Politics

Agree experts don’t know shit about this virus, that’s why it’s a novel virus

But their experience in this field helps, need to trust them
 
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Agree experts don’t know shit about this virus, that’s why it’s a novel virus

Well played.

I am not 100% sure we should trust them right from the get go, seems to me there is usually a lot of things wrong before they start to get it right.
 
Yes but remember trump administration is using their guidelines, even today. If trump wants the country opened up he’d change the guidelines they put out.
 
And yes trump tweeted out liberate Michigan,virginia

He sure did. He said liberate Minnesota too.

So he’s encouraging protests

He's encouraging people to stand up against government oppression. It's kinda what our country was founded on. We have it so good now that it's easy to forget that it sometimes isn't safe to stand up and fight for what you believe in. I fully support someone's right to do just that.
 
Yes fight what you believe for, you call it government oppression, I believe the governors you think are trying to bring socialism, lol, are actually more worried about saving lives

Everyone’s lives
 
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Yes fight what you believe for, you call it government oppression, I believe the governors you think are trying to bring socialism, lol, are actually more worried about saving lives

Then stay in the safety of your home as is your right. Problem solved. (y)

EWFBZL3VAAIc3BL

Love this
 
Love this

He died too soon. I was busy with life during the time he was active. Wish I had paid more attention to him back then.
 
I don’t have that choice to stay at home, I work construction, all over the Midwest, I do my best to protect myself and others I come in contact to. I’m scared of this virus

So I might be asymtomatic, idk but I don’t want to infect others,

I can’t get tested

And yes when I come home I stay at home, my family didn’t get together for Easter, first time in my 45 years on this earth.

So go ahead and gather to protest “socialist “ ideas.

None of you want to argue?

Safe at home
 
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Reviewing attributes of ideologies is revealing but arguing about the value of those ideologies has never changed anyone's position. But if it allows you to feel better, then by all means expound. In the meantime, I'm going to check the classified ads.
 
April 20, 2020
An Earth Day reckoning? Greenies panicking over the discrediting of computer models predicting disaster
By Thomas Lifson

We have learned the hard way that the scientists who produce mathematical models predicting disaster are not to be granted the presumption of infallibility. Nor are their demands that we impoverish ourselves in order to avert a disaster a matter of "settled science." The coronavirus doom that the Cassandras of prestigious scientific organs predicted is nowhere to be found, and it turns out that models are based on assumptions and can be spectacularly wrong.

Americans have sacrificed trillions of dollars and turned our lives upside-down based on predictions of millions of deaths if we didn't follow radically change our way of life, based on the pandemic predictions of modelers in the U.K. and USA.

How embarrassing for the modelers that tell us we have to make even deeper sacrifices for a global warming disaster that is decades away, if it ever develops. You can smell their panic in this planned propaganda blitz from the Olympian heights of the media establishment. Chris White of the Daily Caller News Foundation writes:

A project co-founded by the Columbia Journalism Review is asking hundreds of news outlets to focus their reporting on climate change on Earth Day as journalists focus primarily on coronavirus coverage.

The journalist heading the effort believes the media should be devoting the same level of attention to global warming as they do to a virus that has killed more than 100,000 people worldwide. (snip)

The founders behind Covering Climate Now are asking their network of more than 400 media outlets to blanket the airwaves with stories about climate change during the week of Earth Day. Reuters, Bloomberg News, and The Daily Beast are among the biggest names listed as partners of the project.

The project's co-founder, Mark Hertsgaard, has said news outlets should be devoting the same amount of time to climate change as they do COVID-19.

Paraphrasing the Wizard of Oz, "pay no attention to the modeler behind that curtain!"

But that's not going to happen, no matter how much propaganda is put out predicting doom. People are righteously angry over paying a huge price because some boffins with computer models overemphasized risks. They understand that models are just guesses and that the modelers who predict the biggest disaster also get the most attention.

To the 60,000 or more American fatalities due to the Wuhan virus, we can add the demise of the credibility of global warming models. The thin veneer of scientific infallibility has crumbled and cannot be restored.
 
