338 Win Mag for plains game

[BFaucett]

Of course, in my opinion, the correct and proper answer to the .338 Win Mag versus .35 Whelen debate is to own one of each.

Ruger M77 Mk II .338 Win Mag

Ruger M77 Hawkeye .35 Whelen

Cheers! Bob F.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I don't care how you load it, the 35 Whelen is about a 250 yard cartridge. Out to that distance, it definitely has a decisive edge in terminal performance over the 33's. But, the fat, stubby 35 caliber bullets start to fall out of the air past 250 yards. From there, even the modest 338-06 will walk all over any 35 caliber in existence. The various 33 caliber bullets simply fly better than their 35 caliber counterparts, making precise payload delivery much easier. That is a factor that matters very much. The 185 and 200 class .338 bullets can be driven well north of 3100 fps from a Win Mag case and a 24" barrel by any competent handloader. Even driven at the same velocity, no similar 35 caliber bullet can compete. The margin grows wider as the bullets get heavier.

Inside 250 yards, though, the 35 is the clear winner. Which one is better depends greatly on one's hunting style, shooting skill level, and logistical factors surrounding the chosen cartridge.

Truthfully, though, a properly loaded 30-06 or 300 Win Mag is more versatile and less fuss than any 33 or 35 caliber. That's if we are taking a practical approach to ANY of the problems being considered. OTOH, what fun is that?!?

@benchracer
If you think the Whelen is a 250yd cartridge you are sadly mistaken as well as your thoughts of it falling out of the sky and as for the 33s having the terminal edge in performance past that is what I would call sadly mistaken.

At 300 yards if you were touching your toes I guarantee you wouldn't find the bullet hole in your backside. A 300 yard shot is a doddle for the Whelen. 6" gongs are rung won't monotonous regularity with the Whelen by those that know how to use it

Loaded with a 225gn accubond at 2,900fps out of the Whelen when sighted 3" high at 100 is only 21 inches low at 400 and still carry it 2,000fpe. It shoots flatter than a 308 with a 150gn SST.

Yes I will concede that past 400 the 338 win mag will out shine the Whelen but only because the Whelen ain't got any nice pointy heavy target type bullets but that's where the Whelen looses out.
Don't underestimate the range capabilities of the Whelen.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I'll bet that old whelen can't move 230 grains at 2900 fps with room to go like the ol win mag can though!

I like both the whelen and the win mag alot. When it comes to pure horsepower, the win mag is a good one and it really comes alive (on both ends) with reloads.

@Choupique
No but it can move a 225gn at 2,900fps without coming alive at the shooters end
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Bob Nelson 35 Whelen, we have to admit the 338 cals do offer a bit of an advantage if hunting ranges get a tic long, trajectories are math and largely easily repeatable, the wind demons are the one's that can change a champ to a chump in one shot.

Speaking of 338 cals and horrible powder fuel mileage, this one burns near 120grs per shot, but, it will boot 300gr Accubonds out at 2900 fps, a bipod along with my little beer can sandbag for the buttstock carried in a cargo pocket pants makes one heck of a hard hitting stick and move hunting rig Bob, it weighs around 10.25lbs all up, Lapua makes a couple more 300gr bullets that can get a man out of any bad hangup.

Please disregard the face paint, I don't feel the need to paint up when I want to play Gee-Eye Jackass here at the farm, simply an old 2020 post Presidential election theft therapy session, I had been archery hunting a BIG midday sneaker of a whitetail buck earlier in the day, of course he had his nose in a doe deers butt somewhere else that day.

BTW Woodcarver, yes sir, that was my first and only selfie ; ]

We can thanks the Good Lord for that.

@50Gunner
I notice y'all need something a lot bigger than the win mag to achieve such magic but for us mere mortals and hunting ranges I'll stick to the might Whelen.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I have had the 338 wm and the 358 w
For our deer and hogs the 358w looked like it hit harder
Now I was using light 338 200-225
And 225 -250 in the 358w
I sold the 338 and kept the 358
The 35 whelen is more of the 358w

I would get a 35w before I would get another 338 unless I came across a huge deal.

@Flbt
The 35s for some unknown reason seem to have a more dramatic on game effect than the 33s and even Nathan Foster will tell you that.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Whose published max charge load data claims MV of 3100fps or faster? I am curious and would like to see the data. When I read your comment above it piqued my interest but my short search of Speer, Barnes, Sierra, Nosler, and a couple of others yielded only one load that barely broke exactly 3000fps in the 35W using the Barnes 180g bullet not a 185g pill and it was at max with A-2460 powder. That is a powder that is only moderately temp stable and would be one to avoid max loads with if they will be subjected to wide variation in ambient temps.

