Why all the 6.5 Creedmoor Hate?

[Daggaboy375]

Do not buy 6.5 Needmore. Groups suck at 100 yds. Five rounds.
Especially not an R 8.

DB

 

[JGRaider]

Nobody likes a winner, and the 6.5CM is just that, a real winner. What's not to love....true short action, inherently a very, very accurate cartridge in a wide variety of rifles, great bullet selection that work extremely well with CM velocities, mild recoil, wide variety of available ammo if you're not a reloader . I've killed big mule deer bucks with it, hogs, culled almost 100 whitetail does.......it flat out works, and if you suppress it you will fall in love with everything it offers, unless you suffer from Creedmoor Derangement Syndrome, which apparently many people on this forum, and elsewhere, do.

 

[Art Lambart II]

I don't believe we hate the 6.5CM but as African big game hunters we understand its limitations and realize there are better rounds available. PG hunting in Africa ranges from 30-pound Duiker to 2000 pound Eland and the rifle you carry should be able to cover all of those possibilities. My sons only big game rifle is a 6.5x55 here in the US he shoots a 140 grain bonded bullet, when we go to Africa he’ll use a 156 grain bonded bullet. In a 6.5CM bullets heavier than 140 grain use up case capacity, resulting in a much slower and less effective 6.5.

I also realize that shot placement is king but if shot placement was everything, we would have all switched to a 243 decades ago and we wouldn’t be talking about the 6.5CM.

The 6.5CM is a great round for 300 pound animals at 200 yard or less (the lighter the animal the longer you can stretch the distance) or culling head shots, but for larger trophy animals there are simply better choices.

 

[Velo Dog]

Nobody likes a winner, and the 6.5CM is just that, a real winner. What's not to love....true short action, inherently a very, very accurate cartridge in a wide variety of rifles, great bullet selection that work extremely well with CM velocities, mild recoil, wide variety of available ammo if you're not a reloader . I've killed big mule deer bucks with it, hogs, culled almost 100 whitetail does.......it flat out works, and if you suppress it you will fall in love with everything it offers, unless you suffer from Creedmoor Derangement Syndrome, which apparently many people on this forum, and elsewhere, do.

? “Nobody likes a winner” ?

The .375 H&H is more popular than ever.
I expect it would be called a “winner”.
It is my favorite hunting cartridge.
So indeed, I like a winner.

My head scratching over the sudden popularity of the young 6.5 Creedmoor is as already mentioned = It simply duplicates the 100+ years old 6.5x55 so, I remain unable to understand what all the excitement is about ?
Yawn.

 

[typilotguy]

Just curious, but why is the 6.5 Creedmoor so reviled? Certainly it has its limitations, but so does every cartridge. I wouldn't take a 22 LR for whitetail any more than I would take a Creedmoor for elephant (W.D.M Bell notwithstanding). That said, I came to hunting as an adult and my young son has learned hunting with me. When researching his first deer rifle, A Weatherby Vanguard Youth in 6.5 Creedmoor made good sense. Cheap, accurate, and loads of support for the cartridge. (I know a 6.5/55 would also have been great but price and availability were not good here). At 9 years old he killed his first whitetail with that rifle and has it accounted for probably a dozen or more by now. It is an efficient no nonsense killer of small to medium game and is perfect for where we live. I would think it would do reasonable service on small plains game as well.

We are point blank range hunters. I won't let him take a shot past 275 yards, but he has never had to. We can always sneak in closer than that.

We are not into social media and do not watch any hunting youtubers, so I'm out of touch with the trendy side of shooting sports. My preferences tend towards wood and blued bolt actions in calibers that Teddy Roosevelt could have shot, but the Creedmoor just works. My son is currently on an overnight hunting trip with a local Christian outdoor organization. They supply all the rifles if the kids need one, and they have a rack of Ruger Americans in 6.5 Creedmoor.

For all the hate, it seems to be a straw man argument. I know the Creedmoor cannot do anything that other cartridges didn't already do, except that the marketing and factory support have rocketed it to popularity so that it available and easy. Besides, which new cartridge has ever really brought a completely new capability to market? everything is to some extent derivative.