But their experience in this field helps, need to trust them
“Trust but Verify” -Ronald Reagan
So far it seems that the “experts” have gotten as much wrong as right in their predictions of doom.
On the flip side, “Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater” might be another useful proverb. Yes, we should listen to and heed the advice of those who prove they possess knowledge and wisdom worth consideration. Blanket acceptance of a blanket approach to this situation should be met with resistance, particularly if/when it encroaches upon citizens fundamental liberties such as those enumerated in the 1st, 2nd, 4th and 10th Amendments to the Constitution, which we have actually seen.


Individual responsibility, no denying it is absent in many. We all bear an obligation of personal responsibility and particularly so in a situation like the current one. But let’s not forget that we ALL bear ultimate personal responsibility for our own well being. Our elderly and most vulnerable citizens don’t get a pass on this, as much as we may truly concern ourselves with their well being.
Personal experience; is it ok that an overweight, elderly man is at Lowe’s with his basket full of potted flowers? He’s obviously “most vulnerable” and I would say potted flowers aren’t exactly essential items. Should he be forcibly made to quarantine himself at home? Or maybe if those “most vulnerable” took personal responsibility and obeyed the stay at home order and the rest of the “rules”, then many of the restrictions on the general populace might be unnecessary?
 
All this socalled advice from the talking heads must be taken with a very large grain of salt. As has been mentioned, they are looking to make themselves look good at the expense of the truth. No one knows what the real truth concerning this virus is. A lot of supposition, theories, predictions and maybes but no incontrovertible scientific proof. Covid has become the latest political football with about as much substance as the impeachment fiasco.

As for this social distancing, it's pure fantasy. A sneeze or cough can be carried on a slight breeze for 50 yards or more according to a rep from CDC that talked to my son-in law's crew at work. Masks don't prevent one from contracting or spreading the virus. If air can pass through it when you breathe, so can the germ. A special medical grade respirator is the most effective means.

My Dad had a favorite saying for nearly every situation: "Use your own judgement." I think it applies today. Think about the situation, make a decision, and act accordingly.
 
I don’t have that choice to stay at home, I work construction, all over the Midwest, I do my best to protect myself and others I come in contact to. I’m scared of this virus

So I might be asymtomatic, idk but I don’t want to infect others,

I can’t get tested

And yes when I come home I stay at home, my family didn’t get together for Easter, first time in my 45 years on this earth.

So go ahead and gather to protest “socialist “ ideas.

None of you want to argue?

Safe at home

Do the math, Brandon. Solve the problem. This shotgun approach is wrong because it just delays the inevitable in the absence of a vaccine. We cannot keep this up for a year! A targeted approach that mandates isolation and no visitation of those 70+ years old and those of all ages with about seven underlying conditions would be a much more manageable approach and keep our economy from imploding. How lucky you are to be able to keep working through your fear. MANY WOULD LIKE TO TRADE PLACES WITH YOU. Easy for you to sit back and keep working and criticize those of us with imploding businesses and family members who have LOST their jobs.

The fatality rate of healthy people is about 1%. A few healthy people will die. Life is not without risk. Doctors and professors from Stanford University are saying this. Please explain to me how making us stay home is keeping the most vulnerable people safer than isolating them? All the ads and talk you hear on TV is that younger people should stay home so they don't spread it to the vulnerable. Well, isn't it clear to you and everyone that there are far more healthy and young people than there are vulnerable people? Basic common sense tells me that it would be easier to keep vulnerable people isolated than it is to keep everyone isolated? Duh! The current shotgun approach that tramples on our liberty and economy is easier for the politicians to throw out there than compiling lists from doctors of those with underlying conditions and then tracking them down - much like the contact tracing that we hear about. Isolate them while delivering their food and daily medications. Have a nurse check in on them from time to time. Make sure they have open communications with family and health workers. This suggested approach of isolating the vulnerable might cost billions but that would be better than trillions with the shotgun approach that puts too many people out of work. This is truly a case of the cure being worse than the disease. I will take the 1% fatality chance and obey a directive to not visit my parents and in-laws with underlying conditions. Geez, this isn't rocket science. Wake up people!
 
Scott, I understand why you are upset but I'll throw in my $.02 as to what I think you're getting wrong or explain maybe how we see things different.

