22 or 6.5 Creedmore for Moose and Elk?

Shout out to our Creemore fans. QUESTION: Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? If so, which game animals. How has it performed for you?

Before you excoriate me for being a Creedmore fanboy, let me explain. I have never used a 22 or 6mm rifle to kill any game animals larger than a coyote. Also, my idea of a good Elk or Moose round is a 7mm RM, 300wm or 338wm loaded with a heavy bonded or copper mono bullet. I do add that bullet placement is more important than bullet type, weight, energy, etc. Also, I do not like having to track my game animals for miles.

All that said, I have encountered examples recently where hunters used for example 223 to take Axis deer with stunning results. I have seen side by side tests on ballistic gel using Federal Fusion bonded bullets in 243, 308 and 30-06 where the 243 penetrated just as deep and did comparable damage along its path which would suggest that on game the result would also be similar (assuming a perfect broadside shot properly placed). None of that makes me want to trade my magnum for a 243 let alone a 22 CM for an upcoming Moose hunt.

This morning I was watching a new youtube video posted by a young Elk hunting expert (self proclaimed). He said that a 6.5CM was the perfect Elk round because it was accurate and did not kick too much. His personal Elk rifle is a 22 CM which he likes even more but which is not legal for Elk in some states. He also states that for most hunters and in his case, the recoil of a 308 is too much??? He did not have his hair pulled back in a man-bun but had enough hair to do so on a windy day, lol. Mr X-purt cited a number of studies about bullets, bullet weight and energy and affect of recoil on soldiers to conclude that bullet placement is everything to insure hunting success. Because according to him, a 22-Creedmore recoils less thus he shoots it better and therefore is more likely to hit his prey more correctly.

I will admit that one of my most accurate hunting rifles is a 243. Another is a 22lr. But using his logic I am not using either one for Elk or Moose. Some of my other most accurate hunting rifles are: 7mm/08, 7mm RM, and 375HH. All three of these are sub moa with most loads and close to 1/2 moa with there best load. I am of a mind that most men can be taught or can teach themselves how to shoot heavy recoiling rifles with a bit of practice and trial and error. I find it necessary to remember to hold the rifle snug into my shoulder pocket without tensing up or rushing the trigger pull. This is only an issue when range shooting and you never feel the recoil in a hunting scenario. Shooting big un-compensated magnums off of a bench can be unpleasant in some cases. I have a carbon-titanium super light 7mm Mag that is that way when I remove the muzzle brake. But it only weighs about 6.5lbs.

So, where do you fall on this Question? Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? Is so which animals have you hunted? How has it performed for you?

There's a lot of unspoken factors in these stories that skew the answer. I own two 6,5 Creedmoor rifles and though the 6.5CM can kill Elk, research the velocity and impact poundage before you do anything. You just don't know far your rifle caliber will be effective in a humane kill. I use my .308 win for elk and ensure my loads are adequate for good kill shots. Then I limit my distance to maximize the caliber and load.

Outdoor Life has been running a lot of content lately that is pushing the concept of using smaller cartridges for hunting bigger game. The idea being that lower recoil is conducive to better shooting. While they may make a fair point that a .338 Winchester Magnum isn’t the best fit for everyone, I personally find it rather irresponsible of them to suggest to a lot of inexperienced shooters that a .243 Winchester or .22 ARC is “just fine” for hunting elk and moose size game. Of course a double lung shot on any big game animal will prove fatal in relatively short order, and this can be achieved with a relatively small bullet if the shot is perfect. But as we should all know that perfect shot just isn’t always the way it goes. I tend to favor the concept of using cartridges which are capable of driving bullets that will ensure adequate penetration from less than ideal angles, and moreover allow for some margin of error considering shot placement or animal movement. And keeping shots within a reasonable distance. The 6.5 Creedmoor may be capable of long range accuracy but it simply isn’t carrying enough momentum to ensure adequate penetration on a 1,000 Pound animal at 1,000 yards. For that matter I find it rather distasteful to shoot at animals from distance much more than 300 yards unless circumstances dictate that necessity. The long story short I think cartridges such as .270 or .308 Winchester loaded with partition bullets are a very good starting point for hunting game of this weight class; these offer consistently adequate performance at a level of recoil that just about anyone can comfortably tolerate.

I have a 6.5x.300 weatherby, and I wouldn't use that to hunt Elk or Moose - I think that says enough about my opinion

No thanks.

