Rifle/ammo failure on Ele

[375Fox]

It’s unfortunate for the client that this video was published like it is. He needed a lot more practice with that rifle and a mindset of shooting twice. That part really frustrates me. As far as the hunt, I don’t see anything wrong. They could have waited an hour and walked up on a dead elephant. They chose to follow up fast and end it before dark as the PH very clearly says in video. No one here can argue with Len Taylor’s credentials as an elephant PH. He ranks as one of best. From the differences in light between the first shot and last shot it was over quickly and they took a great bull. Everyone thinks their hunt would have gone differently. I short stoked my bolt for the first time ever on my elephant hunt. Things happen.

 

[analog_peninsula]

It’s also worth pointing out that admiring one’s shot is a terrible habit, but it’s also easy to fall into. Note how the hunter lowers his rifle after each shot rather than maintaining his sight picture and firing the second barrel.

I’m sure the hunter didn’t expect things to go down the way they did, and a little charity doesn’t hurt, so I’ll simply say that failing to prepare is preparing to fail.

 

[Hogpatrol]

In many of these videos, I see a lot of lifting the head at the shot and very little follow through. They're bad habits that are tough to break.

 

[VINOYASADO]

That was all operator error.

The hunter would have been better off with a reliable bolt gun that he could handle.

He kept lowering his rifle and reloading rather than shooting the second barrel.

I don’t believe there were any actual misfires. He was loading the left barrel and pulling the front trigger.

At one point it looked like he started to open the gun but then remounted and tried to shoot with the lever half engaged.

His reloads were obviously a problem. I think he may have dumped a number of live rounds on the ground.

When he did finally get a shot off at the side brain it looked like he hit about a foot forward.

I think his shoulder shots were a bit forward too.

I think about that,,, but watching the video few more times, in the minute 39:22 you can hear "I don't know what happened with that round" and seems to be left barrel only loaded

 

[Tex .416]

The video is confirmation of the adage, we do not rise to the occasion, but sink to the level of training.

 

[Hammergun]

I could not watch the whole video. Just too painful. I've shot double triggered sxs shotguns my whole life and I think anyone new to double rifles should buy a twin triggered sxs double and shoot a lot of clays. Shooting doubles at skeet and sporting clays will build muscle memory and make you a natural with your double rifle. It doesn't replace practice with the rifle but a lot of the skills are the same.

Practice at the range with your rifle as if you are hunting. LET THE BRASS FLY. If your habit is to police your brass at the range you will do this out of habit when under pressure while hunting.

 

[Tanks]

I think anyone new to double rifles should buy a twin triggered sxs double and shoot a lot of clays. Shooting doubles at skeet and sporting clays will build muscle memory and make you a natural with your double rifle.

Yep, @Red Leg had suggested this. Before every hunting trip with a double, I end up shooting at least 500 clays with a SxS at my local sporting clays range.

 

[Aaron N]

Bad shot placement initially. Should have done it my way.

Money shot at 0:43

Seeing as he’s a cali native as well, how about you take him under your wing

 

[autofire]

Hi guys!

Not sure if this video is already here, but I would like to know why so many shoots? (its normal?) and why the rifle /ammo failure?

pew-pew starts at 36 min mark

why would anyone think that this video should be put online/in public? See no upside to let world, especially anti's to see this.

 

[Quest#1]

Glad it was published…. That was a mess! Most ppl will see this video and say “ i don’t want to be that guy” or want to fumble that bad…. And hopefully practice to make sure they aren’t


he must normally hunts with a #1. Seemed to want to reload every shot instead of firing both barrels….

 

[sureshot375]

I could not watch the whole video. Just too painful. I've shot double triggered sxs shotguns my whole life and I think anyone new to double rifles should buy a twin triggered sxs double and shoot a lot of clays. Shooting doubles at skeet and sporting clays will build muscle memory and make you a natural with your double rifle. It doesn't replace practice with the rifle but a lot of the skills are the same.

Practice at the range with your rifle as if you are hunting. LET THE BRASS FLY. If your habit is to police your brass at the range you will do this out of habit when under pressure while hunting.

I have a set of 20ga barrels on order for my double.

I don’t expect to do much serious wing shooting with it, it simply there for inexpensive muscle memory.

 

[Fordy]

Gday
Reinforces a few things for me

why no double will be in this muppets hands

Practice as Muscle memory so critical

A good/ consistent round that covers as many bases as possible & Potential bullet deflection is one that also concerns me


Cheers

 

[358 Norma]

I believe that the first couple of shoulder shots would have eventually proven fatal for the bull (as mentioned in the video by Mr. Taylor). Due to the pressing need to secure the elephant before sundown (in order to avoid a long tracking job), the client was instructed to keep pouring more shots into the elephant until the bull went down on the spot.

