450/400 or 470 Nitro express

Discussion in 'Double Rifles' started by soumya sarkar, May 6, 2016.

  1. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    Certainly words of wisdom,something for me to ponder upon and look more closely at the 500NE. I may just try this bore out as well who knows!. I agree if it weighs the same or less, has maybe a tad more recoil, but with the benefit of more punch it should be counted.
    I know it may sound stupid, maybe a disaster but has anyone used this on large feral pigs or some other wild animals?
    I ask as I plan to hunt some brown bears and or moose some day..

    Thanks once again and happy Friday!
     

  2. DUGABOY1

    DUGABOY1 CONTRIBUTOR AH Enthusiast

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    Somya S, I can assure you the 500NE or the 470NE will both just about double the felt recoil over a double chambered for the 450-400NE, but that recoil is not impossible to become used to by anyone. Your idea of trying them all out on a range before deciding is sound thought.
    On the question about shooting wild hogs with all the chamberings you have mentioned, I have taken two and three hundred pound Boar with every double rifle I own and that includes all those chamberings at one time or the other. I shoot a 470NE double well enough that I have often taken two running boar with a double tap from my 470NE Merkel. What that tells you is, anyone can get so used to shooting a 470NE double well enough to not even feel the recoil when shooting game.
    Any of the three you are looking at will handle anything found in North America quite nicely, but the one exception might be the big Kodiak bears in close cover. In that case I would rather have one of the two larger doubles. In Alaska, and western Canada I hunt with nothing smaller that a 375H&H bolt or one of my larger doubles. In close quarters in the alders a badly placed first shot on a big Grizz might get something not so pleasant. Also in that case I would rather have a double than any bolt rifle, regardless of chambering, even the 450-400NE. Moose and black bear the 450-400NE would be just fine.
    .............This is all just my choice, and is not a mandate for anyone to follow. What ever you decide, practice is the key to learning to handle recoil. (y) Mac
     

  3. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    Of late I have have been reading about two makers VC's and Heym. Anyone here got a chance to handle both? Should be interesting to know your thoughts?
     

  4. Pondoro

    Pondoro AH Fanatic

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    Both VC and Heym are very good quality double rifles..

    I like the VC best because they look and feel as old british doubles.....and balance the same way..

    A friend has a .450NE round action VC.....certainly a beauty....personally I would choose a VC over a Heym, but that said, the Heym is a very well put together double..
     

  5. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    Thank you for your thoughts, it helps.
     

  6. Velo Dog

    Velo Dog AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Hello soumya sakar and Pondoro,

    soumya sakar,
    Yes I have handled and fired both the standard model VC double rifle, as well as one model of Heym double rifle (I own a Heym 88B in .458 Winchester).
    The VC I tried was not the Round Action that Pondoro described.
    And, I would really enjoy trying one of those but had not heard of same until lately (in this forum).
    I previously thought VC doubles were only made with "blockish" rather sharp cornered receivers.
    Therefore, prior to recently, I would have said that any Heym double, built on their 88 series receiver, is definitely more closely made to resemble the Pre-War English maker's double rifles than VC is.

    The VC has an awesome reputation for reliability and accuracy (in double rifle terms) but the ones I have seen in photos, as well as the one I had fired at a paper target, definitely were not very "Classic Looking", with their fast pistol grip (sharp, not quite hook shaped pistol grip), square cornered receiver and cuts in the quarter rib - to accept some modernistic scope mount system, or perhaps to accept some red dot sight gadget, not mention their over-sized forearm or "beaver-tail" forearm, as it were.

    Pondoro,
    I have tried to find specifications and pricing for the VC Round Action double rifle without success.
    In fact, I have had limited success finding a decent set of photographs for their Round Action double.
    Now that you have mentioned this model, I am very curious about it, since my contact with VC double rifles has led me to conclude that they are, from butt to muzzle, very "modern looking" and the receiver is down right "rectangular block" shaped.
    In other words, IMO, their standard model does not look or feel anything like old British doubles do (again, in my personal experiences with examining and shooting quite a few makes and models of double rifles, including some vintage British ones).
    VC's web site had a "Catalogue" icon but when I selected it, all I saw were the types of things I am familiar with from VC, no reference to any "Round Action" model.

