Double Rifle Triggers

[Gwbman]

Double rifles with 2 triggers, which trigger is pulled first, front or back? Reasons for doing so. Would appreciate any comments and advice.

Thanks,

Greg

 

[petrusg]

Very Good question - I know people that do either...

I shoot front first, that allows me to move with easy to the second and ready for a shot if needed.

However, if you cant handle the recoil, I would recommend second one first so that you do not pull into the second by mistake and take two shots at once...

 

[Red Leg]

With a quality made double it is almost impossible to accidently pull the second trigger to cause the second barrel to fire, no matter what the recoil (unless someone were ignorant enough to put a finger on each trigger!). However, old worn out doubles and cheap, poorly made ones with improperly treated sears can slip a hammer during recoil with fairly spectacular results.

 

[Foxi]

Side by side: first trigger the right barrel
over/under : first trigger below.
Not unpractical when you hunt in thick cover.
One barrel with soft bullet ,one with a solid,so you have time to choose and a clear sight or not.
From my Ferlach Double,the first trigger is with flexibel joint,so you can't hurt your finger by the recoil, when you use the second one.
May be ,the gunsmith was a girlie

Foxi

 

[ChrisPy]

I use the front first, I have had two people, double off when there finger hits the back trigger. It rocked there world

 

[spike.t]

I use the front first, I have had two people, double off when there finger hits the back trigger. It rocked there world

what cal was it chris?

 

[ChrisPy]

.470NE the first person 280lbs the second was 180lbs. some of the boys want me to double off, no i don't need to be that much of a man

 

[spike.t]

.470NE the first person 280lbs the second was 180lbs. some of the boys want me to double off, no i don't need to be that much of a man

 

[Velo Dog]

Originally I preferred right side trigger first, because that is apparently traditional.
But after witnessing an experienced PH who, was probably born and raised with a rifle in his hands, "strum" the triggers on a very well made (Pre-War English) double rifle, not once but twice during the same range session, I have re-programmed my self to always press the rear trigger first.
Also worth mentioning is that two of the four double rifles I have owned in my life shot slightly tighter groups with their left side barrel than they did with their right for some unknown reason.
Therefore, it was best to use the rear trigger first on those two specific rifles, regardless of any recoil reason.
Today my only double rifle is a 9.9 pound .458 Winchester (1980's vintage Heym 88B "Safari") and it seems to shoot equally well with either barrel.
But, I just shoot it rear trigger/left side barrel first anyway.
It's mostly because that is how I have been at it for a few years now with previous doubles mentioned and also because I still recall seeing that unfortunate man being double kicked that time on the rifle range, not one incident but two such mishaps only a few minutes apart - (oweee).

 

[Red Leg]

It is all in what you train yourself to do. I shoot thousands of rounds out of my SxS shotguns every year, and front trigger first is how I am programed. Much of my shooting and that of many of my friends and acquaintances is in the pigeon ring with very stout 1 1/4 ounce loads - much of it with traditional English and Continental pigeon guns - all of which are designed to be used front trigger first. Pretty sure most of those fellows in East Africa used them as they were designed as well way back in the day. Have never had an issue with any double rifle (or shotgun) doubling that didn't have a mechanical problem. Most likely place to pick up a bruise is the top of the trigger finger on the second shot if the front trigger isn't hinged, or on top of the second finger caused by the trigger guard. One can buy a bumper for the guard, but a slightly more open grip by the trigger hand usually resolves the issue.

 

[stug]

Karamojo Bell had the triggers of his double wired together so that both barrels would fire at the same time. The problem was getting the barrels to fire simultaneously. Usually one would fire before the other and the second shot would shoot high.

 

[AkMike]

On RH rifle the front fires the right pipe. On LH rifles it's the left that gets touched off first. You can look at the 'stagger' of the triggers and see this. They are regulated this way and supposedly the regulation isn't as good if the wrong trigger is pulled first. I haven't noticed this personally though.
As far as doubling, I've seen and done it. It's not the rifle it the nimrod using the tip of his finger and strumming the back trigger! Get used to holding the trigger in the first joint of the finger. No strumming and no rock your world doubling. My 450NE was noticeable recoil at the bench!

 

[spike.t]

if i pulled the back trigger first i would be trying to bend the trigger guard with my next shot .............

 

[petrusg]

@Red Leg you will be surprised how may times I take guys to the range for a bit of practice and they do a double pull from the recoil - Blaser, VC, Sabatti - you name it.

 

[Red Leg]

I am not doubting your experience Adriaan. It simply has not been mine. Indeed, the two most recent double firings that I know of, that were not caused by faulty sears, were on German rifles where the rear trigger was fired first (one was a .600 which made it on to TV - killed the elephant, but nearly knocked my friend cold!) In both cases, the recoil caused the trigger finger to hit the front trigger with sufficient force to cause the sear to trip and fall. Neither rifle had been fired rear trigger first previously.

And Spike, you made me laugh out loud. I would be trying to do the same thing. Particularly on something in bound and angry.

 

[zephyr]

In the shotgun world double triggers are true selective triggers. With an open choke in the right and a tighter choke in the left the shooter has the ability to select which barrel they want to shoot first depending on the the target presented.
Hunting over dogs where the bird is mostly flying away I have naturally shot the right barrel first left barrel second. Every now and then I may reach for the back trigger first. SxS shooters on a clays course quite often find themselves shooting the left barrel first on some stations and the right barrel first on others.
How does this apply to the double rifle? If one was carrying a soft in the right and a solid in the left you have the option to shoot whatever barrel first you want depending on the need.
With too many years of shooting double triggers I usually shoot the front trigger first and have absolutely no idea what part of my finger I use. I have owned and shot hundreds of rounds through double rifles and have yet to double one, but have witnessed friends double my guns on their first shot.
Practice with both.... Don't limit yourself to always one then the other you may need that bullet in the other barrel first some day..

