012 - XXX@web.de
Group of 4 Austrian Ibex Hunters Sept 2012 (Franz XXX, Josef XXX, Dietmar XXX and Dietmar XXY) Only two hunters speak English. They are: Dietmar XXX -dietmar.XXX@Ztelekom.yy Dietmar XXY - XXY@aon.zz
Mixed group of 3 hunters Oct 2012 (Jay XXX USA - jXXX@humbleYYY.ZZ, Nougzar XXX USA - nXXX@msn.zzz, Mike XXX New Zealand - myk.XXX@yyyy.Z.nz,) Ben (fake name)XXX USA Nov 2012 - contact to Judy (fake name) XXX - YYYXXX@hotmail.com During the last fall there were also 8 Danish hunters for Ibex. I'll attache photos of US hunters Marty XXX and Richard XXX they are hunted in Oct 2012. - Some of those hunters took their trophies with them in a luggage, some were shipped after the hunt. [...] Usually shipping procedure happens in a month after the hunt. It depends on the number of hunters during the season. For example last year I had a lot of EU hunters and according the European legislation if there is a skin it is not allowed to import the trophy with luggage, as it should be dry salted and the date should be no less then 14 days after taking the trophy. [...]
- It is required 10% of deposit from the hunt cost for booking of the hunt (according the contract) by wire transfer on my bank account or my partners account. There is a service fee and trophy fee (refund) in the contract. Service fee is usually paid by couple of transfers (as comfortable to hunter) and trophy fee can be paid after the hunt by cash upon harvest. - My companies hunting license is - # 2462-3304-OOO and my company is not bonded. I should ask Igor about his company. Also my company has special ID number (TO-001) and accredited in EU health Authorities which allows me to export game trophies to EU. (It means that my company is legal and absolutely safe) Best Regards,
Adilet Ulukmanov Aug 24
My comments:
The question : “We want the list of your hunters from August to December (above all sheep hunters but also Ibex) with their individual success, including size of trophy... We will decide which ones we will contact” has been answered maliciously and the size of the trophy taken is not given. Adilet has removed from the list the names of hunters that could be unsatisfied! My roommate at the camp, Ben (fake name), is on the reference list, but not me! In spite of what Ben says to other hunters who trust him as a reference, he did not shoot any Ibex on that hunt (he told me the Ibex trophy he received was a gift from Adilet) and his nice sheep measured 36 inches.
The following question: “We want to know if any of them experienced any problem, more precisely if all of them got their trophies home in good condition, without any legal hassle” has been ignored; for the other part : “also what is your normal delay to ship the trophies”, Adilet answers: “Usually shipping procedure happens in a month after the hunt.” Yes Adilet writes that the shipping usually takes ONE month. At the moment of this writing, it is more than two years that I have been waiting for my trophy; Adilet has refused to explain the delay, has not told me when he would ship my trophy and for more than one year he has ignored my e-mails and phone calls; it also seems he has moved to an unknown address.
Adilet writes: “With Igor we are working as a one team” but he does not know if Igor company is licensed and bonded! Trying to communicate with Igor has brought no results.
As for his company being “legal and absolutely safe”, I beg to disagree.
Hello Adilet (08-26)
Thank you for the information and the pictures; we are close to booking and the end of October will be our choice if possible, otherwise we can work out another date.
I am sending a couple of e-mails to your references; in the meanwhile I still want to know :
Is Igor company Extrem-Tours licensed and bonded?
Who is your American partner? Is he licensed and bonded?
Regards,
Paul
Hi Paul, (09-3) As soon as you will do the exact decision about the hunt we can discuss the exact schedule for your group. I'm not sure if Igor's company is bonded but he should have a license number for sure. I'll contact to him and will find out about it. I'm sorry to say that at this moment I may not give you my American partners details as it is trade secret. Thank you for your understanding. Best Regards, Adilet Ulukmanov
My comments:
Again Adilet is not sure about his partner Igor company, although he tells hunters that they can send their money either to Igor or to himself (Adilet).
As for his American partners, it is a trade secret!
Hello Adilet (Sept 03)
I have spoken with the other two hunters of my group and we are unanimous on the following:
-We cannot imagine that you don’t know if your partner Igor is licensed or not; if he is, we want to know his license number, and in which country he is registered. We will check this information.
-We cannot believe that your American partner identity is a trade secret. We want to know who he is, his license number, if he is bonded and for what amount. We will also check this information.
Failure to provide this information will put an end to our correspondence.
Paul
My comments:
Adilet never responded to this last message so this was the end of the e-mail exchange between Paul the prospective hunter and Igor / Adilet.
I have learned lately of a dozen hunters that lost their money and their trophies with Adilet; as you can imagine, their names are not on the reference list.
Adilet also robbed the hunters of his US partner, in spite of the fact that this person put him and his father Ulan in business more than a dozen years ago! Also, it seems that Adilet and his father Ulan have not paid their crew and owe money to many people. As for me, I will try to forget my Marco Polo trophy, fully paid including the licence and the shipping.
Hoping my writing will help you in avoiding the sharks that swim around the international hunters.
------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[ROCKET]

Is He the same Igor that was selling some hunts for that place, here in this site not soo far time a go......??

