Viable "gaps" in the market that a new caliber could meaningfully fill in today's factory ammo selection

[WI-2021]

The Federal Safari Trophy Bonded Bear Claw in 400gr also claims 2250 fps. I tried the 404gr Shock Hammer from Aria Ballistic Engineering but was only able to get 2250 out of my 23” McGowen barrel even though they listed 2500 fps as their rating.

If the two Ruger offerings had been more widely successful, then I think necking up the 416 to a 458 & necking down the 375 to something a bit smaller could have produced a useful series of chamberings for standard sized actions.

Thanks for the additional info!

The various PRC cartridges are all based on the .375 Ruger case and seem to be taking off to some extent, so hopefully that will help keep the .375 and .416 alive. I think they'll live as long as the Ruger rifles chambered for them are available, then fade somewhat. There are probably quite a few M77's out there, particularly in .375, so it will be a while before they become orphans.

The RCM's were also based off of a shortened .375 Ruger case, but they're pretty much entirely dead at this point.

 

[Alistair]

We are stalled in conventional firearms development until something completely different comes along, be it electric launch rails (on our latest carriers) laser beams or field effects whatever. Combustion based fire arms are about as far as they can go, soon to be viewed as archeological relics

Eh, yes and no l'd say.

I think that hunting firearms are now about as far as they can go. Any improvements now are incremental changes to a mature technology to improve stuff like powder temperature stability, case efficiency, maybe fouling potential.

Most of the military focus on this technology is stuff that is useful for them... but not really for hunting. Electrical ignition, polymer cases, caseless rounds, multi projectile rounds, maybe flechettes or smooth bore type stabilization. Useful for them, but not something the hunter wants.

All the so called 'next gen' stuff you mention may eventually come, but depends on stuff like drastically improved battery chemistry, room temperature superconductors, vastly better super capacitors. We have none of them right now, and whilst they are now an area of research focus, I suspect that'll be the 'fusion power generation' of our life times. Always just a decade away from widespread, effective application.. for decade after decade.

 

[HankBuck]

I wish the 35 Rem would come back in bolt guns

@Rem280 - I usually like traditional firearms and calibers but the .35 Remington is an exception—-better then a .30-30 maybe but a .308, .30-06, & .45-70 really make more sense….I know it had “its day” and still has a following —— I might be missing something so I will yield to more knowlegable rifleman “how did it survive”?

 

[HankBuck]

Thanks for the additional info!

The various PRC cartridges are all based on the .375 Ruger case and seem to be taking off to some extent, so hopefully that will help keep the .375 and .416 alive. I think they'll live as long as the Ruger rifles chambered for them are available, then fade somewhat. There are probably quite a few M77's out there, particularly in .375, so it will be a while before they become orphans.

The RCM's were also based off of a shortened .375 Ruger case, but they're pretty much entirely dead at this point.

@WI-2021: maybe they will join the other “fad cartridges” — all those “Short Magnums” (.223 short mag, .7mm short mag etc…)

 

[Hillbilly Marine]

Over the last 25 years or so there have been more new rounds introduced than I care to think about. The only ones that made any sense, at least to my thoughts, have been the RCMs (particularly the .338), the .325 WSM, and the .375/.416 Rugers.

I looked at a .338 RCM at a local store and was just a little to slow to buy. Maybe that was a good thing though. I like having sometimes odd chamberings but I have yet to see a loaded .338 RCM round, or a rifle chambered for the .325 WSM. I just can't understand why the .375 Ruger can't get a good foothold.

Sad thought is that I cruised pass the ammo shelf at the local WallyWorld and there were no rounds for any rifle I own but there was enough 6.5 Creedmoore, .223/5.56, and 7 PRC to outfit a small army.

 

[colorado]

900 NE?

 

[Green Chile]

For me the answer is an easy no. I don't need any new cartridges and don't follow any of the new ones. I need brass for old cartridges and regular supplies of premium bullets and powder.

 

[Fatback]

I’ve been served well by the old standards like 270 Win, 30-06, 300 Win, 9.3x62, 375 H&H, 404 Jeffery and 458 Win Mag. My daughter is deadly with her 243 on deer and pigs. I do have to admit that I was very intrigued by the 7PRC and had one built this year on a 338 Win donor action. I’ve had the rifle a couple of months and have enjoyed shooting it and have killed a few deer with it to great effect. I don’t think it will replace any of my old standbys but it will certainly enter the rotation. It is a stainless action and in a synthetic stock with a carbon wrapped barrel. It will be my bad weather rifle. If I draw a mountain goat tag the new 7PRC will get a lot of consideration for the rifle that I would take on that type of hunt. This is the 7PRC

 

[AZDAVE]

I have been playing with standard and wildcat rounds for a long time. and Pretty much every level of cal and power have been covered and then some. Looking at the hay days of Continental and British gunmakers right after the invention of smokeless powder makes the surge in rounds developed in the last 20 years look pale. There is some merit to the ruger/hornaday connection to new rounds without the long term commitment to supply componets etc. manufactures are in the market to make money and they don't always have the long term covered. When ever I buy something newer that I like I lay in a lifetime supply of brass. IE (416 ruger and 338 RCM) I am hoping the current PRC rounds keep the 375 and 416 options for others.

As @Green Chile said "I need brass for old cartridges and regular supplies of premium bullets and powder." I will also add that in the DG catagory support the rounds developed with componets.

