Tim Sundles 4 shots of 600 NE into Buff

[mark-hunter]

There is no guaranteed hydrodinamic shok on anything.

And the bigger the animal, the smaller are chances to get a hydrodinamic shock.

Make first shot accurate and keep shooting till he is down.

 

[RedTag]

I think of it this way, shoot deer/elk/moose behind the shoulder with a .270 controlled expanding bullet going close to 3,000 fps and the animals will usually drop very quickly. Do the same with a .45-70 hard cast bullet going well below 2,000 fps and they can keep going a lot longer than you would like. This is my personal experience. The heavy slow bullet should certainly offer better penetration for a lengthwise shot on a charging animal, but the high velocity expanding bullet just seems to work better for a broadside shot.

 

[1dirthawker]

ok,

i counted 6 shots, AND on his first shot, when he reloaded, he put 2 rounds in the gun so he might have shot another shot but edited it out. i only saw 2 bullets hit the bull, one high and back lungs, one in the guts. i did see a bullet hole in the rear of the lungs. regardless, only good hits count. but, 7 shots (or 6) even with a 600 nitro, not in vitals just makes for a high shot count and cape buffalo are notoriously tough anyway.

 

[IvW]

Terrible shooting........

 

[Sideshow]

Terrible shooting........

The spade has been called….yep it’s a spade! Nice one @IvW nothing like a good short answer!

 

[SRvet]

Terrible shooting........

I agree, the group he shot was bigger than the buffalo…. Which takes some doing!!!
Unfortunately that’s what happens when somebody is showboating as Billy Big Balls with too much gun for his abilities and not enough judgement. I’m not impressed by either the hunter, the calibre or the ammunition based on that video.

 

[Sarg]

In the video above, the 600NE stopped the bull charge, could that be due to this shot being much closer than Tim's shot? Is there a certain distance in yards where heavier slower moving bullets lose their effectiveness on large game sooner than others?

Do you reckon there was a charge there, I think they were just surprised to walk passed a dead Buffalo & tracker saw it ?

Pretty sure the big guy missed on his last unneeded shot ?

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I'll take everyone's word for it that the video is a joke. Don't want to give another phony influencer a hit for his view numbers. I trip on enough bad examples on YouTube inadvertently. Agree that this is not the best way to advertise his product. In fact, I can't think of a worse way. Stupid. Should I by ammo from a stupid guy? Hmmm. Let me think on that ... for a split second.

 

[grand veneur]

Do you reckon there was a charge there, I think they were just surprised to walk passed a dead Buffalo & tracker saw it ?

Pretty sure the big guy missed on his last unneeded shot ?

I don't see any attack either; the dying buffalo just moved, but it is sometimes not unusual to shoot at it again in such a situation.

 

[grand veneur]

I'll take everyone's word for it that the video is a joke. Don't want to give another phony influencer a hit for his view numbers. I trip on enough bad examples on YouTube inadvertently. Agree that this is not the best way to advertise his product. In fact, I can't think of a worse way. Stupid. Should I by ammo from a stupid guy? Hmmm. Let me think on that ... for a split second.

I have asked myself this question before. Did the author want to demonstrate that a buffalo is very tough? If so, but then he failed in his attempt in every case.

 

[JG26Irish_2]

I sincerely doubt that the 600NE lacks stopping power on Cape Buffalo. But, I do doubt that many hunters across the world can shoot it well after having experienced the recoil a few times. I am not particularly recoil sensitive and love shooting my little light weight 12ga dbl shotgun. But after a day in the dove fields, I notice that I start lifting my cheek off the stock causing my shots to go high. The same can occur with the big 600. Don't get me wrong, I like shooting a 458 and love shooting my 375's.

Still, I watched a hunter shoot and miss a buff with his 600NE for three shots at a range of 20y. Then with the 4th shot, he wounded it in the paunch and it ran off. They suffered thru a looong stalk to get another shot at it and he shot poorly once more forcing his PH to finish the beast as it charged. Exciting? Yes. Ethical? Not so much.

Statistically the 375's score more one shot kills on Buffalo than any other DG caliber class. Why? Because statistically, more shooters can shoot them well enough to kill the animal cleanly with the 1st shot. This in no way implies that the 375 is more deadly than the larger calibers, it simply underlines that the 375 is easier to deliver its deadly projectile onto the tgt. A well placed hit is better than a more powerful miss, every time. There are many hunters who can shoot those big doubles well but only a small number of them are financially able to buy one and fewer still, know how to use them properly.

 

[Daniel Cary]

In the video below, Tim Sundles (owner of Buffalobore ammo) shot a Cape Buffalo 4 times with a 600 NE and it did not phase it. That's very concerning and also odd. I've seen videos where people have shot buff with 375, 416 and 458 and it knocks them down, they stumble, take off running and collapse. The 600 had no "shock effect" on the buff. Is this common or is it possible that too big a round and too slow a round does not create the same shock effect on buff that a 378 WBY or 416 RUM would? Should a higher velocity round with more expansion be used for the first one or two shots on buff and save the double barrel for stopping charges?

Disclaimer: This post is not meant or intended to insult owners of 600 NE rifles.

