Did I do well?

[CoElkHunter]

Oscar is probably right; I'd sit down and do a cost comparison though - price out what you expect to spend with this outfitter versus what the same animals and costs would be with someone else? And it seems to me that a number of sponsors on here have very similar price structures, within same areas or countries.

An example, on the subject of prices, I paid less for my cow buff than your list shows for kudu, and I paid $1200 for my kudu. With your list, my daughter and I would likely be shooting a lot less when we head over in June. Just my two cents, and I could be wrong.

View attachment 525868

Nice Kudu!

 

[ActionBob]

The list was sent to me. It was not readily available off the website.

Typical. Common practice of the auction hunt marketers from RSA.

My honest take on first glance is that list is roughly double the prices you could get if you watched the deals on here. Including the day fees However there are some opportunities in there.

You got a great deal on the Nyala. Your buddy will be paying though. I would take a tsessabe each. If you are interested in those color variants, they are expensive but more specialized and something, like tsessabe, that you will likely be only hunting on a high fenced property.

I've never taken a Nyala primarily because every one I was offered in RSA was standing there looking at me similar to the sable, in a special pen within the pen. I kinda lost my taste and then saw a couple 34" us class Nyala in the wild (but on the wrong side of the river) and decided I'll wait to take a wild one some.

I disagree on the sable as if you watch the deals, you can find sable and Roan both for the price of just this sable. However it depends what makes you happy.

I do see a major problem with all the days you have and that expensive price list. Nyala is a half day hunt, tsessabe, probably the same. Try to milk them out and make it at least a full day each. In 9 days of hard hunting in that environments you can expect to take 1.5 to 3 animals per day. So this could get very expensive which is what your outfitter is hoping. Sorry to throw sour grapes but that's how I see it.

 

[jhendricks]

Typical. Common practice of the auction hunt marketers from RSA.

My honest take on first glance is that list is roughly double the prices you could get if you watched the deals on here. Including the day fees However there are some opportunities in there.

You got a great deal on the Nyala. Your buddy will be paying though. I would take a tsessabe each. If you are interested in those color variants, they are expensive but more specialized and something, like tsessabe, that you will likely be only hunting on a high fenced property.

I've never taken a Nyala primarily because every one I was offered in RSA was standing there looking at me similar to the sable, in a special pen within the pen. I kinda lost my taste and then saw a couple 34" us class Nyala in the wild (but on the wrong side of the river) and decided I'll wait to take a wild one some.

I disagree on the sable as if you watch the deals, you can find sable and Roan both for the price of just this sable. However it depends what makes you happy.

I do see a major problem with all the days you have and that expensive price list. Nyala is a half day hunt, tsessabe, probably the same. Try to milk them out and make it at least a full day each. In 9 days of hard hunting in that environments you can expect to take 1.5 to 3 animals per day. So this could get very expensive which is what your outfitter is hoping. Sorry to throw sour grapes but that's how I see it.

Thanks, I value your write up. I definitely dont care to shoot anything in a pen. If the concession is large, I have no problem with that in RSA. The reviews I have gotten from members have noted that they are fairly large properties.

 

[JimP]

Also remember, you should be able to head home any time that you want. It's just getting your flights changed.

This is where a agent like Travel Express would come in handy

 

[jhendricks]

Also remember, you should be able to head home any time that you want. It's just getting your flights changed.

This is where a agent like Travel Express would come in handy

Very true, with that said They are long and costly flights to not spend as much time as possible!

 

[BOSS SAFARIS]

Going off your initial message, I would say you kinda have to weigh up the "steal" you got on auction and its actual value, consider what you intend to hunt, and figure out at what price point you no longer have the price advantage.

I have strong feelings about auctioned hunts and their accompanying pricelists, its doing more damage to the industry than any good, but to each their own.

Our prices are pretty average. Feel free to compare:

PRICING – Boss Safaris

bosssafaris.com

 

[ActionBob]

Very true, with that said They are long and costly flights to not spend as much time as possible!

You make a very valid counterpoint. However you could do other things. RSA has a huge tourist market beyond hunting. Many truly wonderful National Parks, the whole Garden Route, Indian Ocean frontage, etc.

 

[Bush Buck]

This is obviously a personal decision but I would let this auction fee go as a donation and plan a hunt that made me more comfortable and excited.

 

[MarkB]

Your TF prices are high and raise concerns for me. Red flag... Do you have every other hunt detail with amounts and in writing? There are many outfits/hunts with NO daily rate as long as you shoot said number of animals, those have TF 1/3 to 1/2 your listed TF costs. I have no real loyalty or respect for an outfitter who's business plan is to donate hunt and then screw over hunter for super high TF like what you seam to have got. All knowing there are 2 hunters and only 1 animal included. I call that a SCAM. Yes buyer beware, but those type of outfits are fully aware of bidding mind block, in the moment "mistakes". Especially for first time safari goers.

