Micro Red Dot Sight Options for Double Rifles

vette447

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I know that this has been mentioned or asked a few times but not in awhile and I haven't seen a bunch of options or pictures.

I have a vintage (1920s) Rigby Double in 9.3x74r (originally 350 No2 and rechambered by Rigby years ago).I am planning on going to France for a driven Boar hunt in January and I would love to use this rifle for that hunt. It is currently setup with iron sights (one standing, three folding rear and Westley Richards style flip hooded front) and I am thinking that it would be more useful for this hunt with some sort of optics. This gun would be great with claw scope mounts. However, I can not bring myself to have scope mounts put on this gun as I couldn't desecrate this classic rifle as adding the mounts to the rib would likely require the rear sight be moved and obliterating the barrel address, etc. However, I am considering having a micro red dot mount made that could replace the rear sight so that the original could be drifted off and back on to preserve what originality of the gun.

For red dots; I am thinking possibly a Docter or Trijicon RMR or maybe even the new SRO. I want something that will aid in usefulness of the rifle for hunting but not detract from the slender and handy nature of the rifle.

Thus, I was wondering if any of you have done something similar with a classic Double? Can you please share your thoughts/experience and especially pictures of the setup. Thanks!
 

AZDAVE

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I haven't done it on a classic double but have a kahles red dot that will replace the Vortex Razor red dot on my 9.3x74 chapuis. It would be a nice driven game rifle.

Having a mount made for the rear sight dovetail sounds like a very good way to keep the classic line to your Rigby. Look forward to seeing your setup
 

Ridgewalker

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I found this on the internet. Maybe it will help.
77DAA646-1CA8-45E8-818F-12C04ADDBFE2.jpeg
B23A0900-BB0C-46EA-8232-03A9CEA1BC41.jpeg
355BD550-1594-4119-B55B-F8F7D6644943.jpeg

Unfortunately I cannot remember where I found it, but this was about all there was. They machined a piece of picatinny rail to make it. I think they mounted an Aimpoint red dot.
 

Opposite Pole

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Looks like Krieghoff barrels, there are mounts for that base on the last picture. Picatinny rail does not belong on a double in my opinion.
 

vette447

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Thanks. Yep, that does look like a modern Kreighoff which has that built in capability.
 

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Thanks. Yep, that does look like a modern Kreighoff which has that built in capability.

I don’t know how hard it would be to machine a base like that into the barrels, I’m guessing not too hard but it’s just a guess. I don’t mind the look of the mount on the Heym rifle I posted above. Looks like it’d be very discreet ones you take the sight off.
 

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Good article Opposite Pole! Personally I wasn’t looking at the picatinny rail, but was looking at how they machined the base to fit the Krieghoff existing location. Even by adding another picatinny mount on top of the rail, your sighting probably moves your cheek off the stock. Not good in my view.
Massaro mentioned using a 1 MOA dot. I personally think a 3 or even 4 MOA dot would be quicker and more appropriate for a double used at under 100 yards. JMO

At my age, I need only one dot to look at, so I think (though it may not be “period” appropriate) I would get a red dot sight for any gun that had open sights. Again JMO for my old eyes.

Best of luck figuring out what to do!
 

Philip Glass

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I’ve bought a Kahles for my K gun but have not had it put on yet. It’s small and high quality so it does not detract from the guns beauty IMO.
Philip
 

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Micro red dots are actually wonderful. Small compact though not elegant but helps with my older eyes. I have a Leupold but most experience is the Burris fastfire. I have never had any issue with many shots and heavy recoil. I use them on slug and turkey guns. Turkey loads are hevi shot and my slug loads put heavy recoil on them certainly equivalent of my 375HH. Even though all the manufacturers state parallax free they are not, repeatable checkweld and eye alignment are important. I am sure a good gunsmith can tap or come up with a good mounting solution without taking away from a classic.
 

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I have a Krieghoff Classic in 470 NE that I am in the process of mounting a Trijicon RMR on as my 74 year old eyes are not what they once were. I had JoJo's Gun shop mill a Trijicon RM 62 solid steel block base (essentially a thick block of steel with posts and threaded holes meant to be machined into a custom base) to fit the small section of removable rib that is attached to the rear of a K gun's barrels with two machine screws. JoJo's did the work in 2 weeks for $200 and the finished piece fits perfectly. The top of the finished piece fits perfectly flush with the balance of the rib and, except for the two little posts, one does not notice any change to the rifle as on modifications were made to the barrels. Remove two screws to replace the original part. I have not yet purchased the RMR and I am out of town but will post photos after I get the RMR. I chose the RMR over the SRO because the optical center of the RMR is 0.241 inches lower than that of the SRO resulting in virtually no change to cheek weld and the instantaneous alignment of eye with the RMR sight. I can't wait to be able to see the sights clearly and shoot quickly without restrictions imposed by age.
 