First off, yes the shotgun approach sucks and I feel for everyone in the country who is hurting in one way or another. But what it was meant to do was to slow the number of cases so that those who needed care could get it. The overfilled hospitals early on in NYC and elsewhere just wasn't sustainable. Too many people would have gone without care and too many medical professionals would have gotten sick at the same time to truly give people proper care. At the very beginning they said that more people will get sick but they hoped to avoid doing things like putting two people on one ventilator or worst case scenario putting people on no ventilator because there weren't any available. In essence, slow infections to a manageable number. I live in an area where if there were too many infections, people just simply wouldn't get care. We do not have the beds to deal with a mass infection.

The problem I see with telling those with underlying conditions to stay home is that we as a country are so unhealthy that how do you differentiate? It isn't just the old that have underlying conditions these days. It's every overweight or obese 20-50 year old as well. We have millions with full blown diabetes or pre-diabetes and millions more with medical conditions because of our modern lifestyle.

In the long run I hope that businesses and individuals will learn to be more fiscally responsible in case of another possible scenario like the one we find ourselves in. Too many have overextended themselves and forgotten how to save money. This isn't just my opinion either. It's been backed up by experts. How many individuals in the free food lines pay hundreds of dollars every month for crap they don't need? Crap from China no less?

Not everyone was ever going to like the way things have gone but I don't remember anyone ever wishing for it either. It sucks and at this point it's about trying to save lives. Period. Pretending that the gov't is acting in a tyrannical manner isn't helping anyone. Neither is insulting anyone. Most everyone in the world has been hurt by this in one way or another, not just current business owners. Assume you're wrong and things got worse if we went the other way. What then? Maybe we would have hundreds of thousands or millions dead AND a depressed economy.


In short? This sucks!!!

CJW
 
Here in Idaho we are extremely! fortunate. There are 44 counties in Idaho. As of today 20 of those 44 counties have fewer than 10 confirmed cases. Yet, we have pretty much the same guidelines statewide. Whether you live in Washington, Camas, or Caribou county (which each have 1 case) or Ada and Blaine counties which have 1058 cases between them, schools are still shut down, restaurants are still shut down, etc.
We have both Lowe’s and Home Depot near me. Home Depot is limiting the number of people in the store at one time. The lines at Home Depot stretch a hundred yards or more. The parking lot is half full. Lowe’s is not limiting the number of customers in the store. You cannot find a parking spot even close to the Lowe’s parking lot.
So much of this just makes no sense. The U.S. is so diverse in so many ways there is no way to make a 1 size fits all approach make any sense.
Too much ambiguity in many areas, too much over reach in others, etc.
 
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Scott, I understand why you are upset but I'll throw in my $.02 as to what I think you're getting wrong or explain maybe how we see things different.

First off, yes the shotgun approach sucks and I feel for everyone in the country who is hurting in one way or another. But what it was meant to do was to slow the number of cases so that those who needed care could get it. The overfilled hospitals early on in NYC and elsewhere just wasn't sustainable. Too many people would have gone without care and too many medical professionals would have gotten sick at the same time to truly give people proper care. At the very beginning they said that more people will get sick but they hoped to avoid doing things like putting two people on one ventilator or worst case scenario putting people on no ventilator because there weren't any available. In essence, slow infections to a manageable number. I live in an area where if there were too many infections, people just simply wouldn't get care. We do not have the beds to deal with a mass infection.

The problem I see with telling those with underlying conditions to stay home is that we as a country are so unhealthy that how do you differentiate? It isn't just the old that have underlying conditions these days. It's every overweight or obese 20-50 year old as well. We have millions with full blown diabetes or pre-diabetes and millions more with medical conditions because of our modern lifestyle.

In the long run I hope that businesses and individuals will learn to be more fiscally responsible in case of another possible scenario like the one we find ourselves in. Too many have overextended themselves and forgotten how to save money. This isn't just my opinion either. It's been backed up by experts. How many individuals in the free food lines pay hundreds of dollars every month for crap they don't need? Crap from China no less?