I guess I'm feeling a little self conscious about my decision, and I certainly don't want my son to grow a man bun. I doubt I have much to worry about. He is now 5ft 10 inches tall 14 years old and took his last two deer with a 45-70. Hopefully that will be enough to bring his testosterone back up!

This is purely anecdotal, but I have noticed somewhat of a trend...

I personally know several people that laud the 6.5 Creedmoor as some sort of long distance miracle zapper. They fully believe that this cartridge is more than adequate to take cross canyon shots at elk and moose and bowl them over. The common thread amongst this group seems to be that they saw so-and-so do this or do that with the round, and therefore, it in and of itself is a miracle worker.

I am certainly NOT saying that in the right hands, under ideal circumstances, these shots cannot be effectively made. I AM saying that just because somebody did something somewhere doesn't make it a good choice for whatever was done. Within it's resonable limits, the 6.5 Creedmoor is a splendid little round. As somebody mentioned, a .22 LR is a wonderous cartridge...IF it is used for what it was intended for. Same case with the Creedmoor, in my opinion.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I am playing with a custom 6.5 PRC right now. It’s liking 140 gr accubonds at 2,900 fps. One hole at 100 and roughly 1/2” at 200. For me, this rifle is all about Coues deer hunting and so far it seems to be stacking up as the right tool for the job.

@WAB
I will still stick with my fast 25 with a 115/117gn at 3,360fps and a horrible group of 0.8 inches at 200 yards and a point blank range of over 350 yards for an 8 inch kill zone. A backline hold will take that out almost another 100 yards and still hold on hair.
Bob

 

[CoElkHunter]

My newer next door neighbor had heard myself and my other next door neighbor on several occasions talking about hunting deer, pronghorn and elk. He was now very interested in going hunting but had never owned a firearm before. We suggested a .30-06, .270 or .308 for hunting. He subsequently bought a Savage 110/Vortex scope package in .308. Perfect for what he was going to hunt with it and he practiced quite a bit with it. Well, then a former Navy buddy and long distance shooter, convinced him he NEEDED a longer range cartridge than the .308 and suggested a 6.5PRC. So, a month later he bought a Winchester in that cartridge along with a Vortex something X 35 power scope. He bought a couple of boxes of the PRC at $78/box. Never one to discourage a new shooter/hunter, I told him he needed to practice a lot with it. He did and went deer hunting with my other neighbor but never got a shot at a deer. Point being, whether a 6.5 Creedmoor, PRC or whatever else, if someone is willing to practice and hunt with it, I'm all for it even if I wouldn't personally own/hunt with one.

 

[B0MBOY]

I did a long range shooting session with a friend this year. I brought my 308, he rented a 6.5 cm. It my first time taking my rifle beyond 200 yards, and his first with that rental gun ever. The performance difference really wasnt all that much inside of 800 yards. You could definitely get away with more fudge of distance and wind with the 6.5 than the 308, and you felt less recoil. Now at 800-1000 I’m gaming the transonic region with a 308 and yet with 6.5 I can connect out to 1300. Beyond 800 yards 6.5 creedmoor has 308 beat, but how many of us are really taking game at that distance?

i think the real impressive part is any average person can buy a $400 rifle that shoots sub moa in a caliber capable out to 1300 yards. That’s a win in my book

edit: I actually decided I didn’t want a 6.5 after that session, and that i was more than satisfied with how my 308 performed

 

[CoElkHunter]

I have a question for the long(er) distance shooting HUNTERS on here. In a hunting scenario using your sling or off sticks, how are you able to keep the crosshairs on target with a typical 9-12 power HUNTING scope at more than say 300 yards and get a shot off in a TIMELY manner at a big game animal? It's very difficult for me to do quickly, especially with any crosswind causing the scope to move around and I'm not messing with turrets or anything exotic on my scope? I'm surmising MOST of these LONGER shots are taken off a benchrest or from a hardened rest where movement/wind is not an issue and/or an impractical HUNTING scope of 35- 60X is being used? If I'm wrong, please enlighten me as to the secret of long range rifle HUNTING?

