Explain this: 270 wins the poll

[Creigh]

I know this is probably for a different audience than this site, but he did specify he's looking for a favourite hunting round.

Now surprising thing is, the hated 243 is fifth on the list. My opinion is here in Africa we haven't a number of species that are in the sweet spot for the 243. Maybe Americans don't have the same, ergo a total dislike for 243 and 270. Or at least that's what I've been told. Not so fast…

 

[grand veneur]

Explain this: 270 wins the poll​

I don't quite understand what you mean by your topic. Our North American members will surely confirm, especially the older hunters, that the cartridge 270 Winchester has proven itself excellently on the continent. Some authors like Jack O'Connor have contributed a lot to this. The cartridge is not very popular in Europe because it competed with other cartridges, like the 7x64 Brenneke for example. There is no question that the cartridge 6.5 PRC would be a better alternative, but there are decades between the two concepts.

As for hunting in Africa, the game is so diverse that almost any cartridge can be used. You only have to consider that you might encounter something else much bigger and more dangerous, where it would be better to have something bigger than a rifle caliber 270 Winchester with you, but that is not just the case in Africa.

 

[odonata]

Spoiler Alert: If you plan on watching the 17-minute video & want to be surprised, don't look at the screenshot below.

I've always been fond of opinion-based comparisons (e.g. "Pick your favorite...", "What's your top 3...?", etc.) just because I'm curious what other hunters favor & why. I've enjoy Jim Harmer's videos before but because he lives in the open country of Idaho & I'm mostly hunting in the thickets of Arkansas & Mississippi, the content of his channel is often geared towards a different audience. And it shows in the cartridges chosen. With two Top-10 lists and 20 chances to have a match, I only managed to have one of my 11 cartridges appear in the viewer's list: The 30-06. The 270 Win clobbered the rest of the list with 20% of the vote. His comparison of it against the 6.5 PRC at the end of the video was interesting.

 

[Creigh]

Explain this: 270 wins the poll​

I don't quite understand what you mean by your topic. Our North American members will surely confirm, especially the older hunters, that the cartridge 270 Winchester has proven itself excellently on the continent. Some authors like Jack O'Connor have contributed a lot to this. The cartridge is not very popular in Europe because it competed with other cartridges, like the 7x64 Brenneke for example. There is no question that the cartridge 6.5 PRC would be a better alternative, but there are decades between the two concepts.

As for hunting in Africa, the game is so diverse that almost any cartridge can be used. You only have to consider that you might encounter something else much bigger and more dangerous, where it would be better to have something bigger than a rifle caliber 270 Winchester with you, but that is not just the case in Africa.

I've read on numerous occasions where people say the 270 is as useless as a 243. Too much recoil for the ordinance sent down range. Hence my surprise at the outcome.

 

[deewayne2003]

.270 too much recoil .....LOLOLOL

 

[pilar]

Lot of blah blah blah ! In those debates, basically the 270win , 6.5prc , .308 are all horses running a photo finish using equal weight projectiles 130-150 gr
.243 for Africa imo leave it at home, wrong size game .( though is a good NA game , deer ,pronghorn, mule deer caliber)
The equation starts going wonky when people start changing the dynamic when chopping off barrels to add cans , mucking around with heavy for caliber projectiles for higher B.C super long range hunting. Imo this usually doesn’t apply to Africa, 500+ meter shots aren’t really the norm?
30-06 & 300 magnum is the standard work horse with 180gr
All the others is just fun time debate on choice.

 

[Creigh]

.270 too much recoil .....LOLOLOL

For what it is. I kid you not, that is being said. I'm not saying I agree.

 

[mauser98]

When I say this, Its coming from a guy who grew up having a dislike of the 270 win in favor for the 6.5x55, 7x57, and 30-06. At this point in life, I can see it's merits without the emotions of older men trying to convince me otherwise.

The 270 win is about the most balanced cartridge for non DG hunting in North America.

Use 130,140,145gr for longer shots on deer sized game, 150-160gr for elk/moose and your set.
Its pretty much the American 7mm.

