Double Rifle Practice

[freefall]

Disaster waiting to happen . .

See post #11.

 

[Spooksar]

Is it common practice to use two fingers on triggers?

No what happens is the trigger finger slips off because of recoil. I had a PH try my Double rifle and it happened to him. If you don’t use enough finger on the front trigger it will slip, by using the back trigger first this helps the problem, especially when your adrenaline is high.

 

[IvW]

No what happens is the trigger finger slips off because of recoil. I had a PH try my Double rifle and it happened to him. If you don’t use enough finger on the front trigger it will slip, by using the back trigger first this helps the problem, especially when your adrenaline is high.

If this happens the shooter does not have enough experience with a double, it is a cheap double or the rifle does not fit the shooter especially in the pistol grip area.....

I would love hear from any double trigger competive shot gun shooters that use the back trigger first and then the front trigger.....

 

[Ray B]

I would love hear from any double trigger competive shot gun shooters that use the back trigger first and then the front trigger.....

I have little experience with double rifles and while I don't shoot "competitively" I do shoot a lot of "for fun" 5 position and trap. I'll use mostly 16 ga guns for 5 position. the ones I shoot that have double triggers are light-weight Parkers and for trap a 12 Merkel 201E. depending on the situation sometimes I use the rear trigger first, other times the front trigger first. granted, these are not heavy goose loads, but I have never had a problem with contacting the other trigger in either direction, under recoil. Nor do I find any difficulty transitioning from a gun with SS trigger to double or back. The shooting of a double rifle has been limited to reduced loads and when I graduate to full power loads I may experience a problem, but so far trigger management has not been a problem.

 

[IvW]

That is part of the reason a double has two triggers...in shotgun you can switch depending on which choke is more suitable to the situation....
Same with a double rifle depending on what you are hunting....you may have soft in the right barrel and solid in the left...double triggers give the the instant switch option...
However having two softs loaded and starting with the rear trigger is not normal......

 

[IvW]

Have you considered using a thin short fingered glove on your left hand so you can hold two cartridges?. I was thinking of adapting a black golf glove. Smithy wears a glove in some video takes and seems to leave them off in the next one, which suggests to me there's a fair bit of editing going on.

Gloves with double rifles stem from times when the barrel gets too hot after multiple shots..normally worn on the hand that holds the fore end...not needed by a visiting hunter....unless it is real cold out....

Ill fitting thick gloves are a bigger problem than bare hands....

Reminder that Smithy hunts for TV show so bling and looking the part is important.....same as him taking a arse shot on a buffalo due to pressure to get footage....

Do not believe everything you see or hear especially on TV shows....

 

[IvW]

I am also getting ready for hunt in September with my double rifle. The advice I got from a long time double rifle user was to practice using rear trigger first then front trigger. He said the is no chance of pulling both triggers at the same time with this combination. Said he had seen many times hunters pull both triggers due to recoil, sweat or nerves

I bet he did not back up much on DG with that advice...

 

[IvW]

See post #11.

That advice is from somebody who cannot master the art of shooting a double rifle....irrespective of how many times he has used it....

 

[One Day...]

Well, how to say this politely, but not every "advice" provided on the internet comes from people who actually have experience with what they are discussing or advising...

On the other hand, there are some really good advices on AH coming from folks who actually have considerable first hand experience...

Just tilt the rifle after opening they drop out, it is a 500/416 NE nicely tapered not straight walled.

It absolutely works, even with straighter cases (e.g. 500 NE). A quick flick from the wrists, which needs to be practiced but which is easy to master, will also insure the empties not only drop out but fly off.

When u can hit a flying baseball with a dr. Forget about hunting, enter the olympics. Haha

Amen! Not much more to add, but to be clear, a brain shot at elephant is taken on a still or slow walking animal, and if you need a quick shot it is likely to be a body shot at the lungs area or at the hip joint. Do not waste your ammo, demoralize yourself, or acquire bad rifle handling habits by trying to shoot skeet with a DG double rifle...

I purchased a 15 pound rubber coated steel exercise bar and cut it down to the length of my Krieghoff. Added sling swivels at the appropriate places and attached a sling. I hike for miles and get a few odd looks

Yes indeed! A 12 lbs. dumbbell weight works well too.

... A good shot can only be made with a proper grip on your rifle. Holding two shells and trying to properly grip and control the firearm under recoil may take your focus from your shooting to trying to retain control if the shells I have tried several methods if reloading my Kgun: from ammo belt, two shells between the fingers, from a stock shell holder and from elastic wrist straps with the shells perpendicular to my forearm and also parallel my forearm. I find the best for me is the wrist strap with shells pointing toward my fingers and the shells under my wrist. I practice by dryfire, then muzzle up while breaking the action to drop the casing, then muzzle down, pull two shells and reload. Any method you chose is good if you practice. This just works for me.

