Wanted .405 Winchester Projectiles, Cases & Information

[Bwanabob]

I am presently putting together as much .405 Winchester reloading data, as I can, for a book project I am working on. I already have lots of the common .405 Winchester components, such as Hornady cases and projectiles, Bertram cases, Woodleigh and Barnes TSX projectiles. However, I am trying to source the following:

1. Any original .405 projectiles, preferably FMJ, from Winchester, UMC, Kynoch or any other early maker - even just one or two projectiles will do as I want to section them and find out just how they made the early FMJs for this calibre,

2. Brass cases from Kynoch, Eley, UMC, Jamison, RCC or any other maker (other than those I listed as already having), and

3. Current manufacture projectiles from North Fork, Hawk or any other maker.

Further, if anyone has some interesting information, history, hunting stories about the .405, I would be very interested to hear about it.

Thanks in advance,
Bob

 

[sestoppelman]

A worthy goal. A big fan of the round and the '95 Winchester rifle. Afraid I don't have any of the stuff you are looking for. As far as data, I have had the best luck loading with Varget powder and the Barnes 300 gr Triple Shock. Or just shooting the Hornady factory load with the FN bullet, the semi spitzer doesn't seem to shoot as well at least for me.
Have only taken one game animal with one using that Barnes load, a large nyala at probably no more than 45 yards. High shoulder shot, that literally picked it up and slammed it down as would be expected, no recovery of bullet obviously. I was loaded for eland but never had a chance on one.
You might look around for an article I posted here a while back about one being used on a monster Alaska brown bear in 1948, maybe you saw it. Probably under articles. Good luck on the project.

 

[Bwanabob]

A worthy goal. A big fan of the round and the '95 Winchester rifle. Afraid I don't have any of the stuff you are looking for. As far as data, I have had the best luck loading with Varget powder and the Barnes 300 gr Triple Shock. Or just shooting the Hornady factory load with the FN bullet, the semi spitzer doesn't seem to shoot as well at least for me.
Have only taken one game animal with one using that Barnes load, a large nyala at probably no more than 45 yards. High shoulder shot, that literally picked it up and slammed it down as would be expected, no recovery of bullet obviously. I was loaded for eland but never had a chance on one.
You might look around for an article I posted here a while back about one being used on a monster Alaska brown bear in 1948, maybe you saw it. Probably under articles. Good luck on the project.

Thank you for the good wishes and I found the photo of the Alaskan brown bear that you posted. Where did that photo come from and do you have access to it, that you could send me a photocopy or I could try and source my own copy? Do you have any photos of the nyala and the .405?
cheers, Bob

 

[sestoppelman]

Photo may have been posted by another user. I posted the whole article, but I don't know where it is on the site. It was in a magazine printed some time ago. If you look at my picture page you will see my nyala.

 

[cal pappas]

If you can send me your post address I will see if I can find a fairly comprehensive article on the 405 I publihsed in the 1990s in The Winchester Collector magazine. The photo of the bear was on Kodiak Island and the hunter was a pilot named Bob Reeve (if my memory is correct). Look up Leroy Merz (a Winchester dealer) as he has had several of Teddy Roosevelt's .405s for sale and could supply photos and history, I'm sure. Of course there is the famous quote of Teddy Roosevelt and the 405 as lion medicine but throughout his book are many lesser known mentions of the .405 and pics of animals he and Kermit took with it. My current and only load for the .405 is 57 grains of IMR 3031 and a .300 grain bullet by Hornady or Woodleigh for 2260 fps. My present 405 is for sale as I have my eye on another. As a side line to your work on the .405 look at English and continental double rifles as well as various single shots. Next time I go to town I will photocopy the article I wrote and post it to you. (I should be able to find it).
Good luck in your undertaking.
Cal
PS. Merz currently has a TR 405 for sale.

 

[Bwanabob]

View attachment 348590 Photo may have been posted by another user. I posted the whole article, but I don't know where it is on the site. It was in a magazine printed some time ago. If you look at my picture page you will see my nyala.

