Politics

I can see you’re from Ontario. If you lived in Alberta, you’d know that:

1. Hutterites don’t take, or get, welfare. They look after their own.

2. Everyone in Alberta has their medical costs covered by the province. Hutterites are no different.

3. Hutterites do pay taxes (see sec. 143 of the Income Tax Act (Canada). They often pay more than other farmers, because they don’t get the benefit of a corporate structure. The colony is taxed as if it were a trust, and the income of the colony is attributed to each of the adult members, who pay income tax on those deemed earnings, even though older don’t necessarily have access to the colony’s earnings. In addition, they pay property taxes, which most religious organizations do not. See, for example, https://www.producer.com/news/yes-hutterites-do-pay-taxes/

4. Hutterites are among the hardest working and most honest and business-like people you will meet. In addition, they are always willing to help out their neighbours in emergencies.

Enough said?

I couldn’t agree more. I’ve had a lot of dealings with the Hutterites over the years. Fine, hard working folks and some of the best farmers you will ever meet. I don’t understand why someone, who obviously knows nothing about them, would feel the need to vilify them.
 
I think the Mennonite’s here use tech.

Amish use plenty of technology, it’s a misnomer. The strictest, the Schwarzenruber, are about extinct in most areas. Old Order are fairly conservative, but they own generators to power equipment, cell phones for emergencies, they hire drivers for transport, and even solar panels to power cash registers and to recharge their power tools.

They don’t allow phones in their homes and they don’t allow in-home wiring.

Most are in the trades like steel shed building, concrete work, and similar. The side of the road farm stands are overpriced and small portions but they do well on the novelty in my area. (Gotta love their capitalism)
 
The problem with young people and democrats is they suffer the same naivety described as "Chesterton's Fence". They break/remove/destroy things without first understanding why the fence exists.

1.) Comprehend first
2.) Hidden purposes exist that are often more sophisticated than face value.
3.) Second-order thinking. Tearing something down without understanding its origin risks bringing back the problem it solved.
Are you saying this part ironically, or sarcastically, it's hard to tell...I agree with you though. However, the problem with Baby Boomers and Republican is that they refuse to take their own advice. Rules for thee but not for me. Republicans are running around demanding deregulation and the abandonment of the administrative state without understanding why those regulations exist in the first place. Sound familiar? There's a reason we have the EPA, or Banking regulations, or financial regs, or the SEC, how about the FDA (would you like us all to return to the days of snake oil salesmen)?

You couldn't have made a better case against Elon Musk and his DOGE efforts.....Move fast and break things, worry about the why later..am I right!

As pertains to ACA, democrats got fixated on the wrong things. Things like "see, more people have insurance" as though the measure of outcome was insurance coverage, rather than the costs of the actual care. (co-pays, deductibles, and premiums went up for the majority)
This was one outcome.

ACA was built to destroy what was working as a forced move towards single payer, third world toilet quality healthcare. Single payer has never worked in a heterogenous society, it works inefficiently even in homogenous societies where everyone has the same genetics, diet, fitness, and habits. (e.g. Japan)
Please cite your metrics for failure, and your sources for this statement. Please explain how all of these healthcare systems are failures:


The old system was pretty darned good compared to all the other systems.
Tens of millions of people disagree with this statement. This is a personal opinion not backed up by factual evidence.
It needed minor tweaks via capitalism such as A.) Allowing plans to compete across State lines to provide greater competition, B.) Allowing foreign mail order Rx that was far cheaper for generics.
These ideas would have marginal impact on costs. Generics are not the issue, name brand drugs are. Imagine the level of administrative need and cost to develop in-network and out-of-network systems for every health insurer in every state for all 50 states rather than just one. This may even raise costs.

C.) Banning the practice in half the States that you need approval from the existing hospitals to open up a new, competing hospital.
The only idea that you have had so far that can be back-ed up with math.

Instead we got this total abomination. The outcomes included my family healthcare doubling. It included forcing me as a male to pay for a plan that covered pregnancy. My wife and I intentionally avoided such plans because we paid out of pocket for delivery of our three kids knowing we wouldn't need that coverage thereafter.

Everything about the ACA was coercive redistribution of wealth for a more expensive, lower quality product.
Your healthcare premiums would have doubled anyways. Did you not review any of the sources I listed. The increase in premiums before and after the ACA is almost identical.
 