Amen again! Too many folks simply copy what they have seen on videos or read on blogs... Not to mention that it is actually not that easy to reload fast from two shells held between fingers in the left hand. Most people would be much faster from the belt...

... my own experience with double barrel shotguns with two triggers made the transition from shotgun to rifle very easy. So many people who never used a double gun have trouble with two triggers, or reloading quickly and efficiently. A few hundred or thousand rounds with a shotgun builds muscle memory that helps a lot. And 12 ga target loads costs a small fraction of the cost of rifle cartridges.

Absolutely! I will add that shooting slugs from a 12 gauge will also give you a cheap way to practice aiming and hitting a 6" paper dessert plate at 50 yards.

I disagree with those who say to fire rear trigger first to avoid "doubling". If you are strumming both triggers when you shoot, you are doing something drastically wrong with your grip and trigger finger. A firm grip and good trigger finger position will eliminate any such doubling problems ... In any case never, ever, put two fingers on the two triggers.

Disaster waiting to happen . .

Could not say it better!

That is part of the reason a double has two triggers ... you may have soft in the right barrel and solid in the left...double triggers give the the instant switch option...
However having two softs loaded and starting with the rear trigger is not normal......

Unless a conscious choice is made to shoot a specific bullet first (solid or soft), any "advice" about using rear trigger first or (Horror!) using two fingers, or other such nonsense is missing the point that rifle is mishandled to begin with. THAT is what needs to be fixed

Gloves with double rifles stem from times when the barrel gets to hot after multiple shots..normally worn on the hand that holds the fore end...not needed by a visiting hunter....unless it is real cold out....

Ill fiting thick gloves are a bigger problem than bare hands....

Reminder that Smithy hunts for TV show so bling and looking the part is important.....same as him taking a arse shot on a buffalo due to pressure to get footage....

Do not believe everything you see or hear especially on TV shows....

Again, could not say it better!

In summary, forget gloves, cartridges between fingers and other cool looking (?) as-seen-on-TV stuff or zebra band hat; forget triggers gymnastics etc.; beware internet well-intended advices etc. Have the rifle fit you, hold it firmly, focus on hitting with the first shot, and practice the effective and efficient reload that works for you best

You are on the right track here

I think I’m just going to reload from my ammo belt. I have many years experience reloading break action shotgun with my right hand. I think if I combine this with unloading with gravity, that I can be back on target just as fast as reloading with my left hand.

 

[IvW]

Buying a double rifle comes with its own set of requirements.
Proper fit of a double rifle is more important on a double than a bolt....
Ince that has been achieved a lot more practice is needed to become competent with it...
Reloading being one of the points to practice until it becomes second nature...lot morebfiring and reliading required than with a bolt.
One shot inly fired depending on situation reload first barrel...
Both shots fired reload both...
Ejectors vs extractors also different ball game.
So whatever you do if you get a double practice practice practice, yip ammo is expensive but your life is worth it...practice makes perfect.

The most stunning and expensive double means nothing if you cannot use it properly....rather get a bolt if you do not want to invest in the time and mioney it takes to become competent with it

 

[Spooksar]

If this happens the shooter does not have enough experience with a double, it is a cheap double or the rifle does not fit the shooter especially in the pistol grip area.....

I would love hear from any double trigger competive shot gun shooters that use the back trigger first and then the front trigger.....

I tend to agree with you I’ve always used the front trigger first, in 15 and hundreds of rounds never had a double firing.practice, practice, practice

 

[festuscat]

I’ve used a double rifle for quite a few years, and I’ll give you my 2 cents:
i shoot Olympic Trap, so I have to shoot quickl with a single trigger. 2-3 weeks prior to Africa, I will shoot a double SxS shotgun if I shoot clays. I e as charged in 2001 and pulled the first trigger twice. Got lucky there.Tracker tossed- a major cock up on my part.

i pull the front trigger first. I’ve never doubled, and the following-up shot is very quick. I’d try both.

Slow is smooth and smooth is fast- practice shooting w/o sticks and reload while keeping your eyes on the target. And as someone mentioned- reload immediately & practice w/ the safety.I shoot a 500NE - recoil is no issue and it looks like you handle your Krieghoff very well.

As you practice, while keeping your eyes on the target, come on the target with the front sight out of focus- as you acquire the target with the front sight, pull the trigger.
it will give you confidence on a moving tgt- esp DG.

I also reload w/ 5744 for reduced loads for more trigger time. When huntping DG, I want a more dynamic gun ( I don’t know how else to explain it otherwise) rather than how I shoot a scoped rifle.

Apologies for the long response; I believe Trader Keith sells culling belts that may work for you.

