Giraffe Caliber?

[billc]

I see all the funny people are around again. You are all just luck you can tell people you know a guy who hunted down a killer giraffe.

Make sure you have extra rounds with you just not what is in the gun. I did learn that lesson even though I did not need one by the end it was looking like I did.

 

[Catahoula]

I've pretty much settled on the 8mm, but may take the 416 along if it doesn't sell. Now I'm down to deciding which bullet to use. I've narrowed my choices to the 250 grain Woodleigh or the 220 grain Woodleigh or Swift A frame. The 250 Woodleigh has a slightly better SD and BC than the Swift and would be driven at 2600-2700 fps. The 220 Swifts (or Woodleigh) would run about 100 fps faster. On giraffe, obviously, penetration and the bullet holding together are critical. I'm leaning towards the Woodleigh based on experience. I've never used the Swifts.

Here is some of the reasoning for why I'm leaning towards the Woodleigh. The Woodleigh I used on buffalo performed admirably. The 450 grain bullet pictured below penetrated the complete length of the body from the rear and lodged just under the skin in the neck. It weighed 424 grains when I got it home. The 200 grain Nosler Partition pictured below, or what is left of it, was recovered from an Impala shot at about 60 or 70 yards. It did the job, but the partitions fired into a zebra fell apart and failed to penetrate. I was driving them a touch over 3000 fps. Maybe too fast for the design? Anyway, I won't be using them again. So......Woodleigh or Swift?

 

[billc]

I think either the Woodleigh or A frames will work and do about the same damage on the giraffe. I would not be scared to use either but since you like the one already and never used the other it maybe best to use what you like already.

 

[CAustin]

Giraffe chasing Bill yelling, "Who is your Daddy".

On my last hunt the giraffe saw Pieter's truck pull up and I thought I heard them snickering. They must of thought Bill was back for another go.

 

[Bullthrower338]

I love the 8 mag, it is definitely a slaying machine! With an 220 Gr A-Frame around 2900 fps generating about 4100 ft lbs of energy, there are not to many dark places I wouldn't walk and feel comfortable. If you don't have a 375, take the 8 and don't look back.
The 8 mag never gained popularity like the 7RM, most claim due to American disdain for metric calibers. I believe it didn't get a foothold because it is more recoil than the average US hunter cares to absorb. I had heard horror stories at the GS about the 8 mag, so I bought one. I found recoil, while stout, very manageable and it was easy to load for(although bullet selection sucked at the time). Maybe if they called her the 325 mag back then it may have took off. I still have a few 8 mags around but drifted off to the 338 as my go to NA hunting rifle mainly due to availability of components and loaded ammo if needed. A couple years ago I was in a feed store in west Texas and they had 10 boxes of Remington ammo on the shelf, it had been there for so long they about gave it to me!lol As they say there is an ass for every seat. Sometimes it takes a long time for it to come through the door.
Good Luck,
Cody

 

[Ernie Shipman]

GREAT question - not much on the forum for this. I am interested as I am doing a giraffe this July. I hunted the Limpopo province in June 2015. I took a gemsbuck, kudu, wildebeast, zebra & a blesbuck all with my PH's 375. All 1 shot kills, all dropped within 0-50 yds...
I plan to take a rifle this time. I have been in touch with my PH. I suggested my Sako 30-06 or my Sako 375 H&H. I also plan to shoot 1-2 warthogs and maybe 1-2 more plains games animals. My PH said bring the 30-06 BUT, he would only allow a high neck shot. He said if we have to do a frontal chest shot, no way, the front skin is 1-2 inches thick. He really advises the 375...., but I am a fair shot & he is perfectly happy with me bringing the '06.
I am a dealer & at the SHOT show this past week I ordered a bunch of Merkel products for my shop. One o the rifles coming in is a Merkel Helix in 9.3x62. In doing some reading, it sounds a but like a 375 "lite". I plan to ask the PH about this as a possible option. Norma makes a 286 gr load that looks impressive...They also do a 236 gr that would ideal for plains game I believe....
Best wishes!

 

[ArmyGrunt]

I took mine with my .416 Ruger. Sorry but I do not recommend anything less than .375 for giraffe.
Have a great hunt and hey we all need to shoot more giraffes. The last hunt I was on they have to cull 30-40 giraffe per year!
Regards,
Philip

Cull giraffe? That sounds like it could be in my price range!