Velodog..
Some say with older doubles that the left barrel may shoot tighter because over the course of many years that many more rounds have been shot through the right barrel.
Good Shooting....

 

[bassasdaindia]

double rifle and not shotgun , I pull the rear trigger first

 

[Velo Dog]

On RH rifle the front fires the right pipe. On LH rifles it's the left that gets touched off first. You can look at the 'stagger' of the triggers and see this. They are regulated this way and supposedly the regulation isn't as good if the wrong trigger is pulled first. I haven't noticed this personally though.
As far as doubling, I've seen and done it. It's not the rifle it the nimrod using the tip of his finger and strumming the back trigger! Get used to holding the trigger in the first joint of the finger. No strumming and no rock your world doubling. My 450NE was noticeable recoil at the bench!

AkMike,

I'm +1 with you on the first joint of the trigger finger being "more sure", especially when choosing to fire the right side barrel, IE; forward trigger first, on decent kicking doubles equipped with double triggers (same positioning of the trigger finger as for shooting double action revolvers during the trigger cocking phase)..

For general hunting with double rifles I carry my soft in the left barrel and my solid in the right, including for largeish non-dangerous game such as zebra.
Can't think of what scenario might be as follows ... but if I ever had a scenario that called for my FIRST shot to be a solid then quickly followed by a soft, seems to me I'd have time to choose the corresponding trigger.
(Elephant and hippo on land do not count, as I would carry solids in both barrels for them).

The chap I mentioned must've been using the last pad of his trigger finger, because, (according to his own critique of both of his doubling incidents), his finger lurched off the forward trigger during recoil and bumped the rear one with enough force to fire the left barrel, as in strumming a harp.

The shooter was Zimbabwe/Tanzania PH, Gary Hopkins who is a large and physically powerful fellow so, he was not bothered by the doubling of shots as far as I could tell (I would have thrown myself on the ground and screamed like Jane Fonda having a nightmare about Free Market Capitalism.)
As far as I know there was nothing wrong with the rifle itself, as several of us fired it before and after the "doubling incidents" plus, Gary proclaimed his error both times like the big boy that he is.
Furthermore the rifle belonged to Cal Pappas and it is no secret to anyone who knows Cal that, if he had a malfunctioning rifle, he would immediately "deadline" it and post haste send it to a proper Gunsmith with sound reputation in fixing bespoke double rifles.

Cheerio,
Paul (Velo Dog)

PS:
I apologize for not fetching my things out of the back of your truck and I have no legitimate excuse.
If they are still there, I will make it my priority this week.

 

[Velo Dog]

In the shotgun world double triggers are true selective triggers. With an open choke in the right and a tighter choke in the left the shooter has the ability to select which barrel they want to shoot first depending on the the target presented.
Hunting over dogs where the bird is mostly flying away I have naturally shot the right barrel first left barrel second. Every now and then I may reach for the back trigger first. SxS shooters on a clays course quite often find themselves shooting the left barrel first on some stations and the right barrel first on others.
How does this apply to the double rifle? If one was carrying a soft in the right and a solid in the left you have the option to shoot whatever barrel first you want depending on the need.
With too many years of shooting double triggers I usually shoot the front trigger first and have absolutely no idea what part of my finger I use. I have owned and shot hundreds of rounds through double rifles and have yet to double one, but have witnessed friends double my guns on their first shot.
Practice with both.... Don't limit yourself to always one then the other you may need that bullet in the other barrel first some day..

Velodog..
Some say with older doubles that the left barrel may shoot tighter because over the course of many years that many more rounds have been shot through the right barrel.
Good Shooting....

Hi Zephyr,

The first one I had that was one of the more accurate left barrel affairs was a brand new Merkel SxS in .375 H&H that a local gun store had ordered from the importer for me (it was also my very first double rifle of any sort).

The other one I had that shot a slight bit tighter groups from the left barrel was my Army & Navy .450 No2 NE.
The muzzles can be seen in my avatar here and that stoutly made old hammergun can be seen in it's entire 28" barreled glory, in my photos, displayed across the horns of the same buffalo, minutes after sacking him with it - a left and a right, soft and solid.

And although my .450 No2 was very old, probably built in the 1920's or before, (apparently by J. Manton) for A&N Cooperative Society, (Dealers in Fine Sporting Equipment) both bores/throats appeared to be in excellent shape, no Cordite burn, visible erosion or other blemishes that I could see inside either barrel.
There may have been some microscopic flaw in the right barrel but, I could not see it or feel it with a very tight fitting swab.
It just shot slightly tighter groups from that left barrel.

Not that the right side barrel on the Merkel or the A&N shot poorly by double rifle standards, actually both those rifles shot either barrel in very proper regulation.
The tiny accuracy differences from left barrel to right barrel that I mentioned, were only slight.
Any hunter who was not also an obsessive-compulsive rifle enthusiast, probably would not have noticed.

Cheers,
Velo Dog.

 

[AkMike]

No worries about the stuff. It's still there. My brother is using it evenings but it'll be here day times.