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I use this mount on my Merkel 150 AE 450-400 with a Burris fastfire. It is instantly removeable / attachable, returns to zero, and looks and fits as it should. It requires a standard Recknagel rotary base plate to attach to. https://www.optics-trade.eu/ca/maklick-mount-for-docter-sight.html. It's probably just me, but a putting a picatinny rail on a nice double seems out of place and kind of gauche. This solution is more elegant and requires no custom machining, unless your rifle has no provision for base plates. In any case if you machine a dovetail for standard European rotary mounts and install a Recknagel base it will look correct for the firearm.
 

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perttime

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How do the mini red dot sights last on rifles that recoil?

I'm on a forum where people have put them on the slides of 9mm handguns. That can be rough as they shoot a lot and the sight moves with the slide. Nothing REALLY seems to last long, there. I suspect Aimpoint's new Acro might be durable but people have doubts about the small window and the thick walls of the housing.
 

Scrumbag

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@vette447

I went through a similar process with a 9.3x62 that was not drilled and tapped and I didn't want to try with the round bridges.

I ended up using a mounting block from JP Enterprizes (fits the Leupold Delta Point, Delta Point Pro, Shield RMS, Shield SMS, and Redfield Accelerator maybe others) and can be machined to fit in a dovetail (Perhaps if you remove your irons you will have a handy dovetail, often can be drifted out)

Block where the base is machined to fit your dovetail (https://jprifles.com/buy.php?item=JPA-GS)

775.jpg


Then with the adapter plate, sits on top of the block (https://jprifles.com/buy.php?item=ARR-JP/DR)

1799.jpg


It will accomodate sights with the Docter Pattern footplate (Docter / Noblex, Leica, Kahles, Burris Fastfire and possibly some others I'm missing)

I swapped out my express V at the back of my 9.3x62 for a reflex red dot sight, started with a Burris Fastfire but swapped to a Leica Tempus for the smaller dot.

Original folding rear express sight in dovetail

WgW1I44.jpg


Block milled to fit dovetail with adapter plate for Docter footprint optics:

9CAYwYk.jpg


(Sorry is rather grainy image - make sure smith fits facing forward, adapter plate seen extending rearward)

Image of block with a grub allen head screw drilled and tapped through it. On a high recoiling rifle I was advised this might be a good idea to stop the block and sight walking / drifting sideways under recoil

TshYgzh.jpg


Burris Fastfire mounted to block

CBx1lFg.jpg


Overall view of rifle

GyZmc4i.jpg


Really bad attempt at photo of sight picture (Actually looks much better!)

TsuzTnL.jpg


Any questions please don't hesitate to get in touch and will help in any way I can.

Scrummy
 

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Scrumbag

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Any chance of some pictures of your current set up?

I used to shoot driven boar in France a fair bit. Where are you hunting?

Scrummy
 

Scrumbag

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Good article Opposite Pole! Personally I wasn’t looking at the picatinny rail, but was looking at how they machined the base to fit the Krieghoff existing location. Even by adding another picatinny mount on top of the rail, your sighting probably moves your cheek off the stock. Not good in my view.
Massaro mentioned using a 1 MOA dot. I personally think a 3 or even 4 MOA dot would be quicker and more appropriate for a double used at under 100 yards. JMO

At my age, I need only one dot to look at, so I think (though it may not be “period” appropriate) I would get a red dot sight for any gun that had open sights. Again JMO for my old eyes.

Best of luck figuring out what to do!

1 MOA probably OK. If you want a bigger dot you you can crank the brightness up and get it to flair for a bigger got. I found I preferred the 2MOA to the 3MOA dot when I did zeroing work and it a small roe deer steps out a bit more precision might be welcomed (But really we are talking preference here)

Scrummy
 

chashardy

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I put a Trijicon RMR on my Chapuis 375 H&H double. The rib had a small removable block that made mounting the RMR onto the rib pretty easy. It made all the difference in the world in shooting for me. I have seen lots of African hunting videos and both client hunters and PH's are now using red dot sights on doubles.
 

Scrumbag

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How do the mini red dot sights last on rifles that recoil?

I'm on a forum where people have put them on the slides of 9mm handguns. That can be rough as they shoot a lot and the sight moves with the slide. Nothing REALLY seems to last long, there. I suspect Aimpoint's new Acro might be durable but people have doubts about the small window and the thick walls of the housing.

Hi there Perttime,

There is probably more G from a handgun slide than any rifle. I've had a Burris Fastfire on a slug gun for a couple of years and it's doing great.

Scrummy
 

Ed Lally

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I am thinking of putting a Trijicon RMR on my Krieghoff Classic in 470NE. A mounting plate is required and the Trijicon RMR plate has 2 pins on top which fit into the indexing holes in the bottom of the RMR and two threaded holes for screws to attach the RMR to the plate. I know that the Trijicon SRO also fits this plate. Do any other red dot sights fit this plate?
 

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