Wildcatters while not as numerous as there once was will continue to play around with 14-60 cal just because.

 

[Northern Shooter]

900 NE?

Just going to go and skip the 800NE are we?

 

[mdwest]

I dont know that there are any gaps in ammo when it comes to hunters / hunting.. theres something already out there that is more than capable of humanely taking everything from a field mouse to a bull elephant, thats been doing it exceptionally well for God only knows how long already at pretty much any reasonable/ethical distance....

Sure we could always find a way to squeeze another 50 FPS out of a 300 magnum.. or figure out how to make an "improved" 416 that will accomplish 2400 fps with a 400gr projectile 5% more efficiently than the last 416 developed.. but.. those improvements at this point are somewhat immaterial I think..

Dont get me wrong.. I have toyed with wildcats, new cartridges, etc.. most of my life.. its fun trying new things, playing with something no one else has, etc..etc..

but is 300 PRC really filling a "gap" that the 300 WM or 300 weatherby or 300 H&H wasnt already filling? or is the latest/greatest 6.5 really an improvement over the 6.5 sweede or the 6.5 creed or fill a "gap" that was out there?

About the only exception I see (that I think has largely been filled already, but because politicians are going to politician, will probably have to be filled again at some point) is the industrys response to truly ridiculous legislation in some states.. like "straight walled cartridges" being required.. perhaps 350 legend, 450 bushmaster, etc.. of recent fame helped fill some gaps between lever action pistol caliber carbines (357 mag, 44 mag, etc) and the 45-70 that folks had previously been using to meet those states requirements..

If we transition the discussion to extreme long range shooting, or extreme precision shooting (benchrest, PRS, F1, etc..etc..) then theres probably still a lot of room for improvements out there.. in those sports the tiniest of fractions of group size improvement can make the difference in a win or loss.. a hit or a miss.. etc... so if you could figure out how to fly flatter, straighter, more consistently, etc by even the smallest measure, people involved in those sports would be all over it..

 

[Hunt anything]

I wish the ammo companies would just concentrate on keeping a good supply of what’s already out there.

 

[C.W. Richter]

After making my latest post on what missing gaps my current ammo lineup had, it got me thinking to the market as a whole, and if there are any missing gaps where a new caliber could fill?

I know the general answer is no, all bases have been covered.

But with the tremendous amount of marketing ammo produces spend on introducing "new and improved" calibers each year (think the PRC's, 6.8 Western, Creedmoor's, 21 sharps etc.) where is that next gap to be filled? What new purpose would it serve? what hunting niche would it fill?

Can you think of anything in the realm of dangerous game cartridge innovation? Short action .423 cal? Long action 0.577 cal for a bolt gun? Short action 0.50c al?

Or will it continue to follow the trend of introducing more efficient long-range cartridges like Hornady has been pumping out? Latest I heard they were considering the 338 PRC for their next release.

Curious as to what you can come up with.

is this a marketing study??

 

[Northern Shooter]

is this a marketing study??

Haha nope, just my inquiring mind.

 

[Oldwavy]

That's a sweet spot! A.510 bolt-action could bridge the gap between.458 Win Mag and.500 Nitro Express, offering serious power without being overkill. Think elk, bear, and African plains game hunting.

Love the idea of a standard rim, just like the.510 Gibbs.

 

[coreydb]

I love the discussion guys! I have been thinking the same. My line of thought was to modify the 2 mile cartridge line and produce wild cats. The designations could in the vein of the early British DG calibers of the 19th century. But like you, why create a new bullet when the established DG bullets are already hard to get? I would love to get my hands on a modified Ruger, just don't know if the current line of rifles are built heavy enough for these super-sized calibers. Oh but to dream......

 

[Northern Shooter]

That's a sweet spot! A.510 bolt-action could bridge the gap between.458 Win Mag and.500 Nitro Express, offering serious power without being overkill. Think elk, bear, and African plains game hunting.

Love the idea of a standard rim, just like the.510 Gibbs.

A 0.510 bolt gun with 500NE ballistics sounds pretty appealing to me. 5+1 Capacity, less recoil than the 500 Jeffery, more energy than the 458 WM.

Make it a long action so that it's not prohibitively expensive, sounds like a winner..

 

[odonata]

I was surfing around this morning & stumbled across a post where Federal apparently identified a gap in our ammo choices & decided to fill it with the 7mm Backcountry that surpasses the 7mm PRC. Shooting at higher pressures, reloaders are going to love the proprietary steel case. Initially you'll be able to get it in a variety of rifles as long as you only want to shoot a Savage.

I think I'll be sticking with my lineup of time-proven classics...

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I was surfing around this morning & stumbled across a post where Federal apparently identified a gap in our ammo choices & decided to fill it with the 7mm Backcountry that surpasses the 7mm PRC. Shooting at higher pressures, reloaders are going to love the proprietary steel case. Initially you'll be able to get it in a variety of rifles as long as you only want to shoot a Savage.

I think I'll be sticking with my lineup of time-proven classics...

Another long range abomination. Why am I not surprised. They should have called it the 7mm Intercontinental. Who shoots bench rest targets at "backcountry" target ranges? An oxymoron.

 

[YancyW]

Another long range abomination. Why am I not surprised. They should have called it the 7mm Intercontinental. Who shoots bench rest targets at "backcountry" target ranges? An oxymoron.

2850fps out of a 20" barrel with a 195gr elite hunter bullet. DAMN