 

[Catahoula]

I love the 8 mag, it is definitely a slaying machine! With an 220 Gr A-Frame around 2900 fps generating about 4100 ft lbs of energy, there are not to many dark places I wouldn't walk and feel comfortable. If you don't have a 375, take the 8 and don't look back.
Cody

I don't have a 375, but do have a 416. I just really like my 8mm magnum. The one thing in favor of the A frame over the Woodleigh is published load data. Woodleigh doesn't have data for the 250 grain bullet in their manual. The Lee manual has a couple of loads listed for 250 grain bullets and I've got an old Barnes manual on the way that I'm hoping has data for their 250 grain original. That should give me a starting point.

 

[Bullthrower338]

I don't have a 375, but do have a 416. I just really like my 8mm magnum. The one thing in favor of the A frame over the Woodleigh is published load data. Woodleigh doesn't have data for the 250 grain bullet in their manual. The Lee manual has a couple of loads listed for 250 grain bullets and I've got an old Barnes manual on the way that I'm hoping has data for their 250 grain original. That should give me a starting point.

This is what impresses me so much with the aframe bullet. I recovered all three bullets out of a scemitar horned oryx.

Left bullet: 325 yards, impact velocity @1700fps, retained weight 298.7 gr
Middle bullet: 100 yards(+/-), impact velocity @2200fps, retained weight 292.2 gr
Right bullet: 25 yards, impact velocity @2420fps, retained weight 268.3 gr
The first two bullets were placed behind the shoulder, the third @25 yards was through the near side shoulder and recovered against the broken far shoulder and even after destroying all of that bone the bullet held intact and only lost 31.7 grains.
Just thought you might find this interesting.
Cheers,
Cody

 

[Catahoula]

This is what impresses me so much with the aframe bullet. I recovered all three bullets out of a scemitar horned oryx.

Left bullet: 325 yards, impact velocity @1700fps, retained weight 298.7 gr
Middle bullet: 100 yards(+/-), impact velocity @2200fps, retained weight 292.2 gr
Right bullet: 25 yards, impact velocity @2420fps, retained weight 268.3 gr
The first two bullets were placed behind the shoulder, the third @25 yards was through the near side shoulder and recovered against the broken far shoulder and even after destroying all of that bone the bullet held intact and only lost 31.7 grains.
Just thought you might find this interesting.
Cheers,
Cody

Wow! You may have just sold me on the A Frame! I've seen the expansion photos on the Swift web site, but you never know the test conditions. Real world experience says it all.

 

[Ernie Shipman]

I forgot to add - bullet selection is vital! Swift A Frame, Nosler Partition, Norma, Barnes TSX... all good - along with proper placement.
Also - LISTEN to you PH! I have spent a ton of time in the woods since I was a kid (now 58) - but I was amazed at the knowledge of my 28 year old PH last time in Africa... These guys are well schooled!

 

[Ray B]

The Nosler Partition will generally peel the front section back and lose that core, but will continue forward as a "petalled" FMJ. the problem comes in if they get sideways or backwards; then they lose the rear core and things come to a halt. Looks like that may have been what happened to your bullets. the advantage of the Swift is that the front core is bonded, so generally stays in place, which also helps the bullet to remain point forward, which keeps the rear core in place.
That said, my favorite bullet is the discontinued Bitterroot Bonded Core, the design of which was used by Jack Carter when he designed the Trophy Bonded Bullet, which was used as the design for the North Fork Bullets. However, the bullet that comes closest to the old BBC is the Woodleigh Bonded Cores. They have a thick jacket that is tough enough to hold together, a lead core that allows expansion and since it's bonded, the entire package stays together regardless as to bullet attitude during penetration. All of the bonded bullets are excellent performers, the problem is to get one in 8mm and have it designed for the Magnum rather than the 8x57 mm.

 

[Bos Javanicus]

Swift A Frames are the go. I know what works and these do. Bloody pricey though, especially here in Australia. Barnes TSX are pretty damn good too.
The last buffalo I shot with my .338WM I was using 275gn A Frames, and I cut the projectile from the far shoulder just under the skin. When I weighed it, it came in at 269gn and a perfect mushroom.
Anything under .400 calibre I'll use A Frames and Barnes TSX everything over Ill use Woodleigh.
But it doesn't matter what you use if you don't put the bullet in the right place.

 

[Catahoula]

The Nosler Partition will generally peel the front section back and lose that core, but will continue forward as a "petalled" FMJ. the problem comes in if they get sideways or backwards; then they lose the rear core and things come to a halt. Looks like that may have been what happened to your bullets. the advantage of the Swift is that the front core is bonded, so generally stays in place, which also helps the bullet to remain point forward, which keeps the rear core in place.
That said, my favorite bullet is the discontinued Bitterroot Bonded Core, the design of which was used by Jack Carter when he designed the Trophy Bonded Bullet, which was used as the design for the North Fork Bullets. However, the bullet that comes closest to the old BBC is the Woodleigh Bonded Cores. They have a thick jacket that is tough enough to hold together, a lead core that allows expansion and since it's bonded, the entire package stays together regardless as to bullet attitude during penetration. All of the bonded bullets are excellent performers, the problem is to get one in 8mm and have it designed for the Magnum rather than the 8x57 mm.