In saying that, I still have my personal favorites which include the the former ones mentioned. I also did buy a 270 win this year to hunt with it for its 100 year anniversary. A nice ZKK 600 in like new condition. Hope to fill a tag or two before going back to my favorites or others that need to get some use.

 

[rookhawk]

My beef with the 270 is that there isn't anything it does that a 6.5x55 or 7x57 doesn't do better. Heavier bullets, better BC, better SD, less recoil, generally prettier guns, etc.

You'd think Jack O'Connor would have known this, his wife Eleanor shot everything with a 7x57 and he should have too!

 

[buffybr]

I have a .270 that I won in our gun club "Top Gun Shoot" 30 some years ago. I brought it home, glass bedded the action and put a scope on it, then worked up a 5 shot moa load for it, and have never taken it hunting. With my .257 Ackley, .308 Win, 7mm RM, and .300 Wby, I just can't fit my .270 into the lineup, so it's just been a good, accurate "Safe Queen".

Several years ago, two of my friends went on a PG hunt in Namibia. One took his .270, the other his .338 Win. Both of their PHs scoffed at the .270 until at the end of each day, the .270 hunter's PH talked about the one shot kills his hunter made with his .270, while the .338 hunter needed 2 or more shots on each animal. By the end of the hunt, the PH of the .270 hunter said that he would now recommend future hunters use a .270.

Truth is that the .270 hunter was a much better shooter than the .338 hunter is, and bullet placement is more important than bullet diameter.

 

[RedTag]

.300 H&H Magnum does not appear on the list: results invalid.

 

[HuntingGold]

I saw the video a few nights ago and I too was surprised. Surprised as I hear nothing but bashing and bloviating on many platforms about the inadequacy of the .270. However, I've killed everything from jack rabbits to moose with the .270 AND properly chosen bullets. I've killed about 80% of my game with the .270.

Not surprising to me, my growing favorite is the 280 Ackley Improved.

One of about 20 elk killed with the .270

 

[Bill J H]

I can explain why "I" think it came out #1. But just to get the data straight: The 270Win was not picked by the majority - no cartridges on the list were - it was picked by the largest plurality where around 20% of the folks say it is their favorite. So...this means that for about 80%, the majority, it was not their favorite.

We have to remember it was a Favorite pick not "the best for a specific purpose" pick, although, both can be true.

I can see it coming out on top for several reasons: 1. It is adequate to more than adequate for the majority of hunting the voters do. 2. It has been around and getting the job done for over a century. 3. A lot of the voters likely grew up with a 270 in their household (dad, uncle, grandpa, cousin, friends) and got one themselves - ands liked it. 4. The majority of the voters are likely avid deer hunters, who take the occasional elk or other larger game, and it has always worked. 5. It has relatively low recoil when compared to guns flinging heavier projectiles - faster. 6. They read a lot of O'Conner and enjoyed the romance in his prose regarding the 270. 7. They prefer not to have a magnum. 8. They prefer not to have a short action. And this list can go on and on.

But most of what I said above could be used to justify picking many of the other cartridges, just substitute the names and tweak the verbiage.

My absolute favorite daily driver here in the TX brush country is a 1995 Jeep YJ 5 speed with only a canvas shade most of the summer - a cab in the winter. Its not even the best Jeep I have - my Gladiator is. However, it can get everything I need done and it is my absolute favorite to drive around here.

I have a couple of 270s mixed in my pile of guns. One is my old Sako, with whom I have a great deal of history with and love, while the other is a recently purchased Ruger African that I have no history and love for, but I really enjoy tinkering with. Both are VERY good shooters.

I was fortunate enough to retire "relatively" young from the military and other than when it is super hot as it is now, I take a long gun to the field 2-3 times a week. I might just spend a few hour walking and stalking or sniping a stray rock across a mesquite flat or plinking one of several steel targets I have placed here and there. My favorite guns for this are relatively compact 20-22" barreled rifles, that are not heavy, and I usually run a short, ultralight can. I also hunt with these exact same guns. Last year I went through a little over 700 rounds hunting and doing my walks. I'd say 75% the time I have one of my 308s, the other 25% is a mixture of '06, 270, 243, 45-70, 44Mag carbine.