Great photo and nice animal. I will look for the article.

 

[Bwanabob]

If you can send me your post address I will see if I can find a fairly comprehensive article on the 405 I publihsed in the 1990s in The Winchester Collector magazine. The photo of the bear was on Kodiak Island and the hunter was a pilot named Bob Reeve (if my memory is correct). Look up Leroy Merz (a Winchester dealer) as he has had several of Teddy Roosevelt's .405s for sale and could supply photos and history, I'm sure. Of course there is the famous quote of Teddy Roosevelt and the 405 as lion medicine but throughout his book are many lesser known mentions of the .405 and pics of animals he and Kermit took with it. My current and only load for the .405 is 57 grains of IMR 3031 and a .300 grain bullet by Hornady or Woodleigh for 2260 fps. My present 405 is for sale as I have my eye on another. As a side line to your work on the .405 look at English and continental double rifles as well as various single shots. Next time I go to town I will photocopy the article I wrote and post it to you. (I should be able to find it).
Good luck in your undertaking.
Cal
PS. Merz currently has a TR 405 for sale.

Thank you for the response and I have sent you my address via a Conversation on this site. Thank you also for the tips about this cartridge and I welcome all comments and tips. I am already aware of many European and British doubles, in .405, as well as the couple of Model 21 'Grand American' double rifles, in .405, that Winchester produced back in the 1930s. And there were other rifles, too - such as the Remington Lee and the French Rival bolt actions. I have also found an enormous amount of information on famous and notable hunters who used the .405 in Africa, India and North America - Theodore Roosevelt was just one of many and not the first to hunt Africa with the .405. This project is a lot of fun, and I am having a ball uncovering lots of forgotten information, but it is also a huge job because the more I look, the more I find!

The one area, that I am having lots of trouble finding information, photos or anything at all, is with my own country - Australia! I know that there were some Northern Territory buffalo hunters using the .405, but do you think I can find any actual information, stories or photos!!!!

 

[Tubby’s Canteen]

Canadian industries limited (c-i-l) sold .405 Winchester under there imperial line of ammunition as well as under the brand Dominion. I believe the imperial line replaced the dominion line but you'd have to look it up to be sure. A local gentleman has a box of each as well as an original 1895 win in .405 in his collection.

 

[Bwanabob]

Canadian industries limited (c-i-l) sold .405 Winchester under there imperial line of ammunition as well as under the brand Dominion. I believe the imperial line replaced the dominion line but you'd have to look it up to be sure. A local gentleman has a box of each as well as an original 1895 win in .405 in his collection.

Thank you for that information. I did have my suspicions that the Canadians made .405 ammo, but I hadn't got to that part of the research, yet. Do you think that the local gentleman, that you mentioned, might be willing to provide some photos of his ammunition?

 

[Tubby’s Canteen]

Thank you for that information. I did have my suspicions that the Canadians made .405 ammo, but I hadn't got to that part of the research, yet. Do you think that the local gentleman, that you mentioned, might be willing to provide some photos of his ammunition?

I'm sure I could get some photos and information after the social distancing measures are eased, I've already agreed to go see him for another fellow forum member regarding a Snyder endfield rifles. A few more questions and photos won't be any trouble.

 

[Bwanabob]

I'm sure I could get some photos and information after the social distancing measures are eased, I've already agreed to go see him for another fellow forum member regarding a Snyder endfield rifles. A few more questions and photos won't be any trouble.

