Why avoid Hornady DG bullets and ammunition?

Discussion in 'Firearms & Ammunition' started by Paul Edwards, Jun 21, 2017.

  1. TTundra

    TTundra AH Enthusiast

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    Again, this post was outlining another post specific to defects and establishing their point of origin. It does not matter what brand you buy if their is a chink in the manufacturing process for that specific PO. Every manufacturer will have a defective product come off their line at one point or another. Determining that defect and where it originated is essential, and sometimes it is a consumer error rather than manufacturing. That's goes for the best rifle and ammo manufacturers as well. I doubt there is a single manufacture that hasn't at one time had to deal with a defect, and obviously in mass production it's more common.

    My rod company holds 248 IGFA records, so I think I know a little about blue water fishing and quality. I know that it's not always the products fault and the adage "the customer is always right" is marketing and not product performance.

    Also again, it is clear to everyone how you feel about Hornady DG ammunition, it's been stated multiple times. However, many consumers like Hornady and will use them their hunts and that is their prerogative. You simply do not need to quote every post and state the same rhetoric. You would do better providing images of failed product, hunt date, specific info, etc; especially new images and not ones already circulated. That is what consumers like and need to see.
     
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  2. fourfive8

    fourfive8 AH Fanatic

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    Problem with certain of Hornady's bullet designs is not a one of problem originating on the assembly line during the manufacture of a specific lot. It is a BASIC design flaw of the design itself and has been known by Hornady and ignored by Hornady for years- and with one bullet design I can remember dating back at least 30 40 years! I remember this same type discussion that long ago with people reporting to Hornady that one of their main line, heavily marketed big game hunting bullets was subject to gross fragmentation and core separation.... Hornady's official arrogant response that I saw in print was something like, "not considered a failure.... dead is dead isn't it?". I had that experience with one of that design in the 70's and never looked back nor used another Hornady because other, far superior premium big game bullets were coming into the market at that time. Fast forward to fairly recently the reported issues with their DG series of bullets proved yet again how arrogant Hornady is/was by how slow it was in responding to valid complaints based on demonstrable design flaws (not rhetoric!) and then finally changing the basic design of that line of bullets. In the end why even mess with them with sooooo many superior bullets available?
     
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  3. Hoss Delgado

    Hoss Delgado AH Fanatic

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    This is very true. I would like to use Renowned ( now sadly departed ) PH Harry Selby as an example. As WE ALL KNOW , Harry used to use a .416 Rigby as his Personal backup rifle ( and kept a .375 HH Magnum Winchester Model 70 in the car's gun rack to let his clients use ).
    Now , in the late 1960s when Kynoch stopped Manufacturing Centrefire Cartridges , Harry was suddenly out of ammo for his .416 Rigby. So he started turning off the belts on .460 Weatherby Magnum Cases on a miniature lathe to make .416 Rigby Brass Cases. He was using Hornady and Barnes Solids ( whatever , he could find ) . He noticed that the Hornady Bullets were more prone to breaking apart than Barnes bullets.
    I will try finding the article if l can . It's saved as a PDF on my laptop
     
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  4. TTundra

    TTundra AH Enthusiast

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    @fourfive8 no issue there at all. If you look at my original post that was referenced by IVw it was an overview of a process to determine origin of malfunction. It can absolutely be a design flaw in some products and in others user error (or in logistical issues as in my post). Thay post as quoted was asking to present all the information so a conclusion can be reached, not subjective opinions. Some products absolutely have a design flaw, but most people want to see why and where it is rather than just hear a general statment about it. At least I want more information.
    One last time, that post referenced by Iv was identifying the process of looking into product failures to see where they originate, regardless of manufacture.
     

  5. IvW

    IvW AH Elite

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    The customer is not always right however the customer should always be put first.
     
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  6. TTundra

    TTundra AH Enthusiast

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    I'd add that the customer should always be listened to, any situation investigated, and a response or answer always be given and corrective action taken if needed. Fault can lie in a variety of places and finding where is essential in any issue to correct it.
     
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  7. fourfive8

    fourfive8 AH Fanatic

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    Actually many of us get tired of repeating the same facts over and over. Some customers want to shoot big game at 700 plus yards so some bullet companies are more than happy to supply magic testosterone bullets for just that including Hornady with their SST. No it's not just about the customer being right no matter the circumstances. Naturally, the SST is mostly used as a high BC bullet for all manner of big game not just the magic performance window of 500-700 yards. And predictably it comes apart like any thin jacketed cup and core cheap bullet. NO- it's about a company's integrity.

    Specifically, the bullet that Hornady so heavily marketed for so many years and continues to do so as far as I know is their so called Interlock. Nothing more than a super frangible non bonded core, thin jacketed conventional bullet with a very thin inner ring that is supposed to keep the jacket from shredding and shucking the core... right! That thing comes apart like a cheap suit when meeting the least of resistance in big game. I shot a medium-sized mule deer just behind the shoulder with one (130 gr 270 @ about 150 yards with an impact vel of no more than 2500) way back when and couldn't find a piece of that bullet bigger than flattened pea.... not to mention the horrific surface wound it made with little penetration. I had to track that animal down to finish it. I started researching reports of Hornady bullet failures and that's when I found Hornady's arrogant response as posted earlier. From that time on no more Hornady BS for me. I was able to find and use the true premium, well designed hunting bullets just starting to hit the market. If you shoot a hundred pound whitetail at a feeder in Texas off a the rest in a blind from 75 yards and your 7mm mag shootin' a Hornady Interlock blows it nearly in half... you consider it perfect performance? I guess that is what Hornady's customer feedback means to Hornady.

    Fast forward to a few years ago, after all the feedback and internet chatter about the Hornady DG Series failures, curiosity set in. OK time to do a bullet test of one of the two- a 480 gr- 458 DGX. I posted detailed results here and don't feel like doing it again. But basically, what they advertise and picture on each box of that is downright CR7#!P and they know it! That flat meplat statement and diagram on the bullet box is absolute bogus! That bullet, pushed at nominal 45 cal rifle impact vels of maybe 2000 fps, fired into test media, may come apart, fragment, shuck the core and not penetrate... just like any other cheap, basic cup and core bullet. I can take a 30 or 338 cal premium, well designed expanding bullet, shoot it into the same media at reasonable and conservative impact velocities and get anywhere between 14-18 inches of penetration and recover a compete, expanded bullet, still point forward at its penetration terminus. In my test, that 480 gr 458 @ about 2000 fps into the same media penetrated to about 11 inches and shed pieces of jacket and core, including pieces of the steel jacket all along the track. The largest was at the track terminus, a 1/4" piece of lead core that weighed about 50 gr. So is that customer rhetoric?- nope. Now after years of reports about and knowing that staying silent and denying a design problem, Hornady suddenly starts bonding those bullets?? Sorry, Hornady too late, not interested- too many other superior choices. Won't even bother testing or messing with their DGS, not interested- too many superior choices.
     
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