“This ole Mauser”

318AE

318AE

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I’m curious if anyone here can recognize who the maker, city of origin or engraver may be on this Mauser from the engraving. It’s an 8x60S according to the B U G proofs, and proofed in Feb of ‘32. The engraving was a determined effort. It’s a reasonably deep relief, and covers the action, bottom metal and trigger guard, magazine floor plate, bolt handle, bolt release and even the butt plate. It’s an interesting geometric pattern, unlike the game scenes I’ve seen on many Teutonic firearms. It has a three digit serial number on the action, barrel, bolt, bolt shroud etc, etc.
IMG_3092.jpeg

IMG_3089.jpeg
 
You almost certainly have what is referred to as "Guild" rifle. Independent German makers often built rifles on 98 actions in the general form of the Mauser Model B commercial offerings. Some would have interesting details like flattened bolt handles and engraving. I have never seen this particular pattern though geometric borders are not that uncommon. Another odd full coverage engraving I have seen on a guild rifle is fishscale. It could have been done by the original maker or added later. Guild rifles will not have a maker or distributor's name - hence the general characterization of having been made within the firearm makers' guild.

Nice rifle in a very useful chambering. Jon Speed's reference book (not where I am at the moment) carries photos of some of these unique designs.
 
There are no stampings under the stock, although I feel certain the stock is original (the entire rifle for that matter). It has a schnabel tip.
 
A few more observations about your Mauser. The 8x60 was a work around the treaty restrictions on the 8x57. This restriction wasn’t being rigidity enforced by 1932, I have a sporter chambered in 8x57i proofed in 1933. If the set trigger assembly is set in a milled recess it is probably a converted military action, if not, it is certainly a commercial action, any case it is nice.
Mike
 
I’m going by the proof marks below to assess it as a 8x60s, made in Feb ‘32. Are your thoughts the same? It does have a “price of wales” style rounded grip, without a grip cap, which some of the very early type b’s had.
IMG_3099.jpeg
 
It does appear to be a "Guild" rifle and one of better ones I've seen. The graduation from the Guild would have an an make a rifle make. The maker of this one would have graduated at the top of the class!!
Very well done and in either caliber, it's a desirable rifle.
 
I appreciate that Mike. The “232” is probably analogous to the “706” on your rifle, and the date remains a mystery. Albeit with less figured wood these guild guns often seem to be of equivalent quality to the contemporary British guns, at much more attractive prices.
 
318AE said:
I appreciate that Mike. The “232” is probably analogous to the “706” on your rifle, and the date remains a mystery. Albeit with less figured wood these guild guns often seem to be of equivalent quality to the contemporary British guns, at much more attractive prices.
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The 706 is the proof house ledger number, the 706th gun proofed in 1907 by that proof house probably Suhl, your’s would be the 232nd if it is a ledger number. That’s part of the fun, trying to figure out the mystery behind these old guns. All you can say is your rifle was built between 1918 and 1939, the BUG marks were replaced by the proof law of 1939. Enjoy it.
Mike
 
According to Speed, the B and U marks were in use up to approximately 1924, the G added sometime after and the N in the late 1930s.
I have a Mauser Oberndorf with a serial number that dates it to 1924-1925 that only has the B and U marks so perhaps G started no earlier than 1925.
The BUG marks would date your Mauser between approximately 1925 and the late 1930s.
The 'St.m.g. 13gr' mark indicates it was proofed with a 13gr steel-jacketed bullet. I understand this proof tradition was largely discontinued after WWI making the combination of a pre-WWI proof tradition combined with a post-WWI 8x60s cartridge and BUG proof marks an interesting combination.
 
BC Tal said:
According to Speed, the B and U marks were in use up to approximately 1924, the G added sometime after and the N in the late 1930s.
I have a Mauser Oberndorf with a serial number that dates it to 1924-1925 that only has the B and U marks so perhaps G started no earlier than 1925.
The BUG marks would date your Mauser between approximately 1925 and the late 1930s.
The 'St.m.g. 13gr' mark indicates it was proofed with a 13gr steel-jacketed bullet. I understand this proof tradition was largely discontinued after WWI making the combination of a pre-WWI proof tradition combined with a post-WWI 8x60s cartridge and BUG proof marks an interesting combination.
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I appreciate that insight BC. I’ve often wondered if this was a pre WW1 rifle, later re-chambered to 80x60s and reproofed.
 
318AE said:
I’m curious if anyone here can recognize who the maker, city of origin or engraver may be on this Mauser from the engraving. It’s an 8x60S according to the B U G proofs, and proofed in Feb of ‘32. The engraving was a determined effort. It’s a reasonably deep relief, and covers the action, bottom metal and trigger guard, magazine floor plate, bolt handle, bolt release and even the butt plate. It’s an interesting geometric pattern, unlike the game scenes I’ve seen on many Teutonic firearms. It has a three digit serial number on the action, barrel, bolt, bolt shroud etc, etc.
View attachment 788250
View attachment 788251
Click to expand...
can't help, but I'm jealous!
 
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I am going to go with Steyr Osterreich (St. m. O on the barrel) (made in Austria) pre 1925 (can you please post a picture of the bridge) & then later taken into Germany & proofed as a foreign gun (crowned B proof - which is a German proof on a foreign made gun) along with the German rifle proof (crowned G) & then it was reproofed a second time for some reason (crowned U). 7x9mmx60 is your 8x60, Not certain on the 13 gr (cr?) but would assume that this is the bullet test weight at proof equiv of 200 grains which would match the caliber & not sure on the 94 & it seems to be on all parts but will keep turning the pages of the books .....

Cannot see clearly on the first picture but it has double set triggers correct ?

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Strange it has all the characteristics of a Mannlicher with the butter knife bolt handle, the set triggers & the engraving but on a Mauser system?!

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