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Increased taxation on the rich is a nonsensical non-solution. There isn't enough wealth in the hands of the rich to fund our government without debt for even a single year.

When the lefties show up on this forum they always spout this off as a solution and I always dismiss it with a death ray of fact, rather than opinion. They ignore facts and repeat the solution over, and over again.
Jesus, how bad at math are you people. I knew most Americans were math illiterates, but I didn't know it was that bad. What circus schools did you guys go to? Total personal income taxes collected are about $2.4 Trillion dollars each year. The top 2% pay about 50% of those. Or $1.2 Trillion. Are you all still following the basic math? Stay with me people.

The net-effective tax rate paid by the top 1% is around 23% (I know I know, it's a little higher for the 2%-1% crowd, but we're rounding here people!). So taxing the rich at a 23% rate produces $1.2 Trillion in revenue. Still with me? Good. So if you double that amount to say 46%, that equals an additional $1.2 Trillion in revenue per year. Simple enough? Good. Our deficit is ~$1.85 Trillion.
1.85 - 1.2 = $650 billion deficit left over. Math isn't hard people. We could easily eliminate half of this remaining amount through programatic cuts. So lets say $325 Billion left. This remaining amount is less than 1% of GDP. So it doesn't matter much.

Congrats, we destroyed all incentive, all production, all wealth, all major companies, all major brands, all high-competence investors, all major capitalists. They are all gone and we only ran our bloated government for a single year.
I see you posted this at 8 am so I'll assume you forgot to have coffee yet. Do better.

The solution is the bottom 50% that pay no taxes need to have skin in the game. Raise their taxes to 1/4 their income.
Many of them do pay, just not income taxes, they still pay FICA taxes. But, have you ever heard the saying that "you can't squeeze blood out of a stone?"

That would solve the budget issues immediately. Immediately thereafter 99% of society would demand small government. It turns out when you pay for the gimmies, nobody wants "free" stuff any longer.
Very well then. How much should we cut from the sacred cows called Social Security and Medicare? So far nobody on here has advocated that. How about the bloated sacred cow called the military industrial complex? How much should we reduce their budget? How about Veteran's Affairs?

End all taxes except sales tax. Consumption tax is the fairest of any system that can be designed. Government must live within the means of the taxes collected and must have a balanced budget.
I guess no more military, no more SSA, no more Medicare, no more VA. Sorry veterans, sucks to be you. How very far-left of you. I didn't realize you supported unilateral disarmament. Good to know.
 
Our deficit is ~$1.85 Trillion.
1.85 - 1.2 = $650 billion deficit left over. Math isn't hard people. We could easily eliminate half of this remaining amount through programatic cuts.

@Big_Easy , tell you what, since eliminating 325 billion of problematic cuts is so easy in your mind, do it. I’m waiting. Math is simple! Get it done and then we can talk. This might take you a while, so please focus on it. Please refrain from any further posts on AH until you take care of this easy math problem. Good luck and Godspeed!
 
The side of the road farm stands are overpriced and small portions but they do well on the novelty in my area. (Gotta love their capitalism)
My partner has been wanting this chair that is made by the Amish in GA. Her girlfriend that lives in Alabama went and pick one up. Unfortunately shipping to CA costs more than the chair itself.

1785009257039.jpeg
 
I can see you’re from Ontario. If you lived in Alberta, you’d know that:

1. Hutterites don’t take, or get, welfare. They look after their own.

2. Everyone in Alberta has their medical costs covered by the province. Hutterites are no different.

3. Hutterites do pay taxes (see sec. 143 of the Income Tax Act (Canada). They often pay more than other farmers, because they don’t get the benefit of a corporate structure. The colony is taxed as if it were a trust, and the income of the colony is attributed to each of the adult members, who pay income tax on those deemed earnings, even though older don’t necessarily have access to the colony’s earnings. In addition, they pay property taxes, which most religious organizations do not. See, for example, https://www.producer.com/news/yes-hutterites-do-pay-taxes/

4. Hutterites are among the hardest working and most honest and business-like people you will meet. In addition, they are always willing to help out their neighbours in emergencies.