    The only double rifle I own these days is a Heym 88B.
    One of the reasons that I prefer it over other maker's double rifles selling for under $20,000. new, is because visually, it somewhat resembles the old London & Birmingham made doubles (so do some of the Merkel double rifle models, for that matter.
    I bought my Heym used and so it was very comparable to a new VC, Chapui or Merkel in price.

    Any way, I am quite interested in the Round Action VC, since their other models are very affordable as double go, and they are notoriously robust/reliable.
    Please let me know how I can find photos/price/specifications, such as overhead sears, barrel length, etc.
    Since the VC doubles cost several thousand less than the Heym, perhaps a VC round action .450-400 with 26" ejector barrels could be in my future some day.

    (Wish someone would make one in .303 British, at a price the working class could afford).

    Cheers,
    Velo Dog.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016

  7. Pheroze

    Pheroze AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    I am not sure I grasp the design nuances but is this what you are after Velo Dog?

    https://www.tradeexcanada.com/conte...azur-safari-ph-round-body-double-rifle-450400
     
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  8. Pondoro

    Pondoro AH Fanatic

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    The guy I mentioned purchased his .450NE rifle directly from V-C....I believe he paid US $14.500..

    His was delivered with a splinter fore-end..
     
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  9. Excessexpress

    Excessexpress AH Senior Member

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    I have seen references to V-C making a 303. If I find a link I'll post it here.
     
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  10. Velo Dog

    Velo Dog AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Yes and thanks Pheroze,

    That is exactly the information I was looking for.
    It had my undivided attention until I ran the metric to inches numbers and discovered that the barrels are only 24 inches.
    Certainly that is not the do-all and be-all for me but, I would prefer 26" on any double, (including shotguns as well.)
    Well anyway, thanks again, I do look forward to seeing one of these excellent looking rifles in person one of these days.

    Cheers,
    Velo Dog.
     

  11. Velo Dog

    Velo Dog AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Thanks Pondoro,

    That is a great price for a great looking rifle.
    I very much look forward to seeing one in person one of these days.
    It is good to know rifles like this are becoming more available these days.
    Prior to reading your posts about the VC Round Body / "classic looking" double, I had never heard of it, only knowing of their more common model "modern looking" doubles.

    Cheers,
    Velo Dog.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2016

  12. Velo Dog

    Velo Dog AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Thanks Excessexpress,

    I am very interested in a classic looking double in .303 British.
    (Not sure what I will pay for it with but, that never stopped me before, heh heh).

    Thanks again,
    Velo Dog.
     

  13. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    Velo Dog, Thanks for your feedback, and it seems you have had not so a good experience with prior model VC's or the ones you have handled other than the newer round receivers/body.

    One thing on the 26" barrells is I have heard quite a few experienced people prefer to have this length and I want to know why? How does it help or is it only aesthetics? My limited knowledge tells me it may be little tighter in the bush and more impartantly you are adding 4 " more of barrell weight plus the counter weight in the body to balance.. SO you are looking at adding 12-14 ounces to a already heavy rifle and have heard that it can make a difference in the rugged and hot terrains. This is just my thought but I would like to know the advantages of a 26"?
    cheers, this forum has been an eye opener!
     

  14. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    Here are some pictures of a round body, with color casing in 500 NE

    DSC_0001.JPG DSC_0003.JPG DSC_0009.JPG
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 3, 2016

  15. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    As to a beaver tail or Splinter foreend what is the pros and cons when it comes to big guns? Which is more common or suitable?
     

  16. Witold Krzyżanowski

    Witold Krzyżanowski AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    soumya sarkar likes this.

  17. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    What about my questions Sir? 26 vs 24" barrels, Beaver vs Splinter foreend...?
     

  18. Witold Krzyżanowski

    Witold Krzyżanowski AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    I would like to have a double rifle, regardiess of the length of the barrel.
    I think that the lenght ( 26" or 24" ) of the barrel is a matter of taste.
    All the best.
    Witold
     

  19. Pondoro

    Pondoro AH Fanatic

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    My double rifle has 23" barrels....very well balanced and handy in the bush...and I get 2150fps..

    The only caliber I would want 26" barrels is .600NE...where you need all the velocity you can get to penetrate..

    Just my 2 cents..
     

  20. soumya sarkar

    soumya sarkar AH Member

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    Thank you gentlemen, so I would assume that the extra barrell in the 600 probably adds to the muzzle velocity..

    I also beleive the beaver and splinter forends are a matter of aesthetics, but I want to stand corrected if that is not the case.
     

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