No thanks 22cal not legal and 6.5 marginal

It can work but would prefer a 7mm or .30 cal. The 6.5 Creed will do it but you better be perfect on your shot placement.

Absolutely not.

I don't care what cartridge it is, nothing in the .224 category should be used for big game hunting.

Yes, I know a .224 bullet  can take down a deer/elk/etc. I have also done it. But it is not the proper caliber that  should be used.

I have a 6.5x55 I would not plan to take it elk hunting.
And I would not use the 22 of a fl whitetail

JG26Irish_2 said:

Shout out to our Creemore fans. QUESTION: Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? If so, which game animals. How has it performed for you?

Before you excoriate me for being a Creedmore fanboy, let me explain. I have never used a 22 or 6mm rifle to kill any game animals larger than a coyote. Also, my idea of a good Elk or Moose round is a 7mm RM, 300wm or 338wm loaded with a heavy bonded or copper mono bullet. I do add that bullet placement is more important than bullet type, weight, energy, etc. Also, I do not like having to track my game animals for miles.

All that said, I have encountered examples recently where hunters used for example 223 to take Axis deer with stunning results. I have seen side by side tests on ballistic gel using Federal Fusion bonded bullets in 243, 308 and 30-06 where the 243 penetrated just as deep and did comparable damage along its path which would suggest that on game the result would also be similar (assuming a perfect broadside shot properly placed). None of that makes me want to trade my magnum for a 243 let alone a 22 CM for an upcoming Moose hunt.

This morning I was watching a new youtube video posted by a young Elk hunting expert (self proclaimed). He said that a 6.5CM was the perfect Elk round because it was accurate and did not kick too much. His personal Elk rifle is a 22 CM which he likes even more but which is not legal for Elk in some states. He also states that for most hunters and in his case, the recoil of a 308 is too much??? He did not have his hair pulled back in a man-bun but had enough hair to do so on a windy day, lol. Mr X-purt cited a number of studies about bullets, bullet weight and energy and affect of recoil on soldiers to conclude that bullet placement is everything to insure hunting success. Because according to him, a 22-Creedmore recoils less thus he shoots it better and therefore is more likely to hit his prey more correctly.

I will admit that one of my most accurate hunting rifles is a 243. Another is a 22lr. But using his logic I am not using either one for Elk or Moose. Some of my other most accurate hunting rifles are: 7mm/08, 7mm RM, and 375HH. All three of these are sub moa with most loads and close to 1/2 moa with there best load. I am of a mind that most men can be taught or can teach themselves how to shoot heavy recoiling rifles with a bit of practice and trial and error. I find it necessary to remember to hold the rifle snug into my shoulder pocket without tensing up or rushing the trigger pull. This is only an issue when range shooting and you never feel the recoil in a hunting scenario. Shooting big un-compensated magnums off of a bench can be unpleasant in some cases. I have a carbon-titanium super light 7mm Mag that is that way when I remove the muzzle brake. But it only weighs about 6.5lbs.

So, where do you fall on this Question? Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? Is so which animals have you hunted? How has it performed for you?

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I would not use either for a large game animal such as Elk or Caribou, even a large deer. In my state .22 cal is Illegal. If you are going to hunt one of those animals you want everything in your favor, bullet diameter, weight, velocity are all important. My minimum would be .270 with 140 0r 150 grain hunting bullets and go up from there. I personally use .30-06 with 180gr bullets as my starting point and go up from there!

JG26Irish_2 said:

Shout out to our Creemore fans. QUESTION: Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? If so, which game animals. How has it performed for you?

Before you excoriate me for being a Creedmore fanboy, let me explain. I have never used a 22 or 6mm rifle to kill any game animals larger than a coyote. Also, my idea of a good Elk or Moose round is a 7mm RM, 300wm or 338wm loaded with a heavy bonded or copper mono bullet. I do add that bullet placement is more important than bullet type, weight, energy, etc. Also, I do not like having to track my game animals for miles.

All that said, I have encountered examples recently where hunters used for example 223 to take Axis deer with stunning results. I have seen side by side tests on ballistic gel using Federal Fusion bonded bullets in 243, 308 and 30-06 where the 243 penetrated just as deep and did comparable damage along its path which would suggest that on game the result would also be similar (assuming a perfect broadside shot properly placed). None of that makes me want to trade my magnum for a 243 let alone a 22 CM for an upcoming Moose hunt.