Enough said?
You forget I'm from Montana, not Alberta. No universal health care down there. And yes, they do claim welfare. My buddy (from 1st grade through university) is a Montana optometrist. Welfare pays for their glasses. And you need to watch them cash in their food stamps at the grocery store. And YES, those fiercely "self sufficient" farmers are in the grocery stores and Walmart constantly. They are not Amish!

I almost had to shoot it out with them twice while bird hunting. They think they own the federal land the colony grazing leases from BLM. But the law in Montana CLEARLY states public has access to any federal or state land that adjoins public road or navigable water, no matter who puts a fence around it. A couple years back one cranky old prick actually pointed his handgun at my dog. I leveled my shotgun at his grandson standing next to him. German was my second language at university so no real language barrier. He got the message in no uncertain terms. Then I told him if he was thinking about f*cking with my vehicle while I'm hunting, he'd be looking at some dead cows in the night and/or bailer full of holes. When I finished for the day and walked out, a game warden was waiting for me. He asked if I threatened the guy. "He pointed a handgun at my dog. Whatta you think?" "Yeah, that sounds about right. Bunch of pricks. Just watch your back and know where the boundaries are located." To this day whenever I hunt that stretch of Beaver Creek I always see the colony's fancy Suburban Hootermobile crawling up and down the county road watching me. Thankfully that area is in cell range now. Also had another Hooter up near the border try to bluff me into leaving. But he backed off very quickly. He understood English expletives just fine. And he learned very quickly I know how to read a map ... even if he didn't.

They treat their women like dirt and the headman and his family always live high on the hog. Those colonies are macho Putinish autocracies. Headman is typically (but not always) the only one in the colony with drivers license. Alcohol can only be kept in his house and he is not adverse to imbibing. I got more than a bit tipped over drinking with the headman of a colony near Swift Current. Very good wine! Some kind of wild fruit in the mix. Saskatoon maybe?
 
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I couldn’t agree more. I’ve had a lot of dealings with the Hutterites over the years. Fine, hard working folks and some of the best farmers you will ever meet. I don’t understand why someone, who obviously knows nothing about them, would feel the need to vilify them.
He rarely speaks from a position of knowledge or experience.. his statements didn’t surprise me at all..

There is a community of Hutterites in Montana north of Billings that a few members of AH are very familiar with… they’ve had nothing but good things to say about that community when we talked about them..

Several of the members of the community stopped by a local festival we attended. They seemed to be very well received by the local farmers and ranchers….
 
Jesus, how bad at math are you people. I knew most Americans were math illiterates, but I didn't know it was that bad. What circus schools did you guys go to? Total personal income taxes collected are about $2.4 Trillion dollars each year. The top 2% pay about 50% of those. Or $1.2 Trillion. Are you all still following the basic math? Stay with me people.

The net-effective tax rate paid by the top 1% is around 23% (I know I know, it's a little higher for the 2%-1% crowd, but we're rounding here people!). So taxing the rich at a 23% rate produces $1.2 Trillion in revenue. Still with me? Good. So if you double that amount to say 46%, that equals an additional $1.2 Trillion in revenue per year. Simple enough? Good. Our deficit is ~$1.85 Trillion.
1.85 - 1.2 = $650 billion deficit left over. Math isn't hard people. We could easily eliminate half of this remaining amount through programatic cuts. So lets say $325 Billion left. This remaining amount is less than 1% of GDP. So it doesn't matter much.


I see you posted this at 8 am so I'll assume you forgot to have coffee yet. Do better.


Many of them do pay, just not income taxes, they still pay FICA taxes. But, have you ever heard the saying that "you can't squeeze blood out of a stone?"


Very well then. How much should we cut from the sacred cows called Social Security and Medicare? So far nobody on here has advocated that. How about the bloated sacred cow called the military industrial complex? How much should we reduce their budget? How about Veteran's Affairs?


I guess no more military, no more SSA, no more Medicare, no more VA. Sorry veterans, sucks to be you. How very far-left of you. I didn't realize you supported unilateral disarmament. Good to know.

How ironic. How about cutting all the welfare and all benefits to all the parasites to include illegals? Dont forget those too. Oh, and BTW, I paid into Social Security, it’s not free. If I would have invested what the gov took, I would have a couple of millions by now. You obviously have been smoking some green Ganja. Wake up. How about telling our government to stop using our taxes like their own personal account.
 