For normal killing, at traditional ranges, on NA game (deer, antelope, elk), I find there isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the 308, 270, and '06. My first Africa hunt was last year. The 308 took a zebra, a blesbuck, and an impala - all DRT. The '06 took a kudu, wildebeest, zebra, a waterbuck, and 2 impala - all DRT. My '06 and 308 both were shooting the same weight bullets, with the difference of about 100fps and my shots were 225yds and in. No animal can tell the difference. I firmly believe if I'd taken my 270 with my hot loaded 150gr A-Frames, it would have killed with the same authority.

My personal favorite for 99% of what I do - Ruger Hawkeye Hunter .308 Win, 20"barrel, ultralight can, 1-6 LPVO, 165gr bullets running 2700-2750 - I adjust the bullet (A-Frame, Sierra SBT) based on what I'm doing. But....I'm happy with any of the others.

 

[pilar]

I have a .270 that I won in our gun club "Top Gun Shoot" 30 some years ago. I brought it home, glass bedded the action and put a scope on it, then worked up a 5 shot moa load for it, and have never taken it hunting. With my .257 Ackley, .308 Win, 7mm RM, and .300 Wby, I just can't fit my .270 into the lineup, so it's just been a good, accurate "Safe Queen".

Several years ago, two of my friends went on a PG hunt in Namibia. One took his .270, the other his .338 Win. Both of their PHs scoffed at the .270 until at the end of each day, the .270 hunter's PH talked about the one shot kills his hunter made with his .270, while the .338 hunter needed 2 or more shots on each animal. By the end of the hunt, the PH of the .270 hunter said that he would now recommend future hunters use a .270.

Truth is that the .270 hunter was a much better shooter than the .338 hunter is, and bullet placement is more important than bullet diameter.

My friends wife Margie shoots a 270 with 140gr TSX , when she was in Zimbabwe
The PH crew hounded them to leave it there as a camp gun , every time she pulled the trigger a impala, kudu , warthog, nyala , died, only exception was a zebra which she clean missed
She was the leopard bait lady for the camp , and the .270 worked fine .
Luckily chads dad worried about breaking some laws selling the rifle and she is still wacking stuff with it.

Mind you I love the old school stuff with beautiful wood in 6.5x55 , 7x57 , 9.3x62
And would love to add them to my pre64 M70 collection
It’s hard not to just buy an sig 100 in those calibrations when I have my .270 in m70

 

[thriller]

I know this is probably for a different audience than this site, but he did specify he's looking for a favourite hunting round.

Now surprising thing is, the hated 243 is fifth on the list. My opinion is here in Africa we haven't a number of species that are in the sweet spot for the 243. Maybe Americans don't have the same, ergo a total dislike for 243 and 270. Or at least that's what I've been told. Not so fast…

I can explain this!!! Backfire has an intense aversion to recoil and an intense attraction to stats and not in field performance so therefore this is what you get from his audience.

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

I can explain why "I" think it came out #1. But just to get the data straight: The 270Win was not picked by the majority - no cartridges on the list were - it was picked by the largest plurality where around 20% of the folks say it is their favorite. So...this means that for about 80%, the majority, it was not their favorite.

We have to remember it was a Favorite pick not "the best for a specific purpose" pick, although, both can be true.

I can see it coming out on top for several reasons: 1. It is adequate to more than adequate for the majority of hunting the voters do. 2. It has been around and getting the job done for over a century. 3. A lot of the voters likely grew up with a 270 in their household (dad, uncle, grandpa, cousin, friends) and got one themselves - ands liked it. 4. The majority of the voters are likely avid deer hunters, who take the occasional elk or other larger game, and it has always worked. 5. It has relatively low recoil when compared to guns flinging heavier projectiles - faster. 6. They read a lot of O'Conner and enjoyed the romance in his prose regarding the 270. 7. They prefer not to have a magnum. 8. They prefer not to have a short action. And this list can go on and on.

But most of what I said above could be used to justify picking many of the other cartridges, just substitute the names and tweak the verbiage.

My absolute favorite daily driver here in the TX brush country is a 1995 Jeep YJ 5 speed with only a canvas shade most of the summer - a cab in the winter. Its not even the best Jeep I have - my Gladiator is. However, it can get everything I need done and it is my absolute favorite to drive around here.