What’s far more concerning, is the fact that:
1) The client had TWO misfires. He was clearly using Hornady DGS (Dangerous Game Solids) factory loads in his Heym Model 89B (in either a .470 Nitro Express or .500 Nitro Express chambering). I’m beginning to lose more & more faith in Hornady day by day.
2) At the 39 minute mark, the client approached the wounded bull elephant with only one barrel of his rifle loaded (despite having ample time to load the second barrel).

Elephants are notoriously difficult to down quickly with the shoulder shot (especially with calibers smaller than .500 bore). They usually end up going 50 yards on a heart shot, 100 yards on a double lung shot and much further if only one lung is ruptured.

I emptied an entire magazine (6 rounds) of a .375 Holland & Holland Magnum BRNO ZKK602 (loaded with RWS 300Gr nickel jacketed round nosed FMJ solids) into the heart-lung region of my first elephant in Botswana. Most of those bullets had managed to hit vital regions, but it still managed to cross a stream & give us one well of a tracking job for more than 40 minutes.
View attachment 692238

I don't think the ammo or the rifle was the problem, I think he kept putting the rifle on safe.

 

[Red Leg]

Hi guys!

Not sure if this video is already here, but I would like to know why so many shoots? (its normal?) and why the rifle /ammo failure?

pew-pew starts at 36 min mark

Sometimes even one of Africa's great PH's has difficulty overcoming the staggering ineptitude of a client.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

I don't think the ammo or the rifle was the problem, I think he kept putting the rifle on safe.

I just read your comment and rewatched the video very carefully. I know that in the commotion, all of his movements get a bit difficult to follow. But I am certain that he was experiencing two misfires.

My reasonings are as follows:
1) During the sequence where the rifle is simply going click, you can actually hear him loading two cartridges into the rifle.

2) After getting the faulty cartridges out, you can actually hear him saying “I don’t know what’s wrong with that round”.

3) The Heym Model 89B has a manual safety. And the client had already gotten off a shot at the elephant right before the misfires begin. Unless he was inept enough to DELIBERATELY keep putting the rifle on SAFE manually… I don’t think this was a safety operating issue.

Anyway, I think that that the client was clearly unfamiliar with his weapon. If I were a betting man, I’d say that he must have purchased the Heym Model 89B right before the Safari and didn’t get enough time to practice with it as much as he should have. He would have been far better served with a bolt action rifle of .416-.458 caliber. Having a big gun without proper training doesn’t make you armed any better than owning a guitar without taking any music lessons makes you a musician.

To his credit though, the initial two shoulder shots were properly placed and would have eventually folded that bull. The need to drop the elephant spot dead before sundown without necessitating tracking and placing so many shots into the animal without any immediate apparent terminal effects, is where the client’s panic & fumbling began to really manifest itself. It happens sometimes with people hunting big game for the first time with a relatively unfamiliar weapon.

 

[Altitude sickness]

I tried not to pile on. My first concern was his lack of anatomy knowledge . Len had to walk him through each head position. And it took :10 to describe where the ear hole was. Then where to shoot on each position of the head.

That lack of knowledge should have immediately relegated the shooter to body shots.

Len is very patient and forgiving. Considering his life is on the line.

 

[Philip Glass]

I just don't understand the leather work gloves.... even if the fingers are cut off, their is simply no need for them and I believe a contributing factor in the slow reloads. I would definitely like to hear the real story about what was going on with the ammo.

You need a glove on the left hand if shooting that much. It can get hot!

 

[Red Leg]

I just don't understand the leather work gloves.... even if the fingers are cut off, their is simply no need for them and I believe a contributing factor in the slow reloads. I would definitely like to hear the real story about what was going on with the ammo.

Anyone firing a double with a splinter forend quickly learns the necessity of a glove on the left hand. Held correctly, the left side hand actually is grasping the barrels. They heat up very quickly.

 

[Philip Glass]

It's hard to second guess many DG situations. Len is a pro and very well respected that is for sure. The biggest issue I see is the lack of an instant follow up shot with a double! African PH's always say American hunters have a tendency to "admire the shot" instead of following up quickly. I am guessing the failure to fire was most likely pulling the same trigger twice. Who knows.

 

[Philip Glass]

One thing that drives me nuts in so many off these videos is after spending very large amounts of money to be there and days of effort, they fire their initial shots on their target animal. Then rather than quickly reloading without having to look at their gun and ammo because they obviously haven’t practiced that. They WASTE PRECIOUS TIME LOOKING FOR AND PICKING UP THEIR BRASS! For the love of GOD! Practice reloading before going and look for your brass later!

I never pick up brass in a time like this but the trackers are always handing it to me! Crazy to take your eye of something that can kill you for an empty shell