Thank you, I appreciate the help. If you can get some pics, please ensure that the resolution is high enough for printing - usually 300 dpi is good. Cheers Bob

 

[crs]

I have an Aussie friend in NSW that hunts with a Scoped .405 WCF. He has hunted Texas with me , Africa, and of course Australia. He has taken many large critters with the rifle. He also has a gun store in Port McQuarrie with an extensive collection of lever action rifles. If you have access to the WACA magazine, he has an article in there on Australian gun shows.
In addition to the 1895 .405, I also shoot a Simson &Co Suhl .405 Double Rifle and the cartridge is very effective on big game.
DR at rest:

DR at work on Nilgai:

 

[sestoppelman]

If you can send me your post address I will see if I can find a fairly comprehensive article on the 405 I publihsed in the 1990s in The Winchester Collector magazine. The photo of the bear was on Kodiak Island and the hunter was a pilot named Bob Reeve (if my memory is correct). Look up Leroy Merz (a Winchester dealer) as he has had several of Teddy Roosevelt's .405s for sale and could supply photos and history, I'm sure. Of course there is the famous quote of Teddy Roosevelt and the 405 as lion medicine but throughout his book are many lesser known mentions of the .405 and pics of animals he and Kermit took with it. My current and only load for the .405 is 57 grains of IMR 3031 and a .300 grain bullet by Hornady or Woodleigh for 2260 fps. My present 405 is for sale as I have my eye on another. As a side line to your work on the .405 look at English and continental double rifles as well as various single shots. Next time I go to town I will photocopy the article I wrote and post it to you. (I should be able to find it).
Good luck in your undertaking.
Cal
PS. Merz currently has a TR 405 for sale.

I know this is old, but just catching up on this thread. The bear was taken near Cold Bay, AK, not Kodiak Is.. pilot/hunter was Bob Reeve.
Took I think 3 shots at great distance for such a round, near 300 yards, but the bear is a monster!

 

[Bwanabob]

I have an Aussie friend in NSW that hunts with a Scoped .405 WCF. He has hunted Texas with me , Africa, and of course Australia. He has taken many large critters with the rifle. He also has a gun store in Port McQuarrie with an extensive collection of lever action rifles. If you have access to the WACA magazine, he has an article in there on Australian gun shows.
In addition to the 1895 .405, I also shoot a Simson &Co Suhl .405 Double Rifle and the cartridge is very effective on big game.
DR at rest:
View attachment 430225
DR at work on Nilgai:
View attachment 430224

Thank you for the information and I would really like to talk to your Aussie friend about the .405. Is he at PL Firearms, Port Macquarie? I would also love to have any comments/info that you have on the .405. Personally, I have two .405s - a Miroku-made, 1895 TD and a Ruger No1. I recently took the 1895 to the Northern Territory to hunt water buffalo and scrub bulls and it performed excellently and took two buffalo and one scrub bull. I used Woodleigh 300gn RN projectiles, @2250 f.p.s, and Cutting Edge Bullets 350gn Safari Solids, @ 1960 f.p.s., as backups. Some of the Woodleighs fully penetrated the chest cavity (inadequate sectional density - really???) and all of the Safari Solids fully penetrated, even on raking shots. I shot each animal with five rounds each, although I don't think that all of those shots were really needed and most were finishing shots on animals that were already on the ground. But I kept shooting because I believe in the philosophy that - "You keep shooting till they stop moving!" Also, I wanted to get plenty of shots on target to get a better feel for penetration and effectiveness. None of the animals ran more than 20 yards (and buffalo usually do run after being shot) so, from all of this, I would consider the .405 a perfectly adequate big game cartridge. I have now shot both Cape buffalo (with a .475NE) and water buffalo (with .450NE and .405WIn) and would consider them similar in many ways, so I am confident that the .405 would work fine, on Cape buffalo. It isn't the best choice for an African safari but it will do the job and I plan on testing that belief as soon as the Covid19 Panicdemic is over.

 

[dgr416]

I am going to try 7x65 r brass and 9.3x74 brass to make 405 brass out of .I shoot alot of 41 mag bullets out of my 405 win Easier to find kick less .

 

[Wildcatter]

Gary Reeder has 405 Win brass in bulk from Hornady. I just picked up a batch from him in December.

 

[sestoppelman]

Gary Reeder has 405 Win brass in bulk from Hornady. I just picked up a batch from him in December.

GR says its all gone....