Jesus, how bad at math are you people. I knew most Americans were math illiterates, but I didn't know it was that bad. What circus schools did you guys go to? Total personal income taxes collected are about $2.4 Trillion dollars each year. The top 2% pay about 50% of those. Or $1.2 Trillion. Are you all still following the basic math? Stay with me people.

The net-effective tax rate paid by the top 1% is around 23% (I know I know, it's a little higher for the 2%-1% crowd, but we're rounding here people!). So taxing the rich at a 23% rate produces $1.2 Trillion in revenue. Still with me? Good. So if you double that amount to say 46%, that equals an additional $1.2 Trillion in revenue per year. Simple enough? Good. Our deficit is ~$1.85 Trillion.
1.85 - 1.2 = $650 billion deficit left over. Math isn't hard people. We could easily eliminate half of this remaining amount through programatic cuts. So lets say $325 Billion left. This remaining amount is less than 1% of GDP. So it doesn't matter much.


I see you posted this at 8 am so I'll assume you forgot to have coffee yet. Do better.


Many of them do pay, just not income taxes, they still pay FICA taxes. But, have you ever heard the saying that "you can't squeeze blood out of a stone?"


Very well then. How much should we cut from the sacred cows called Social Security and Medicare? So far nobody on here has advocated that. How about the bloated sacred cow called the military industrial complex? How much should we reduce their budget? How about Veteran's Affairs?


I guess no more military, no more SSA, no more Medicare, no more VA. Sorry veterans, sucks to be you. How very far-left of you. I didn't realize you supported unilateral disarmament. Good to know.

My math is just fine, yours is just nuts. I see your blindness to facts because of a few things: 1.) I don’t believe you know many extremely affluent people, at least not intimately enough to understand the rarity of the skills they provide to society. 2.) You do not understand incentive structures. 3.) you do not understand the agency that people have to move or adjust habits to respond to incentives.

The average 1% earner today pays 26.1% effective Federal income tax at present after all deductions. Their total tax burden including salt is at about 51% taxes adding in average SALT. Your proposal is to tax them another 25%.

A.) That will never work. The affluent are already leaving leftist states for better incentives in TN, TX, and FL. The hard mode version of the game takes them to Puerto Rico to avoid those Federal income taxes altogether. Grind them into the dirt with Marxist level taxation you describe and any 1%er will just pull the Rockefeller maneuver: put all the family into a trust, the trust takes out gigantic life insurance policies on the family, they borrow tax free against the policies, upon death they repay the trust. <- it’s how rich people stay rich by thinking about incentives when knuckleheads get cute ideas about confiscation.

B.) you never calculate the value of the wealthy because you don’t want to appreciate them. Do you think they just suck it up and endure your ideas? They leave. They leave with their companies. They take the jobs with them. Your plot never considers the plummeting tax revenue from all the employees that get fired when their boss flees your terrible ideas. SFO has what, a 60% office vacancy rate due to flight of capital already as a perfect case study? Malta, Cyprus, Israel, Switzerland, New Zealand, Channel Islands, UAE, plenty of places to flee before you get a cent of their money using your proposed doubling of federal taxation on the 1%.

C.) you have no shame in that you think you’re justified to take 75% of any humans work product for your pork products coming out of government. The entitlement, greed, and envy says a lot about your character.
 
Tens of millions of people disagree with this statement. This is a personal opinion not backed up by factual evidence

This is a personal opinion, considering the election results of the 2010 elections hundreds of millions disagree with your statement.

Many of them do pay, just not income taxes, they still pay FICA taxes. But, have you ever heard the saying that "you can't squeeze blood out of a stone?

But yet you want stable prices, but advocate for the employer (not government) to provide paternal leave, sick leave, holiday leave, vacation, bereavement, etc, so how do you make that rock bleed?

So if you double that amount to say 46%,

How do you do this? Seriously I am asking? The reason why that tax rate is around 23% is because of long term capital gains and they harvest losses when they have a gain to offset it and deploy capital. You can go ahead and tax their wages at 46%, go ahead and raise capital gains to 46%, guess what rate the rich will pay, 23% or less, because they will find a way to make that money work for them, it might all done through a corporation, you going to raise the corporation rate? They will move offshore, so how do you get that 46%...which is on top of your FICA tax, state tax, and the other 20 taxes. So seriously how?