Have a great hunt.

 

[Cervus elaphus]

Gloves with double rifles stem from times when the barrel gets too hot after multiple shots..normally worn on the hand that holds the fore end...not needed by a visiting hunter....unless it is real cold out....

Ill fitting thick gloves are a bigger problem than bare hands....

Reminder that Smithy hunts for TV show so bling and looking the part is important.....same as him taking a arse shot on a buffalo due to pressure to get footage....

Do not believe everything you see or hear especially on TV shows....

Gloves with double rifles stem from times when the barrel gets too hot after multiple shots..normally worn on the hand that holds the fore end...not needed by a visiting hunter....unless it is real cold out....

Ill fitting thick gloves are a bigger problem than bare hands....

Reminder that Smithy hunts for TV show so bling and looking the part is important.....same as him taking a arse shot on a buffalo due to pressure to get footage....

Do not believe everything you see or hear especially on TV shows....

I'm aware of the editing that goes on so I watch for the entertainment value. Have we come to a conclusion on whether the Texas heart shot was the first or followup?

 

[Tanks]

I think I’m just going to reload from my ammo belt. I have many years experience reloading break action shotgun with my right hand. I think if I combine this with unloading with gravity, that I can be back on target just as fast as reloading with my left hand.

I actually tried the mechanics of it. I got into shotguns last May due to advice by @Red Leg and decided I also liked Sporting Clays. To date I have fired over 15K shells. Trying to load with the hand holding the forend and also tilting the gun opposite way of the way I have been doing it would be a disaster waiting to happen due to muscle memory I have built up.

Not to mention anything more than two shots at an elephant has been an insurance shot after the animal has been down. Two max has done the job as shown as the pic below.

 

[jdemocko]

No what happens is the trigger finger slips off because of recoil. I had a PH try my Double rifle and it happened to him. If you don’t use enough finger on the front trigger it will slip, by using the back trigger first this helps the problem, especially when your adrenaline is high.

A few years ago I was hunting Buffalo and had my rifle double while pulling the back trigger first. I always shoot first trigger but there are exceptions, especially hunting Buffalo, where you can get away with a soft and solid combination. Here is the scenario, I shoot left handed and had a CEB 475gn raptor in the left barrel and a 510 CEB solid in the right barrel (back trigger). We tracked this old bull for a while and just before dark we came upon him but he was waiting. We rounded a bush and he was facing us at 40 yards. My PH wispered hit him with the solid. So I slid my finger from the from the front trigger to the back trigger and squeezed. Holy shit, I wasn't ready for that recoil but tried to follow up with the front trigger and there was nothing there. By the time I figured out what happened the bull was out of sight. Luckily, one of the bullets hit vitals and slowed him down enough to finish him off. That was a brand new Heym 500 NE. Not a crappy rifle by any means (in Heym's defense, that rifle did not fit me particularly well in the grip area). That was the first time that rifle doubled and I can't for the life of me figure out why. Never did it again after a 100 or so rounds shooting. I guess the moral of the story is there are no guarantees. My son captured the shot on video I just can't seem to find a way to attach it here.

 

[Daniel Cary]

Just do what this kid does, with cheesy music ...

 

[Frank Cavallo]

Yikes.

1. Shoot offhand. Get comfortable shooting offhand. More likely than not you won't be using sticks on an ele.
2. Your rifle doesn't have ejectors don't even think about that two shells in your hand nonsense.
3. Reloading speed is not important. Getting two shells chambered (and for you extracting spent shells) properly is more important than fumbling around turning quickly into slowly.
4. Your PH will be looking at the animal (after his two+ anchoring shots). Relax. Just get your rifle reloaded (see #3). You will not be getting off two more shots if he runs away.
5. You don't need a culling belt. All you need is a 5 cartridge slider.
6. Shoot the rifle how it was designed- front then rear triggers. You will only have solids for ele. Even with buffalo a lot of PHs prefer tissue damage with an A frame as a second shot, not a solid.
7. Shoot offhand.
8. See #3.

 

[sureshot375]

Picked up a 15lb weighted exercise bar as a substitute rifle for training purposes. Stoped by a state park while traveling today and hiked 4 miles. I looked hard, but didn’t see any elephant spore.

 

[One Day...]

This is great! Congratulations on shooting and walking. I wish more clients would do so

FYI, here is what I advise Huntershill clients to do in the Welcome to Huntershill booklet I wrote for them. Hopefully there will be value somewhere for you in this

 

[sureshot375]

This is great! Congratulations on shooting and walking. I wish more clients would do so

FYI, here is what I advise Huntershill clients to do in the Welcome to Huntershill booklet I wrote for them. Hopefully there will be value somewhere for you in this

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Solid advice all around!!!