 

[WAB]

I have a question for the long(er) distance shooting HUNTERS on here. In a hunting scenario using your sling or off sticks, how are you able to keep the crosshairs on target with a typical 9-12 power HUNTING scope at more than say 300 yards and get a shot off in a TIMELY manner at a big game animal? It's very difficult for me to do quickly, especially with any crosswind causing the scope to move around and I'm not messing with turrets or anything exotic on my scope? I'm surmising MOST of these LONGER shots are taken off a benchrest or from a hardened rest where movement/wind is not an issue and/or an impractical HUNTING scope of 35- 60X is being used? If I'm wrong, please enlighten me as to the secret of long range rifle HUNTING?

I don’t know that I am qualified to answer your question, but for what it is worth, following is my experience:

1) my limit prone with a sling is about 300. I have smoked prairie dogs at that range with hunting rifles which gives me some confidence. Military slings properly used are key for this. A simple wrap sling is not as steady.

2) my limit off sticks is likely 250.

3) longer shots dictate a rest. Bipod, backpack, etc.. if you’re not solid, don’t shoot.

4) I find no problem with 8-10x magnification to 400 yards or so. I’m not sure why you would have trouble with 9x on a deer sized target at 400. I am using a VX5 3-15x42 on a dedicated long range rig.

Just my experience. It doesn’t mean it’s right for you.

 

[JGRaider]

It's apparent that many of you guys skipped over the OP and didn't read it, or forgot what it was about. Nowhere did it mention long range hunting (in fact quite the opposite), or hunting larger African game with it.

Once again, it's offered in a true short action, inherently a very, very accurate cartridge in a wide variety of rifles, great bullet selection that work extremely well with CM velocities, mild recoil, wide variety of available ammo if you're not a reloader.

If you can't handle those truths or have other favorites, fine, use whatever you want, but that doesn't make it's effectiveness null and void. I have other cartridges as well.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Do not buy 6.5 Needmore. Groups suck at 100 yds. Five rounds.
Especially not an R 8.

DB

@Daggaboy375
I agree. You didn't even hit the black square. Not that good ah.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha
Bob

 

[375Fox]

It's apparent that many of you guys skipped over the OP and didn't read it, or forgot what it was about. Nowhere did it mention long range hunting (in fact quite the opposite), or hunting larger African game with it.

Once again, it's offered in a true short action, inherently a very, very accurate cartridge in a wide variety of rifles, great bullet selection that work extremely well with CM velocities, mild recoil, wide variety of available ammo if you're not a reloader.

If you can't handle those truths or have other favorites, fine, use whatever you want, but that doesn't make it's effectiveness null and void. I have other cartridges as well.

It’s not possible to answer his question without discussing long range shooting/hunting. The conditions he plans to use the cartridge for doesn’t affect the answer to his general question.

 

[CoElkHunter]

I don’t know that I am qualified to answer your question, but for what it is worth, following is my experience:

1) my limit prone with a sling is about 300. I have smoked prairie dogs at that range with hunting rifles which gives me some confidence. Military slings properly used are key for this. A simple wrap sling is not as steady.

2) my limit off sticks is likely 250.

3) longer shots dictate a rest. Bipod, backpack, etc.. if you’re not solid, don’t shoot.

4) I find no problem with 8-10x magnification to 400 yards or so. I’m not sure why you would have trouble with 9x on a deer sized target at 400. I am using a VX5 3-15x42 on a dedicated long range rig.

Just my experience. It doesn’t mean it’s right for you.