Perhaps you have your own unpublished recipes that are getting there but such would be rifle and bbl length specific and not something that one could repeat in all cases. I know the 30-06 and the Whelen were not loaded to the max possible pressures of their case but that could be said of most any cartridge albeit some have more head room than others. Please don't take this wrong as I am genuinely curious as the Whelen is one of those cartridges that is making a come back and seems to punch well above its weight class. I just do not reload for most of my hunting rifles since I just do not get to shoot them enough to justify the investment in dies and components unless they are a cartridge that is very limited in its available offerings. I like what I see in the Whelen but am struggling with the lack of factory ammo and my aversion to investing in dies for something that I might only load 100rds for in a lifetime. And I have it bracketed already with two 338's and two 375HH rifles in my hunting battery already.

I have a 235g TSX load from Double Tap for 375HH that claims 3100fps on the box, but in my 375HH the actual chrono data has it chugging along at only 3030fps. Still respectable. I would not use it on game for the simple reason that it is a max charge load that had a ton of variation in the actual muzzle velocity and I prefer a milder load that has a more consistent performance than one that is on the ragged edge. Please send us more info on the Whelen when you have time.

@JG26Irish_2
There's a bloke in YouTube using a CVA single shot Whelen with handloads and I think H335 getting north of 3,100fos over the chrono in a 25" tube.
Bob

 

[50Gunner]

All good Big Bob, just having fun.

What lives here:

35 Remington
358 Winchester
35 Whelen
358 Norma Mag

338-06
338 Win Mag
340 WBY
Big 338 wildcat

Back to the OP 338 WM and plains game.

225gr TTSX at 2850-2900 fps for all, easy job.

 

[50Gunner]

OP, just for fun this morning I loaded a start load of 67grs H-4350 under a massive cutter of a bullet, the Barnes 250gr LRX, seated it to front crimp groove, gave a slight roll crimp, it crossed the Garmin at 2668 fps, loaded three for accuracy check when rain clears.

That bullet with a .6 b.c. left there or bumped to 2700 fps would be a dirty rotten beast on all manner of African plains game, cats included, bull Elk, Moose and the great coastal bears of Alaska wouldn't stand a chance.

Just sized, trimmed, deburred, tumbled then annealed near 300 sticks of old WW-Super once fired brass, pressed in CCI-250 primers, if this load lands into less than an inch at 100 yards I'll load 'em all with that bullet and call it more than good.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

OP, just for fun this morning I loaded a start load of 67grs H-4350 under a massive cutter of a bullet, the Barnes 250gr LRX, seated it to front crimp groove, gave a slight roll crimp, it crossed the Garmin at 2668 fps, loaded three for accuracy check when rain clears.

That bullet with a .6 b.c. left there or bumped to 2700 fps would be a dirty rotten beast on all manner of African plains game, cats included, bull Elk, Moose and the great coastal bears of Alaska wouldn't stand a chance.

Just sized, trimmed, deburred, tumbled then annealed near 300 sticks of old WW-Super once fired brass, pressed in CCI-250 primers, if this load lands into less than an inch at 100 yards I'll load 'em all with that bullet and call it more than good.

@50Gunner
It's a pity no one makes a nice pointy heavy weight bullet for the Whelen
But then again I don't really have a need or want to shoot game in the next zip code. Not that I can shoot that well but it may be an interesting exercise.
Bob

 

[50Gunner]

Yes Sir Bob, departure speed certainly isn't arrival speed.

Plus, I wasn't going to say anything, but an Oklahoma state Trooper pulled up in the pasture and wrote me a ticket for obstructing traffic running that 338 at only 2668 fps ; ]

 

[Hedge774]

I have a .338 and a .340 WBY. Both would be fine on PG.



However, I think a .30/06 would be just as good, with the right bullets.

I know I've said this several times before, but asked 6 PH's around a campfire one night "What cartridge would you prefer your clients bring for plains game safari and every single one replied "a .30/06."

I'm an advocate for the versatility of a .30 caliber with proper bullets.

I've taken most of my PG animals with a 200g Sierra GameKing.



.30 caliber FMJ ammo is easy to find for "tiny" animals with minimal pelt destruction.