I have a couple of 270s mixed in my pile of guns. One is my old Sako, with whom I have a great deal of history with and love, while the other is a recently purchased Ruger African that I have no history and love for, but I really enjoy tinkering with. Both are VERY good shooters.

I was fortunate enough to retire "relatively" young from the military and other than when it is super hot as it is now, I take a long gun to the field 2-3 times a week. I might just spend a few hour walking and stalking or sniping a stray rock across a mesquite flat or plinking one of several steel targets I have placed here and there. My favorite guns for this are relatively compact 20-22" barreled rifles, that are not heavy, and I usually run a short, ultralight can. I also hunt with these exact same guns. Last year I went through a little over 700 rounds hunting and doing my walks. I'd say 75% the time I have one of my 308s, the other 25% is a mixture of '06, 270, 243, 45-70, 44Mag carbine.

For normal killing, at traditional ranges, on NA game (deer, antelope, elk), I find there isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the 308, 270, and '06. My first Africa hunt was last year. The 308 took a zebra, a blesbuck, and an impala - all DRT. The '06 took a kudu, wildebeest, zebra, a waterbuck, and 2 impala - all DRT. My '06 and 308 both were shooting the same weight bullets, with the difference of about 100fps and my shots were 225yds and in. No animal can tell the difference. I firmly believe if I'd taken my 270 with my hot loaded 150gr A-Frames, it would have killed with the same authority.

My personal favorite for 99% of what I do - Ruger Hawkeye Hunter .308 Win, 20"barrel, ultralight can, 1-6 LPVO, 165gr bullets running 2700-2750 - I adjust the bullet (A-Frame, Sierra SBT) based on what I'm doing. But....I'm happy with any of the others.

I think you hit the nail on the head. The class of cartridges to which the most popular and most effective generally belong to just doesn’t have that much difference between them. They’re popular because they’re effective and they’re effective because they’re similar to one another.

The minute theoretical differences between similar cartridges don’t have anywhere near as much of impact as other considerations such as availability of ammunition and rifles or perception, familiarity, or marketing. At least, for the vast majority of hunters.

 

[Bill J H]

If one looks at his and his audience’s list there are PLENTY of kickers in the Top 8 if one desires recoil.
I’m not averse to necessary recoil, but I don’t seek unnecessary recoil.
Although not my personal favorite, the Ol 270, based on its proven performance over the last 100 years, doesn’t need to bow its head to any cartridge. Thus I’m not surprised 20%, a plurality of his audience, picked it.

 

[One Day...]

My beef with the 270 is that there isn't anything it does that a 6.5x55 or 7x57 doesn't do better. Heavier bullets, better BC, better SD, less recoil, generally prettier guns, etc.

You'd think Jack O'Connor would have known this, his wife Eleanor shot everything with a 7x57 and he should have too!

I think that the answer to this one is simple: trajectory!
(while delivering medium game killing power)

At a time when laser range finders or even practicable optical coincidence range finders, and reliable external BDC (bullet drop compensator) turrets did not exist -- outside the military -- I believe that the .270 Win offered something rather unique: the ability to deliver medium game killing power out to 330 yards using the redoubtably simple maximum point-blank range (MPBR) method with a 3 inches high zero at 100 yards.

I do not know about your experience, but in mine, which was 100% mountain hunting in the French Alps, this was huge. I rather suspect that this is what attracted Jack O'Connor to it.

Of course, modern opinion polls are bound to reflect the latest fashionable fad of the day, so I fully expect the various Creedmoor, PRC, ARC, SAUM, etc. to figure prominently, but the .270 Win also beat them in another dimension: the test of time. It is my belief that the .270 Win will still be commercially loaded long after the various Creedmoor, PRC, ARC, SAUM, etc. fade into obscurity...