As others have stated, I would be honest with your outfitter, tell him his listed TF are a no go/show stopper and see what he comes back with. Then decide. If he sticks to his prices, then a decision is in order. I would RUN, I cannot restrain my trigger finger that long when shooters are around, or want the stress when he constantly wants you to shoot.

If you have super strong, steel, unwavering will and can refrain from shooting anything other than your nyala for said price then go. Not sure about your companion? But stress on hunt in that situation sucks and makes hunt not what safari is.

I would get your budget totals, then watch deals and offers closely. You can get daily rates and TF included for your budget amount and have an awesome hunt with many sponsors on this site. Your WON hunt fees are not wasted, $400 each in your savings of TF alone will be put to good use with better TF pricing from another outfit, this equals a better safari and lifetime memories.

MB

 

[ActionBob]

I will confess I have walked away from a $1500 similar deal but to Spain. By the time that crook was done it would have cost $25,000.

I just let SCI have the $1500. I do wonder if this situation happens a lot and if SCI counts on it... at least some of the less scrupulous local ones. This is one reason I will not attend the Minnesota SCI down the Twin Cities but will go to others around the region

 

[MarkB]

I know its 2023 and buyer beware, woke and codling are now "normal" but one would think there would/could/should be some vetting, mentoring or assistance at the world renown shows? Both by fellow hunters, show assistants or even other outfitters? This subject seams to be something posted and read about many times. Maybe just lack of asking or communication adds to issue? Somewhat sad.

MB

 

[Mark Biggerstaff]

I almost got into one of these at local banquet last year. Until I asked them if there was any additional info other that what was listed in auction program.
He went and got me the packet and after seeing price list and add on's for camp transfer and such. I passed on even bidding. It sold for less than $1500 and was for 2 ppl 2on1 for 7 days and included 3 animals each. But trophy prices listed on additional paperwork were double what I have paid on most trips. And $400 each way on airport pickup and drop off. Also a list of tipping fees was in packet.
Definite red flag. Wont name outfitter but they have been mentioned on AH a few times.

 

[JimP]

The big problem is that most go into these banquets without the slightest idea that they are going to bid on a African Safari Package, and when they win it they have no idea on how to get started. They have never even considered traveling that far to hunt much less thought about what animals they would like to shoot. I would also say that 90% of those who purchase these items and go on their hunt have no idea of what bargains are to be had with other outfitters. Or even the outfit that they will be hunting with, only if they would of booked the hunt themselves taking advantage of multi animal packages.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

I know I sound like a shill for this site, but coming on here, learning about the process, putting out there what you hope for, and then researching/vetting potential places to go seems like SUCH a good plan, especially for someone planning for Africa for the first time, IMHO.

 

[MarkB]

I know I sound like a shill for this site, but coming on here, learning about the process, putting out there what you hope for, and then researching/vetting potential places to go seems like SUCH a good plan, especially for someone planning for Africa for the first time, IMHO.

An absolutely bad in every way hunt is the reason I joined this site. A freelance PH at the time (Wayne @NYAMAZANA SAFARIS) pulled a rabbit out of his hat, saved, turned around and gave me an ele and PG hunt for the ages, one of the best lifetime memories I have. Along with a few PG animals.

My only regret=Showing way to much restraint and not crushing/exterminating the US agent when Wayne gave me alone time in his Bulawayo living room.

After I returned home someone contacted me from this site for a reference. Many years and safaris later I am still grateful, both to Wayne and now AH.com.

MB

 

[BOSS SAFARIS]

So I gotta kinda step in here and give you guys both viewpoints and why I said I hate auctioned hunts in a previous comment and that it is destroying the industry.

On one hand, you get the outfitter - In most cases SCI (International convention) requires either a hunt donation or a monetary donation, in addition to $3000 per 10x10 booth. Personally, I just pay the money, and here is why... At the show, there are hundreds of African Outfitters, and obviously with that comes hundreds of donations. The problem with so many donations is that the hunts always go for nothing... This isn't the outfitter's problem, as the hunt was donated, and the only loser is SCI.

So now the outfitter has donated a hunt, which is going to cost the Outfitter anywhere between $5,000 - $10,000 because SCI doesn't accept any old package, it has to be a quality one. Now imagine the same outfitter has to do this for almost every quality show they attend. Pretty soon as a Outfitter you have about $50,000 in donations, whatever the booths cost, travel expenses etc, all before you even booked your first client.