Also why would you hate the stock market doing 15% a year (sorry cant find the quote). That dropping off would have the biggest impact on generations of retirement funds.

Your ideas come across as someone who has read a few books, never ran a business, never worked with a tax professional, and probably got fire even though they were "doing their best" hence your hatred of corporate America. Yes you can do basic math but accuse others of not being able to, but you have no practical experience, and again you fail to connect dots or understand nuances.

Here is some advice, log off of here, stop being so bitter about the corporate world/rich people/basic jealously of success, figure out an actual plan or skill, and do what is best for you and your family...side benefit you can probably afford to hunt Africa.

Quick question: What African species do you want to hunt the most? Or is there a particular location you are looking at?
 
My math is just fine, yours is just nuts. I see your blindness to facts because of a few things: 1.) I don’t believe you know many extremely affluent people, at least not intimately enough to understand the rarity of the skills they provide to society. 2.) You do not understand incentive structures. 3.) you do not understand the agency that people have to move or adjust habits to respond to incentives.

The average 1% earner today pays 26.1% effective Federal income tax at present after all deductions. Their total tax burden including salt is at about 51% taxes adding in average SALT. Your proposal is to tax them another 25%.

A.) That will never work. The affluent are already leaving leftist states for better incentives in TN, TX, and FL. The hard mode version of the game takes them to Puerto Rico to avoid those Federal income taxes altogether. Grind them into the dirt with Marxist level taxation you describe and any 1%er will just pull the Rockefeller maneuver: put all the family into a trust, the trust takes out gigantic life insurance policies on the family, they borrow tax free against the policies, upon death they repay the trust. <- it’s how rich people stay rich by thinking about incentives when knuckleheads get cute ideas about confiscation.

B.) you never calculate the value of the wealthy because you don’t want to appreciate them. Do you think they just suck it up and endure your ideas? They leave. They leave with their companies. They take the jobs with them. Your plot never considers the plummeting tax revenue from all the employees that get fired when their boss flees your terrible ideas. SFO has what, a 60% office vacancy rate due to flight of capital already as a perfect case study? Malta, Cyprus, Israel, Switzerland, New Zealand, Channel Islands, UAE, plenty of places to flee before you get a cent of their money using your proposed doubling of federal taxation on the 1%.

C.) you have no shame in that you think you’re justified to take 75% of any humans work product for your pork products coming out of government. The entitlement, greed, and envy says a lot about your character.
Based on the language he uses, the syntax and expressions that regularly pop up, this character is a kid with little to no life experience or useful real world education. He contributes nothing anywhere else on the site, and I suspect has never hunted anything in his life. I originally identified him as a troll, but he is too persistent. I now believe @wesheltonj is correct. I am guessing first year graduate student. He lists North Carolina, so perhaps Chapel Hill, though it hardly matters. Here he has the opportunity to try and antagonize Boomers and Gen Xers. Perhaps some weird Freudian thing with respect to his father or grandfather? Then again maybe he is just a fully indoctrinated true believer in the coming socialist Nirvana.

I would love for @BRICKBURN to go through his posts and provide a professional assessment.

If I am wrong, then I would encourage him to provide us a brief synopsis of his professional vita. All of the regulars here have a pretty good understanding of our peers on the site. I respect all of their informed contributions. Whatever he offers, we have actual experts in almost any field who would spot any inconsistencies. For instance, I can state with absolute confidence that he never served a day as a military officer or held a meaningful position in a major corporation.
 
Based on the language he uses, the syntax and expressions that regularly pop up, this character is a kid with little to no life experience or useful real world education. He contributes nothing anywhere else on the site, and I suspect has never hunted anything in his life. I originally identified him as a troll, but he is too persistent. I now believe @wesheltonj is correct. I am guessing first year graduate student. He lists North Carolina, so perhaps Chapel Hill, though it hardly matters. Here he has the opportunity to try and antagonize Boomers and Gen Xers. Perhaps some weird Freudian thing with respect to his father or grandfather? Then again maybe he is just a fully indoctrinated true believer in the coming socialist Nirvana.
More insults disguised as guesswork. Stay on topic please.