A nearly perfect balance of power, trajectory, recoil, universal usability, and simplicity

As to Africa, 40 years after selecting the .270 Win as a self-evident choice for my first, long and hard earned hunting rifle, I had to come again to the conclusion, after visiting many, many other options, that the .270 Win remains the near ideal caliber choice for my wife's PG rifle, with an additional edge thanks to modern bullet technologies, that where I had to move from 130 gr to 150 gr (both Nosler Partition) when going from Chamois (mountain goat) to Red Stag (elk), she does it all with the 130 gr TTSX, from Impala to Black Wildebeest. The .270 Win has the killing power, the flat trajectory, the low recoil, the quasi universal usability on PG and MG (mountain game) to make things simple and predictable.

As it did for me in the Alps, the .270 Win allows my wife to simply put the crosshair on it, from 0 to 300, and just pull the trigger. To someone not versed into technicalities, this is huge.

And thanks to modern bullet technology, she does not even need to change load and resight between light and heavy PG.

Certainly, the various Creedmoor, PRC, ARC, SAUM, etc. can do the same, although they are rarely used with the MPBR method, but good luck finding ammo for them now in Africa or at the country gun store... and better luck finding ammo for them at all in 5 or 10 years...

 

[mauser98]

I think that the answer to this one is simple: trajectory!
(while delivering medium game killing power)

At a time when laser range finders or even practicable optical coincidence range finders, and reliable external BDC (bullet drop compensator) turrets did not exist -- outside the military -- I believe that the .270 Win offered something rather unique: the ability to deliver medium game killing power out to 330 yards using the redoubtably simple maximum point-blank range (MPBR) method with a 3 inches high zero at 100 yards.

I do not know about your experience, but in mine, which was 100% mountain hunting in the French Alps, this was huge. I rather suspect that this is what attracted Jack O'Connor to it.

Of course, modern opinion polls are bound to reflect the latest fashionable fad of the day, so I fully expect the various Creedmoor, PRC, ARC, SAUM, etc. to figure prominently, but the .270 Win also beat them in another dimension: the test of time. It is my belief that the .270 Win will still be commercially loaded long after the various Creedmoor, PRC, ARC, SAUM, etc. fade into obscurity...

As to Africa, 40 years after selecting the .270 Win as a self-evident choice for my first, long and hard earned hunting rifle, I had to come again to the conclusion, after visiting many, many other options, that the .270 Win remains the near ideal caliber choice for my wife's PG rifle, with an additional edge thanks to modern bullet technologies, that where I had to move from 130 gr to 150 gr (both Nosler Partition) when going from Chamois (mountain goat) to Red Stag (elk), she does it all with the 130 gr TTSX, from Impala to Black Wildebeest.

As it did for me in the Alps, the .270 Win allows my wife to simply put the crosshair on it, from 0 to 300, and just pull the trigger. To someone not versed into technicalities, this is huge.

And thanks to modern bullet technology, she does not even need to change load and resight between light and heavy PG.

Certainly, the various Creedmoor, PRC, ARC, SAUM, etc. can do the same, although they are rarely used with the MPBR method, but good luck finding ammo for them now in Africa or at the country gun store... and better luck finding ammo for them at all in 5 or 10 years...

Well said! Another thing it also has going over the 6.5x55 and 7x57 is properly loaded factory ammo with a lot of options in bullet types that the other two don't have. Show me a box of factory ammo in 6.5x55 or 7x57 that you can find on the shelf that is pushing a 130-140gr bullet at 3050+ or a 150 at 2900+fps. Having the ability to buy something like that over the counter that gives that versatility is nice when reloading isn't an option or out of reach. That extra velocity does come in hand for MPBR or shots pushing 400-500 yards.

Average 6.5x55/7x57 factory loads are around 2500-2700 fps for a 140gr, 160 at around 2450 fps. I understand one can reload to get more out of these cartridge's but what I made mention is another point towards the 270 in my books.

 

[MontanaGrant]

I can see it. Ammo so everywhere, the guns are cheap, it is powerful enough yet low recoil enough to be effective.

I’m not decrying the 6.5x55, 7x57 etc but they’re not super common, available at every store.

I’m also not bashing the 6.5 PRC or creedmoor, but whatever they do the .270 does just as well.

.300 is a bit more effective power wise, but a lot of shooters (the average AH member probably doesn’t apply here) don’t shoot much more than an AR and accuracy and competency drops drastically.