Would you feel comfortable using that load on an eland? I may be hunting eland and bushbuck in a few weeks (If my buff doesn't work out) and I'm looking for my "One gun" answer. Thank you, Sir!

 

[Flewis]

I love the 338s, the 35s and the 9.3s. Please don’t ask me to choose one over the other. You can throw 8mms in the mix.

 

[coyote wacker]

One of my favorite what I call a middle bore is the 338 WM back went I was more active hunting it was my go to rifle loaded with 210 gr. Nosler Partitions. Today its loaded with Cutting Edge Bullets 175 gr. Raptor it a one and done for anything under 2000 pound no problem.

 

[Schüler Jumbo]

Would you feel comfortable using that load on an eland? I may be hunting eland and bushbuck in a few weeks (If my buff doesn't work out) and I'm looking for my "One gun" answer. Thank you, Sir!

One-Gun answer on game including the massive and elegant eland start at .338 Win Mag, .340 Bee, .338 RUM etc and go up in caliber employing 250 grain or 300 grain bullets.

 

[DLSJR]

Would you feel comfortable using that load on an eland? I may be hunting eland and bushbuck in a few weeks (If my buff doesn't work out) and I'm looking for my "One gun" answer. Thank you, Sir!

I’m not who you asked but I shot a Livingstone Eland in Zambia at a laser measured 327 yards with a 225 grain TTSX in my .338 Winchester. It was pretty much Bang-Flop and we found the bullet under the skin of the offside shoulder. The .338 is ideal for pretty much any plains game. I’ve shot klipspringer to Eland with it and never had an issue with anything.

 

[Hedge774]

Thank you, Sir. I have some that would fit that category. I appreciate your thoughts.

 

[Badboymelvin]

I used the 180gn Woodleigh PP in my .338 and it worked well on Sambar.
Can't remember the speed, I'd have to check my notes but around 3050fps maybe...?
I'd have to check, but even at this lighter bullet weight it worked well.

Russ

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

One-Gun answer on game including the massive and elegant eland start at .338 Win Mag, .340 Bee, .338 RUM etc and go up in caliber employing 250 grain or 300 grain bullets.

@Schüler Jumbo
Forget the prissy little 338s
Just go with the 35 Whelen or the 9.3x62 and call it done.
At least your hat will stay in after you pull the trigger unlike them fire breathing bitch slapping magnuns.
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I’m not who you asked but I shot a Livingstone Eland in Zambia at a laser measured 327 yards with a 225 grain TTSX in my .338 Winchester. It was pretty much Bang-Flop and we found the bullet under the skin of the offside shoulder. The .338 is ideal for pretty much any plains game. I’ve shot klipspringer to Eland with it and never had an issue with anything.

@DLSJR
Apart from your hat coming of after the shot from recoil.
Ha Ha ha Ha
Bob

 

[Badboymelvin]

@Schüler Jumbo
Forget the prissy little 338s
Just go with the 35 Whelen or the 9.3x62 and call it done.
At least your hat will stay in after you pull the trigger unlike them fire breathing bitch slapping magnuns.
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha
Bob

I think the 35 Whelen is kind of like the red haired stepson between 2 better cartridges... the .338WM and the .375H&H.
I can't think of 1 thing that the 35 Whelen does that the other 2 don't do better...
Actually I can, it probably has less recoil than the other 2, I don't know as I've never fired one.
And anyway, recoil comes with the territory, not that I've ever found the .338WM to be that bad...
As I said, I've never fired a 35 Whelen - and I don't plan to.

I know it's your baby Bob, but I just can't stand it - just like I can't stand any 35 cal's.

If you own, shoot and hunt with a 35 Whelen, and you like it and it does everything you ask of it - awesome.
And I mean that, you have to hunt with a cartridge that you like and have faith in.
And if that's the 35 Whelen, great.
But for me that cartridge isn't the 35 Whelen.
The cartridge that fills that roll for me is the .338WM.

I have owned a couple of .338's now (both Winchester M70's) and loved both of them, and the only reason I sold my last one was because I picked up my 425 Express and that has become my main Sambar rifle.

So Bob my friend, the 35 Whelen to me is kinda like the .243 to you... I think it's overrated, exaggerated and I'd never recommend to someone to buy one over the .338WM.
More rifles available for the .338, more choices in factory ammo (not everyone reloads...), more availability of factory ammo and it's just generally more popular - well at least down my way it is...
To me, it's a no brainer.

Anyway, this is all just my preference and just my opinion.

Russ

P.S. but I like the 9.3x62