I really sorry about your lost.

 

[Gregoire Girard]

Is He the same Igor that was selling some hunts for that place, here in this site not soo far time a go......??

I really sorry about your lost.

Yes, the same Igor Kantsev living in Ingolstadt, Germany, also known as Ibexhunter and Profyhunter . Igor could still operate in other countries, Under another name and with other partners.
GG

 

[AfricaHunting.com]

ibexhunter is banned from AfricaHunting.com and all of his hunts on offer posted in the GREAT DEALS on Hunts Worldwide section of AH have the following mention at top:

WARNING: ibexhunter (aka Igor Kantsev (Germany) and profyhunter) of Extrem Tours and Hunting Club Taiga who is also affiliated with Adilet Ulukmanov (Kyrgyzstan) and Aska-Tur, has been banned from AfricaHunting.com.

 

[gizmo]

Sheesh what a mess, I am new to the whole international trip thing. I went to Brazil in October to fish and will be going to Africa and Romania over the next two years. I feel I did my homework and actually changed bookings on my trip to Africa after I felt I was given a not so good deal on the first. I am very happy with the choice of outfitters I have made and no problems have come up so far. This kind of stuff you are reporting scares the hell out of me though because often it seems people dont find out until its to late they've been had.

 

[gizmo]

I will say though that is what I really love about this site. I feel confident in booking with the regular members here that have been on the site for a while. As a matter of fact I booked our trip to Romania with Horia on this site and so far have been very pleased with everything. I'm weary of the fly by night guys that post an offer and only have a handful of posts total but often many people either know them or have hunted with them before and can vouch for them Thats what makes this site so great. Also, once a swindler is brought to light they are immdiately shunned and banned. Great group of folks here there is! I'm sorry that you got screwed but I can assure you that in any future trips you may want to take you needn't look any further than the good folks of AH.com

 

[Witold Krzyżanowski]

Scammers are everywhere.
Witold

 

[mykc]

Hi Gregoire,
I seem to have been dragged into something that has nothing to do with me( the email link still goes through to me).
Yes I had a good hunt with Adilet. I shot a nice ibex, saw a lot of animals, had good Guides and was able to take my trophy home with me. I didn't ask or offer to be a reference for Adilet but if I am contacted regarding my hunt I say how my hunt went, I don't think that there would be to many outfitters that would use someone that didn't have a good hunt as a reference.
I returned from my second trip to Kyrgyzstan in November. For this trip I used a booking agent and booked a Marco Polo hunt with a different outfitter who had a good reputation and no bad hunt reports, unfortunately this still did not stop the hunt turning into a disaster , we are still trying to get it sorted out.
Sadly I think Kyrgyzstan is just one of those country's that carries a higher chance of something going wrong than other hunting destinations. Now if I am contacted by another hunter wanting to go there I tell them don't go unless you can cope with the hunt ending badly.

Mike.

 

[Gregoire Girard]

Hi Gregoire,
I seem to have been dragged into something that has nothing to do with me( the email link still goes through to me).
Yes I had a good hunt with Adilet. I shot a nice ibex, saw a lot of animals, had good Guides and was able to take my trophy home with me. I didn't ask or offer to be a reference for Adilet but if I am contacted regarding my hunt I say how my hunt went, I don't think that there would be to many outfitters that would use someone that didn't have a good hunt as a reference.
I returned from my second trip to Kyrgyzstan in November. For this trip I used a booking agent and booked a Marco Polo hunt with a different outfitter who had a good reputation and no bad hunt reports, unfortunately this still did not stop the hunt turning into a disaster , we are still trying to get it sorted out.
Sadly I think Kyrgyzstan is just one of those country's that carries a higher chance of something going wrong than other hunting destinations. Now if I am contacted by another hunter wanting to go there I tell them don't go unless you can cope with the hunt ending badly.

Mike.

Hello Mike
When did you hunt with Adilet? From what I know he started frauding people around fall 2012. If you hunted with him prior to this date it will explain your good experience with him. Like a few other hunters I had my bad experience after this date and in November 2013 Adilet even frauded his former US agent clients. Now it seems Adilet has moved away from Bishkek and I am not the only one looking for him.
I had a wonderful hunt in Kyrgyzstan in 2010 with another company. I hope you will be able to sort out your problem.
G

 

[mykc]

My hunt was in October 2012, I think we were the next group after the group that got arrested, so I think we just got lucky.
When I was there in November I asked a few people if they knew of Adilet, none of them had heard of him at all so I don't think he is still in the hunting industry any more.

Mike.

 

[Gregoire Girard]

My hunt was in October 2012, I think we were the next group after the group that got arrested, so I think we just got lucky.
When I was there in November I asked a few people if they knew of Adilet, none of them had heard of him at all so I don't think he is still in the hunting industry any more.

Mike.

Thank you Mike for the information.
Yes, I think you were very Lucky, indeed.
Good luck with your present problem.
G