Politics

[Tubby’s Canteen]

It’s been my experience when dealing in rough environments with undesirable people that when you tell somebody something once and they don’t listen your best next coarse of action is to hit them, repeating yourself is a sign of weakness and robs you credibility. The next time you tell them something they are more likely to listen.

Most of those negotiating skills were learned on the docks and in log yards but I see no reason why it wouldn’t work internally.

 

[Brent in Az]

We could actually send you professor. Your drooling fanaticism would fit in perfectly with the Iranians. They could chant "Death to the USA" and you could chant "Trump kicks ass and Death to Iran." It would be so cool.

Strangely I have actually done lots of complex, interesting and some international negotiations.

Tell us about your background in the field professor. I can't wait.

Not long ago you told me you were a lawyer for sexually exploited children. I guess that encompasses international negotiations.....lol
Iran sounds like a gold mine for your expertise

 

[Altitude sickness]

RLD, that ironclad JCPOA you keep referencing was full of holes. From a neutral source. “ IAEA was being denied access to a specific new, fourth enrichment plant/tunnel complex at Isfahan”

 

[RLD]

“How you do that in 21 hours in a complicated international negotiation is beyond me.”

I actually think it was a waste of U.S. jet fuel and 21 hrs. Everyone knows they don’t honor any deal ever made with them. It was simply to show the world. They tried before they take over the Straits and invade Kharg Island.

So it wasn't the United States who broke the JCPOA by unilaterally withdrawing and imposing sanctions?

Gotta tell ya man, the United States is not the honourable agreement partner they used to be. Iran don't have clean hands at all, but neither do the United States.

 

[RLD]

Not long ago you told me you were a lawyer for sexually exploited children. I guess that encompasses international negotiations.....lol
Iran sounds like a gold mine for your expertise

I am happy to tell you about all the negotiating I have done over the years. And I currently am doing almost exclusively litigating claims on behalf of child SA victims. Which has really been going in Ontario since the change in the law in 2016. Of course I was called to the bar in 1992 and had over two decades in before that stuff all opened up. But of course a rube like you would have no clue about how that has all evolved up here. It's not 'Merican right?

But let me ask you professor, what do you think I do as a lawyer for sexually abused children when we are litigating? Would you like some clues? How about I negotiate with insurers, churches, religious orders, the Boy Scouts, Big Brothers Big Sisters, school boards, governments etc. Think that might be part of the gig?

I am happy to compare negotiation c.v.'s professor. What kind of deal did you get on turnips on that truck?

 

[Scott CWO]

Well shit Scott, than you could do it. Why even get on the plane then, you can send a one line e-mail. That is why it took China, Russia and others months to construct a deal what included details of little things like verification. I guess they were all incompetent and you should have done the whole deal. Could have had it wrapped before dinner.

And thankfully I am no JD Vance.

Some of us don’t negotiate. Hard for a liberal lawyer to understand I suppose. I set reasonable terms where both sides win but don’t get everything. If that’s not good enough, goodbye. Talk is cheap, unless lawyers are involved. That’s also the biggest problem in Washington - too many lawyers in Congress.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

So it wasn't the United States who broke the JCPOA by unilaterally withdrawing and imposing sanctions?

Gotta tell ya man, the United States is not the honourable agreement partner they used to be. Iran don't have clean hands at all, but neither do the United States.

Dang man way to be a terrorist sympathizer

 

[RLD]

RLD, that ironclad JCPOA you keep referencing was full of holes. From a neutral source. “ jamesiilesas@preszler.filevineapp.ca

I don't know who that neutral source is, but the IAEA and all of the participating world powers except the United States published multiple reports confirming compliance before the U.S. hit the road.

The agreement may not have been perfect, that according to all of the technical people involved there might have been one Iranian violation of the agreement over heavy water production (which is used in civilian uses, Canada produces tons of heavy water for example).

Now let's take a look at that allegation. It was made in what 2026? The evidence came out for it in 2026 or so, or maybe 2025? The U.S. had left the agreement and re-imposed sanctions when again?

So the theory is that the U.S. can unilaterally withdraw from the agreement and impose sanctions (specifically barred by the agreement) and Iran is supposed to continue to abide the the agreement after the United States has both left it and violated one of its central terms? That is a tough sell man.

 

[Altitude sickness]

So it wasn't the United States who broke the JCPOA by unilaterally withdrawing and imposing sanctions?

Gotta tell ya man, the United States is not the honourable agreement partner they used to be. Iran don't have clean hands at all, but neither do the United States.

Before Trump withdrew from the JCPOA Iran was not allowing the IAEA access to Isfahan. That broke the deal.

Obamas deal allowed Iran to develop nuke weapons. (Slower than Iran liked, but they were still allowed). Trumps “deal” does not.

 

[RLD]

Some of us don’t negotiate. Hard for a liberal lawyer to understand I suppose. I set reasonable terms where both sides win but don’t get everything. If that’s not good enough, goodbye.

Then why did J.D. make the trip? To lead the victory parade? Are you saying J.D. and Trump didn't plan to engage in negotiations? They said they did. It sure looked like they did. You are not calling them liars are you?

So much for the Art of the Deal.