Agreed. Velocity of the 8 mag is too high for bullets designed for the 8x57 mm. I had some dialogue with another member, and they have convinced me to take the 416 along. I'll plan on using that for giraffe. I'll load up some 220 grain A frames or Woodleighs for the 8mm Remington. That should handle anything else on the list and also work should I be carrying that when a giraffe presents itself. I'll let Pieter @Pawprint Safaris weigh in when I get there as well.

 

[matt85]

for an animal as big and tough as this, I would strongly recommend either the Swift or the Barnes. I love Woodleigh bullets but they are still capable of coming apart if they hit something hard at high speed. if you use a Woodleigh bullet then use the heaviest bullet available and it might even be a good idea to slow it down a little bit to reduce the chance of breakup.

edit: another option would be North Fork bullets. these have a lead nose with a solid copper core.

-matt

 

[DWB]

One of my mates and I shot two giraffes within a minute of each (2 needed to be culled)

He used his 308 and I used my 404 with a 400gr Rhino bullet.

Both headshots.

The 404 most definitely did it with a lot more authority!

These are big animals, and the message that it is dead takes a bit of time to get to the rest of the body.

If you use your 8mm, go with Swift A-Frames.

Woodleighs are great bullets, but they were not designed for the speeds you have in mind.

 

[Rick Cox]

I'm planning on hunting giraffe on my next trip to Africa. On my last trip (also my first trip) I took a .416 for buffalo and an 8mm Remington magnum for plains game. The next trip will be plains game only, and I'd like to stick to one rifle, the 8mm.

I used 200 grain partitions on the last trip and was pretty disappointed in their performance. I had several shots that lacked penetration and recovered bullets, after way to many shots in vital areas, showed complete jacket/core separation and fragmentation. The Woodleigh 416s that I used performed admirably.

On to my question. I've seen the 375 listed as a sensible giraffe rifle. I can load 250 grain Woodleigh softs in the 8mm to 2700 fps, which is right on the heels of 375 ballistics. Is this enough gun for giraffe? I could always take the 416, but as I said, I'd prefer to take one rifle and the 8mm magnum is becoming my favorite.

A bonded or mono metal bullet should be great. A Barnes TSX, Nosler Accubond, Swift A Frame etc.

 

[Catahoula]

A bonded or mono metal bullet should be great. A Barnes TSX, Nosler Accubond, Swift A Frame etc.

Thanks. As I said earlier in the thread, I've decided to use my 416 for giraffe. I'll use the A frames in the 8mm for everything else. That should suffice for giraffe if I happen to have an opportunity while carrying the 8mm.

 

[Daga Boy]

8mm Mag is fine for giraffe (Note that min cals are based on old cartridges so things lie 8mm mag , 338WM, etc never entered the equation).
I personally shoot just about everything with .338WM, just changing bullet weights and loads to suit the situation.
For heavy animals like giraffe its best to go with the heaviest bullet you rifle will shoot well.
Swift A frames are unbeatable on tough African game. Penetration is outstanding and I have neither heard of nor experienced any sort of failure with these bullets. (Giraffes are very big and very tough - think buffalo!). A monometal is a good way to go. Either way, use the heaviest bullet that shoots well in your rifle.
They are good on thin slAvoid Nosler partitions on thick skinned, heavily boned animals. The front section is soft and the bullet loses a lot of

 

[Daga Boy]

Sorry, finger trouble.
Noslers are good on thin skinned animals due to the explosive action of the front part., but not on thick skinned, heavily boned animals.
Try to avoid shooting giraffe in the body - they are frequently wounded in this way, and a wounded giraffe can run a long way - as in more than 20kms.
Best shots are top of neck (best done side on) and frontal head . For the frontal head shot its best to use a powerful calibre as the skull of a big giraffe is massive. With frontal head aim to take out the brain stem rather than the brain itself - i.e. place the shot slightly low. The reason is that the giraffes head will typically be at quite an elevation relative to the shooter and you don't want to risk a glancing head shot - which may only put the animal down temporarily. Conversely, a shot placed a bit low will take out the first vertebra. This type of shot will yield an instant kill.
For proper placement one should attempt to get as close as possible. In bushy country this will typically be around 50m and in any event less than 100m provided you don't chase the animals.