Now everyone is buying all these donated hunts, which translates to "why would people booked an additional safari" if they just got a steal on auction. The other major problem I have with the auctions is that hunters will buy 2-3 packages at next to nothing, go to Africa and back-to-back their safaris, and not add a single animal... of course, the outfitters kinda rely on any add-on because it litigates the cost, at least a little.

Then you get these Outfitters, and I know a few that do it, and it gets me going more than anything because it gives everyone a bad name, and deters clients from hunting in Africa at all. They put up a package that is designed to trap the hunter. "2 hunters + 1 Animal" - Move outside that perimeter and you get charged like you are hunting in Tanzania.

Honestly, get rid of the auctions...book your hunts directly from the Outfitter, and at least you know exactly what you are getting, all in black and white.

 

[MarkB]

So I gotta kinda step in here and give you guys both viewpoints and why I said I hate auctioned hunts in a previous comment and that it is destroying the industry.

On one hand, you get the outfitter - In most cases SCI (International convention) requires either a hunt donation or a monetary donation, in addition to $3000 per 10x10 booth. Personally, I just pay the money, and here is why... At the show, there are hundreds of African Outfitters, and obviously with that comes hundreds of donations. The problem with so many donations is that the hunts always go for nothing... This isn't the outfitter's problem, as the hunt was donated, and the only loser is SCI.

So now the outfitter has donated a hunt, which is going to cost the Outfitter anywhere between $5,000 - $10,000 because SCI doesn't accept any old package, it has to be a quality one. Now imagine the same outfitter has to do this for almost every quality show they attend. Pretty soon as a Outfitter you have about $50,000 in donations, whatever the booths cost, travel expenses etc, all before you even booked your first client.

Now everyone is buying all these donated hunts, which translates to "why would people booked an additional safari" if they just got a steal on auction. The other major problem I have with the auctions is that hunters will buy 2-3 packages at next to nothing, go to Africa and back-to-back their safaris, and not add a single animal... of course, the outfitters kinda rely on any add-on because it litigates the cost, at least a little.

Then you get these Outfitters, and I know a few that do it, and it gets me going more than anything because it gives everyone a bad name, and deters clients from hunting in Africa at all. They put up a package that is designed to trap the hunter. "2 hunters + 1 Animal" - Move outside that perimeter and you get charged like you are hunting in Tanzania.

Honestly, get rid of the auctions...book your hunts directly from the Outfitter, and at least you know exactly what you are getting, all in black and white.

Well said, in todays fast comms internet world your last statement/sentence is perfect. Communicate with the outfitter and even PH for all first hand details.

Now if only a far away booking client got all that the outfitter promised it would be even better. And vice vs the outfitter gets all the client states.

MB

 

[Tundra Tiger]

@BOSS SAFARIS ... I appreciate your candor and perspective; thank you for that.

I'd like to think I am a fairly normal guy/hunter. Am I against a good deal? Heck no. I am not independently wealthy, and every dollar counts. On the other and I don't expect the outfitter to bend over and take it; I appreciate you provide a valued service and product. I guess I see it like everything else. As often as we get told nothing's fair in life, that's all most of us really want: fairness for everyone. Nobody needs to get screwed and the process can work. Again, thanks for sharing that perspective.

 

[Hunt anything]

Boss Safaris was clear and to the point, I was discussing auction hunts with my last outfitter and he had been burned a few times by winning bidders shooting the animals or animal in the donation only and then refusing to add any others on.I was on an auction hunt with him at the time and I was glad I had added a day and 5 animals that totaled about $7000. Not real sure why he continues to offer up auction hunts , his animals on the A hunts are usually high dollar animals, sable or roan.

 

[BOSS SAFARIS]

@BOSS SAFARIS ... I appreciate your candor and perspective; thank you for that.

I'd like to think I am a fairly normal guy/hunter. Am I against a good deal? Heck no. I am not independently wealthy, and every dollar counts. On the other and I don't expect the outfitter to bend over and take it; I appreciate you provide a valued service and product. I guess I see it like everything else. As often as we get told nothing's fair in life, that's all most of us really want: fairness for everyone. Nobody needs to get screwed and the process can work. Again, thanks for sharing that perspective.

I agree with you, and there is nothing wrong with getting a good deal, but $800 for a nyala and 7 days? - - that's not benefiting anyone. But that is also what is leading to these outfitters doing that with their prices. They know someone is going to buy that hunt.. even if it goes for $50, but they know they going to make the money on hidden prices and absurd pricelists... and I can almost guarantee that if you as a hunter dont ask about any additional prices or pricelist, the only time it will come up from the Outfitters side is when you get you bill, I can almost guarantee it.