 

[Tanks]

Amazing that someone gave you a copy of their actual position.

It is out there. Google is your friend. What I mentioned were the basic non-starters in their 10 point plan. In reality none of them would be acceptable.

A Closer Look at Iran’s 10 Demands—and Which the U.S. Might Accept — The Wall Street Journal

President Trump said the Iranian plan is a starting point, but there is a lot of ground to cover before a deal can be reached

apple.news

 

[RLD]

Before Trump withdrew from the JCPOA Iran was not allowing the IAEA access to Isfahan. That broke the deal.

Obamas deal allowed Iran to develop nuke weapons. (Slower than Iran liked, but they were still allowed). Trumps “deal” does not.

That is not what Trump said about why he withdrew. I think you have your chronology wrong.

The P5+1 deal limited Iran's ability to enrich to a 300 kg stockpile at 3.6% or so until 2030. You are not making a bomb out of 3.6% enriched uranium.

 

[RLD]

It is out there. Google is your friend. What I mentioned were the basic non-starters in their 10 point plan. In reality none of them would be acceptable.

A Closer Look at Iran’s 10 Demands—and Which the U.S. Might Accept — The Wall Street Journal

President Trump said the Iranian plan is a starting point, but there is a lot of ground to cover before a deal can be reached

apple.news

Two things, what get reported in the news is often not what gets put on the table.

Secondarily, if this reporting is correct why did Trump specifically say the ten point plan Iran submitted to the Pakistani mediators was "a workable basis on which to negotiate" and a "significant step." I was actually quite gobsmacked when he made those comments.

You should also know that Trump specifically said that what was being reported in the media about the ten point plan was inaccurate.

 

[Tex .416]

If anyone wants to see what the IAEA had to say, here is a chronological gathering of their interactions attempting to inspect and monitor Iran’s activity.

The bottom line summary: Iran was actively blocking the IAEA’s attempts to monitor and inspect.

The words “grave concern” appear over and over and over going back for years.

IAEA and Iran: Chronology of Key Events | IAEA

www.iaea.org

So it wasn't the United States who broke the JCPOA by unilaterally withdrawing and imposing sanctions?

Gotta tell ya man, the United States is not the honourable agreement partner they used to be. Iran don't have clean hands at all, but neither do the United States.

RLD,

quoting my earlier post for you to make it easy to find. See the IAEA Chronology of Events at the end of my post quoted above. The IAEA wrote extensively on Iran’s non-compliance from the very beginning. Iran actively blocked IAEA monitoring and inspections, which was the most critical point of the JCPOA.

IRAN NEVER COMPLIED.

Iran also has proven it will never comply.

 

[LivingTheDream]

So it wasn't the United States who broke the JCPOA by unilaterally withdrawing and imposing sanctions?

They weren't allowing inspectors to review the nuclear sites. This was a violation.

 

[Brent in Az]

I am happy to tell you about all the negotiating I have done over the years. And I currently am doing almost exclusively litigating claims on behalf of child SA victims. Which has really been going in Ontario since the change in the law in 2016. Of course I was called to the bar in 1992 and had over two decades in before that stuff all opened up. But of course a rube like you would have no clue about how that has all evolved up here. It's not 'Merican right?

But let me ask you professor, what do you think I do as a lawyer for sexually abused children when we are litigating? Would you like some clues? How about I negotiate with insurers, churches, religious orders, the Boy Scouts, Big Brothers Big Sisters, school boards, governments etc. Think that might be part of the gig?

I am happy to compare negotiation c.v.'s professor. What kind of deal did you get on turnips on that truck?

Well ....we all better bow down to a big time negotiator with the Boy Scouts, and Pedophile Priests.
I stand in the shadow of your greatness.
You better team up with Rubio & Company and get the Iran deal settled in short order.

 

[LivingTheDream]

Vance says he got to their best and final position before he left. That is bush league. How you do that in 21 hours in a complicated international negotiation is beyond me.

If this was before the war. I would probably agree with you, but given they really weren't in a position to negotiate in equal terms, they were there to negotiate how to get the beatings to stop. I honestly think in that position 21 hours was too long. It could have been 1 hour and 5 minutes.

US: Are you willing to give up your quest for nuclear weapons.

Iran: No

US: You have 1 hour to change your mind or else we are leaving. If you change your mind we can continue to negotiate the terms. Get up and walk out.

 

[mdwest]

Most people in the C suite are not evil geniuses from 007 movies or like Mr. burns from the Simpsons.

Now wait a damn minute! I always fancied myself as a younger and better looking Dr Evil…

 

[SaintPanzer]

Yeah. I mean, what would a guy who went to Yale Law School, then worked on the boards of several venture capital companies, founding advocacy organizations, or serving in the US Senate know about negotiation?

They should have hired a professional, like this guy. He would have come home with a deal.

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

Win-win or no deal is a good way to negotiate. No deal is better than a bad deal.

Iran thought they controlled the SOH. That will change, starting tomorrow. The pain will be felt by a lot of countries and everyone will now be focused on a collective solution. Just my opinion. No oil or LNG being exported and no food being imported. Not just Iran, but all the Persian Gulf countries. Iran will eventually tap out.