I would love for @BRICKBURN to go through his posts and provide a professional assessment.
I have stated more facts to back up my position, and cited more high quality sources than everyone else that has posted on this thread combined over the past 6 months. If a MOD would like to discuss with me, I would welcome that. My question for @BRICKBURN would be, why am I the one that must absorb daily disgusting insults and rhetoric, while it seems that no one else is held to that standard? Everyone else is allowed to insult and degrade away on me.

If I am wrong, then I would encourage him to provide us a brief synopsis of his professional vita.
Doing so would require me to Dox myself, and I'm not interested in right-wing cancel culture coming for my job. Especially since the hate and anger on this thread is quite evident.

All of the regulars here have a pretty good understanding of our peers on the site. I respect all of their informed contributions. Whatever he offers, we have actual experts in almost any field who would spot any inconsistencies. For instance, I can state with absolute confidence that he never served a day as a military officer or held a meaningful position in a major corporation.
I have never claimed to serve in the military. And I'm not sure what that has to do with discussing the topic of our current budget deficits? Please define "meaningful position in a major corporation," and why that matters?
 
Who needs drugs when I can endlessly free-base right-wing hypocrisy and conspiracy theories on this forum.

Spar the victim mentality, you deliberately come on here to antagonize people. You given just as good as you have gotten.

For the most part it has been rather tame, no one hates you on this site, so lighten up. It is amazing someone would come to a site to post day after day when they feel insulted and hated.

You should be more worried about anti-hunters doxxing you, but that would probably require a hunting report or something like that.
 
My math is just fine, yours is just nuts.
Then actually use some math, and cite a source. See below.

The average 1% earner today pays 26.1% effective Federal income tax at present after all deductions. Their total tax burden including salt is at about 51% taxes adding in average SALT. Your proposal is to tax them another 25%.
The Tax Foundation disagrees with your math:

Americans for Tax Fairness disagrees with your math:

The Congressional Joint Committee on Taxation disagrees with your math:

A.) That will never work. The affluent are already leaving leftist states for better incentives in TN, TX, and FL. The hard mode version of the game takes them to Puerto Rico to avoid those Federal income taxes altogether.
Americans are taxed on their world-wide income, plugging tax loopholes is possible if congress has the backbone to do it.

Grind them into the dirt with Marxist level taxation you describe and any 1%er will just pull the Rockefeller maneuver: put all the family into a trust, the trust takes out gigantic life insurance policies on the family, they borrow tax free against the policies, upon death they repay the trust. <- it’s how rich people stay rich by thinking about incentives when knuckleheads get cute ideas about confiscation.
More personal insults and rhetoric. Again, you act as if these issues can't be ameliorated by congress. As if these laws are set in stone forever. Congress couldn't change the legality of such tax avoidance maneuvers? The rich use such vehicles because the laws allow it.

B.) you never calculate the value of the wealthy because you don’t want to appreciate them. Do you think they just suck it up and endure your ideas? They leave. They leave with their companies. They take the jobs with them.
Cite some examples. We are not talking about corporate taxes, we're talking about personal ones. Don't confuse them. Where is Elon Musk going to go? His companies are heavily dependent upon federal government money. Money that can be redirected to other companies that have decided not to offshore jobs.

Your plot never considers the plummeting tax revenue from all the employees that get fired when their boss flees your terrible ideas. SFO has what, a 60% office vacancy rate due to flight of capital already as a perfect case study?
Stop lying and cite some sources. The SFO vacancy rate is 29.7%

Malta, Cyprus, Israel, Switzerland, New Zealand, Channel Islands, UAE, plenty of places to flee before you get a cent of their money using your proposed doubling of federal taxation on the 1%.
Then why haven't they all done so already? I mean if these places are so fantastic, and don't charge them any taxes on their money, why aren't all the Billionaires living there right now?

Again, the United States Government allowing its citizens to park money in tax havens with little repercussions is a choice they've made.

C.) you have no shame in that you think you’re justified to take 75% of any humans work product for your pork products coming out of government.
Again, stop lying, my suggestion, which was asked of me, was to increase to 46% federal tax rate, not 75%.

The entitlement, greed, and envy says a lot about your character.
The insults, lying, rhetoric, and lack of ability to cite fact based sources says a lot about your character as well. Would you rather our country fail financially due to a massive debt load rather than increase taxes on the rich? Putting rich people above the viability of your own countries future says a lot about your character as well.
 

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