? The contest is never certain .. another example

 

[sgt_zim]

No offense to OP, but this bears repeating AGAIN, even on this thread.

1. Shot placement
2. shot placement
3. shot placement
4. get closer than Gannymede or Io or Callisto before you put your booger hook on the bang switch

 

[TheJeremiahSmith]

This video is a great example for new hunters to watch. I feel like with all the podcasts, forums, and hunting shows, people assume there is a "magic formula" or "recipe for success" when it comes to guns and gear. The only real recipe is putting the right bullet in the right place. Just because you have a large caliber bullet doesn't mean you'll knock an animal over every time. A smaller caliber that you can actually bear to shoot enough times to get proficient with is going to serve you much better than a huge mule-kicker that you hate practicing with. I agree with everyone else saying go for a smaller caliber you can shoot better.

Here in the states, I feel like many people substitute their training and practice with more expensive or fancy gear. A cheaper rifle and more ammunition would serve most hunters better than the super expensive fancy gear that they rely on in place of practice. Fancy gear is great, too, but you HAVE GOT to practice with it. It's like the guys who spend thousands on a set of ping golf clubs and are shocked to find they don't play as well as Tiger Woods. Practice doesn't make perfect, perfect practice makes perfect. Don't just shoot until you can hit the target, shoot until you can hit it reliably.

You can take what I know about hunting Cape Buffalo and put it in a thimble and still have room. But I do know the value of regularly practicing with your equipment and that having the confidence that comes from experience is invaluable when you put your finger on a trigger. Knowing you can make that first shot count makes all the difference.

 

[sgt_zim]

This video is a great example for new hunters to watch. I feel like with all the podcasts, forums, and hunting shows, people assume there is a "magic formula" or "recipe for success" when it comes to guns and gear. The only real recipe is putting the right bullet in the right place. Just because you have a large caliber bullet doesn't mean you'll knock an animal over every time. A smaller caliber that you can actually bear to shoot enough times to get proficient with is going to serve you much better than a huge mule-kicker that you hate practicing with. I agree with everyone else saying go for a smaller caliber you can shoot better.

Here in the states, I feel like many people substitute their training and practice with more expensive or fancy gear. A cheaper rifle and more ammunition would serve most hunters better than the super expensive fancy gear that they rely on in place of practice. Fancy gear is great, too, but you HAVE GOT to practice with it. It's like the guys who spend thousands on a set of ping golf clubs and are shocked to find they don't play as well as Tiger Woods. Practice doesn't make perfect, perfect practice makes perfect. Don't just shoot until you can hit the target, shoot until you can hit it reliably.

You can take what I know about hunting Cape Buffalo and put it in a thimble and still have room. But I do know the value of regularly practicing with your equipment and that having the confidence that comes from experience is invaluable when you put your finger on a trigger. Knowing you can make that first shot count makes all the difference.

I think a lot of people assume that velocity imparts some magical quality to bullets. No matter how fast, bullets are still limited by mass.

A 1500 lb cape buffalo has 11,666X the mass of even a 900 grain bullet, and 21,000X the mass of a 500 gr bullet.

Sometimes animals go down like they're pole-axed, most of the time they don't no matter how heavy or how fast the bullet is going.

I see the same erroneous thinking when it comes to defensive handgun use - a 200 lb man has more than 6000X the mass of a 230 gr 45 ACP bullet.

If you're expecting your target to go down on a single shot, you're setting yourself up for a potentially very bad day that ends with you in a body bag. Pull the trigger, then be ready to pull it again and again if necessary.

Sundle makes an additional mistake - he did not take into account how the recoil would affect a F/U shot given the terrain. He very nearly went ass over teakettle on his first shot. It's an easy enough mistake to make, likely most of us (including my own self) would have had the same issue.

Always be immediately ready to fling more lead.

 

[Flbt]

I think of it this way, shoot deer/elk/moose behind the shoulder with a .270 controlled expanding bullet going close to 3,000 fps and the animals will usually drop very quickly. Do the same with a .45-70 hard cast bullet going well below 2,000 fps and they can keep going a lot longer than you would like. This is my personal experience. The heavy slow bullet should certainly offer better penetration for a lengthwise shot on a charging animal, but the high velocity expanding bullet just seems to work better for a broadside shot.

That’s strange.
And I guess why personal experience can’t all ways be relyed on.
I am not saying you’re experience is wrong.
But for me the 45-70 on deer have dropped the quicker than anything else except a 450 bm. I have used hardcast.300gr hp 405gr sp
And they dropped fast most of the time never taking a step.

 

[grand veneur]

The cartridge 600 Nitro Express is not exactly the best example to discuss the use of bigger caliber for hunting dangerous game. Anyone who wants to benefit from the advantages of a big bore cartridge for hunting dangerous game has plenty of other reasonable big caliber options with which, with a little practice, he can place a bullet just as well as with the cartridge 375 H&H Magnum. The cartridge 600 Nitro Express, as well as a few other cartridges at the upper limit of what can still be used for hunting, is in all cases reserved for hunters who have mastered the shooting of large medium bore cartridges perfectly. Whether everyone of those will be able to shoot accurately with the cartridge 600 Nitro Express is also for a lot of reasons not certain.