I DO have trouble keeping the crosshairs in a 6" bullring at 300 yards with a 10x scope off my standing Bog bipod sticks especially with much crosswind? It's not too bad at 200, but at either distance, the scope is moving ever so slightly. I usually can keep 3 of 5 shots in the ring at 200, but not at 300. Shooting off a Harris bipod in a prone position for prairie dogs is one thing, but not practical for big game hunting unless your hunting in the desert. In Africa, I shot off my PHs tripod sticks. Better, but the scope still moves slightly and my longest shot was about 300 yards. Again, how do the 500-1000 yard shooters keep their rounds on target in a HUNTING scenario off sticks even with a 15x scope like you have? It seems with increased magnification it takes even less scope movement for the crosshairs to be out of the bullring and/or off the vitals of a big game animal?

 

[375Fox]

I have a question for the long(er) distance shooting HUNTERS on here. In a hunting scenario using your sling or off sticks, how are you able to keep the crosshairs on target with a typical 9-12 power HUNTING scope at more than say 300 yards and get a shot off in a TIMELY manner at a big game animal? It's very difficult for me to do quickly, especially with any crosswind causing the scope to move around and I'm not messing with turrets or anything exotic on my scope? I'm surmising MOST of these LONGER shots are taken off a benchrest or from a hardened rest where movement/wind is not an issue and/or an impractical HUNTING scope of 35- 60X is being used? If I'm wrong, please enlighten me as to the secret of long range rifle HUNTING?

I’m not a long range shooter and I don’t have plans to be. However, I can see some easy solutions to safely add range to your shots. A short bipod combined with a small sandbag is extremely stable. For shooting sticks, quad sticks like 4 stable sticks give you a very fast shooting platform that supports gun in front and back. Viper flex gives option of a 5th stick that nearly pins sticks in place, but does take an extra minute. Those that say it’s slow are using quad sticks wrong but refuse to change their style.

 

[375Fox]

I DO have trouble keeping the crosshairs in a 6" bullring at 300 yards with a 10x scope off my standing Bog bipod sticks especially with much crosswind? It's not too bad at 200, but at either distance, the scope is moving ever so slightly. I usually can keep 3 of 5 shots in the ring at 200, but not at 300. Shooting off a Harris bipod in a prone position for prairie dogs is one thing, but not practical for big game hunting unless you’re hunting in the desert. In Africa, I shot off my PHs tripod sticks. Better, but the scope still moves slightly and my longest shot was about 300 yards. Again, how do the 500-1000 yard shooters keep their rounds on target in a HUNTING scenario off sticks even with a 15x scope like you have? It seems with increased magnification it takes even less scope movement for the crosshairs to be out of the bullring and/or off the vitals of a big game animal?

Buy 4 stable sticks. You’ll never go back to a bipod or tripod. They are great for 300 yard shots.

 

[CoElkHunter]

Buy 4 stable sticks. You’ll never go back to a bipod or tripod. They are great for 300 yard shots.

And maybe a 20x scope for the longer shots? Just kidding. I'm good at 300 with my scope and I will buy some tri-quad sticks. Thanks!

 

[MS 9x56]

Not sure why the hate, but just saw this:

View attachment 503694

Is that Tom Brady?

 

[MS 9x56]

If I could have only 1 rifle in a 6.5 it would be the original 6.5x54 in a 1903 Mannlicher Schoenauer rifle built before 1924 with no scope but. Lyman swing away peep sight. Load them with 160 grain roundnose and outfit the safari for pachyderms.

 

[JGRaider]

It’s not possible to answer his question without discussing long range shooting/hunting. The conditions he plans to use the cartridge for doesn’t affect the answer to his general question.

Like any other hunting scenario, you have to know your limitations, when to shoot and when to pass. Elevation is the easy part, wind is the voodoo. You're much better off getting prone than shooting off of sticks. I'm not much good past 250 yards personally. The 6.5CM, especially the Tikka T3X, allows seating high BC bullets out closer to the lands than those spec'd by SAAMI, allowing larger doses of slower burning powders (RL26) to higher velocities. For instance my Tikka CTR launches 147gr ELDM's at 2700fps. Ballistics for these high BC bullets are superb, as are the 139 Scenar's at 2730fps. 130 Accubonds at 2850 are as well. These bullets are deer/antelope/aoudad/hog killing machines.