Not everyone was ever going to like the way things have gone but I don't remember anyone ever wishing for it either. It sucks and at this point it's about trying to save lives. Period. Pretending that the gov't is acting in a tyrannical manner isn't helping anyone. Neither is insulting anyone. Most everyone in the world has been hurt by this in one way or another, not just current business owners. Assume you're wrong and things got worse if we went the other way. What then? Maybe we would have hundreds of thousands or millions dead AND a depressed economy.


In short? This sucks!!!

CJW

@CJW I appreciate your thoughtful response. Yes, I understand that we don't want to overwhelm the healthcare system but we are not all from NY, MA, MI, etc... and these mass shutdowns in areas where the virus is not nearly as prevalent just shows the idiocy of a one-size fits all approach. The Governor of SD ordered people over 65 and those with a long list of conditions to stay home in the most populated counties. That is much more reasonable and possible. This approach should have been implemented in MOST states. It would have saved many jobs while protecting the people that really need protecting. The subways in NYC were breeding grounds for transmission but we don't all live in NYC. Again, follow the numbers. Close to 99% of fatalities are people with conditions.

Yes, I understand that there are a lot of people with obesity. diabetes, heart conditions, lung conditions, etc... and I have people in my extended family with diabetes and lung issues. We are not visiting them and have arranged for them to be monitored. We are not idiots. But we are not subjects or sheep, either. Still, the numbers of healthy people vastly out-number the people with underlying conditions. Screen the healthy people and let them work with reasonable precautions.

And tell me how healthy people would overwhelm our hospitals? Yes, everybody can get this virus. The numbers show that 75% of the cases are healthy people, yet only 1% of them die. A manageable percentage of healthy people would need hospitalization. Do you understand that we have empty hospitals in our communities now? It was ridiculous to stop elective surgeries EVERYWHERE. Certainly our local healthcare professionals would know enough to put a stop to elective surgeries if need be wouldn't they? It's time to stop treating us all like a bunch of idiots. Also, if we kept the vulnerable people with underlying conditions strongly isolated, how do they get sick and overwhelm hospitals?

When politicians tell people they cannot buy paint or plant seed and you close large sections of public lands to fishing and hunting, that is way over the top and if taken to court, would not stand. Perhaps you have heard about the Mayor that banned a drive-up church service on Easter Sunday where people were not even leaving their own cars? Luckily a judge placed an injunction on that one. Or how about Cuomo criticizing a small family that went for a drive and got take-out food? Both legal activities and not putting others at risk.
 
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Anyone bump into this one?
Do you think the account was actually even around in 2009?
I have my strong doubts.

Screen Shot 2020-04-20 at 12.08.40.png
 
@CJW

When politicians tell people they cannot buy paint or plant seed and you close large sections of public lands to fishing and hunting, that is way over the top and if taken to court, would not stand. Perhaps you have heard about the Mayor that banned a drive-up church service on Easter Sunday where people were not even leaving their own cars? Luckily a judge placed an injunction on that one. Or how about Cuomo criticizing a small family that went for a drive and got take-out food? Both legal activities and not putting others at risk.


In WI we can buy paint and plant seed to my knowledge. Actually I thought all major agriculture was open. Even our nurseries are open. Hell it seems like most stores are open. Some public lands were closed because people were thick as fleas trying to get out of their homes.

As to the other things like Cuomo and Easter services, well, people are going to make decisions and say things that you and I don't like sometimes and may look back on themselves and say they were stupid. Cuomo isn't generally someone I would agree with or defend but he has been under a hell of alot of stress lately and he has to be feeling pretty foolish about being so cavalier early on wether he ever admits it or not. But if I were to get p***ed off about every little thing like that on a daily basis my hair would turn gray. I'm certainly not going to look back with 20/20 hindsight on the whole deal. Talk about a good way to drive yourself crazy. I'm also not going to act like anybody knew how to handle something like this with 100% efficiency especially after hearing about bodies being stacked like cordwood in Chinese hospitals. 3000 deaths my a**.

With fingers crossed everyone will figure out how to properly get things going in the next few weeks. One thing I know for sure is we all are never going to see things 100% the same. In general, I think things have been handled pretty well in most of the world whether others agree or not.

FWIW
 

THE LIAR TWEETS TONIGHT
 

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