This morning I was watching a new youtube video posted by a young Elk hunting expert (self proclaimed). He said that a 6.5CM was the perfect Elk round because it was accurate and did not kick too much. His personal Elk rifle is a 22 CM which he likes even more but which is not legal for Elk in some states. He also states that for most hunters and in his case, the recoil of a 308 is too much??? He did not have his hair pulled back in a man-bun but had enough hair to do so on a windy day, lol. Mr X-purt cited a number of studies about bullets, bullet weight and energy and affect of recoil on soldiers to conclude that bullet placement is everything to insure hunting success. Because according to him, a 22-Creedmore recoils less thus he shoots it better and therefore is more likely to hit his prey more correctly.

I will admit that one of my most accurate hunting rifles is a 243. Another is a 22lr. But using his logic I am not using either one for Elk or Moose. Some of my other most accurate hunting rifles are: 7mm/08, 7mm RM, and 375HH. All three of these are sub moa with most loads and close to 1/2 moa with there best load. I am of a mind that most men can be taught or can teach themselves how to shoot heavy recoiling rifles with a bit of practice and trial and error. I find it necessary to remember to hold the rifle snug into my shoulder pocket without tensing up or rushing the trigger pull. This is only an issue when range shooting and you never feel the recoil in a hunting scenario. Shooting big un-compensated magnums off of a bench can be unpleasant in some cases. I have a carbon-titanium super light 7mm Mag that is that way when I remove the muzzle brake. But it only weighs about 6.5lbs.

So, where do you fall on this Question? Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? Is so which animals have you hunted? How has it performed for you?

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Neither is a preferred cartridge for an elk or moose. Period. End of discussion.

Personally a 6.5 Creedmore would not be my choice. Even though the Scandinavians use the 6.5X55 for moose. The 22 CM nope.

JG26Irish_2 said:

Shout out to our Creemore fans. QUESTION: Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? If so, which game animals. How has it performed for you?

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I use a 6.5 mannlicher with 160grn bullets not the typical 140 a creedmore uses. But i would not use it on elk or other large game. Smallest id go is 270 but even then im firmly in the 3006 camp.

JG26Irish_2 said:

Before you excoriate me for being a Creedmore fanboy, let me explain. I have never used a 22 or 6mm rifle to kill any game animals larger than a coyote. Also, my idea of a good Elk or Moose round is a 7mm RM, 300wm or 338wm loaded with a heavy bonded or copper mono bullet. I do add that bullet placement is more important than bullet type, weight, energy, etc. Also, I do not like having to track my game animals for miles.

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JG26Irish_2 said:

All that said, I have encountered examples recently where hunters used for example 223 to take Axis deer with stunning results. I have seen side by side tests on ballistic gel using Federal Fusion bonded bullets in 243, 308 and 30-06 where the 243 penetrated just as deep and did comparable damage along its path which would suggest that on game the result would also be similar (assuming a perfect broadside shot properly placed). None of that makes me want to trade my magnum for a 243 let alone a 22 CM for an upcoming Moose hunt.

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I have known guys who use a 22 mag when i was in hs and a spotlight for deer doesnt make it right or the best tool.

Ballistic gel doesnt really = real world results. You have soft tissue and bones that are odd shapes as well. And sure a 243 might go as deep if it misses all the bones.

JG26Irish_2 said:

This morning I was watching a new youtube video posted by a young Elk hunting expert (self proclaimed). He said that a 6.5CM was the perfect Elk round because it was accurate and did not kick too much. His personal Elk rifle is a 22 CM which he likes even more but which is not legal for Elk in some states. He also states that for most hunters and in his case, the recoil of a 308 is too much??? He did not have his hair pulled back in a man-bun but had enough hair to do so on a windy day, lol. Mr X-purt cited a number of studies about bullets, bullet weight and energy and affect of recoil on soldiers to conclude that bullet placement is everything to insure hunting success. Because according to him, a 22-Creedmore recoils less thus he shoots it better and therefore is more likely to hit his prey more correctly.

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Bullets left the barrel by time you feel percieved recoil. How is it snipers are using 338 and 50bmg rounds and in some cases bigger? Why not a 22lr

JG26Irish_2 said:

I will admit that one of my most accurate hunting rifles is a 243. Another is a 22lr. But using his logic I am not using either one for Elk or Moose. Some of my other most accurate hunting rifles are: 7mm/08, 7mm RM, and 375HH. All three of these are sub moa with most loads and close to 1/2 moa with there best load. I am of a mind that most men can be taught or can teach themselves how to shoot heavy recoiling rifles with a bit of practice and trial and error. I find it necessary to remember to hold the rifle snug into my shoulder pocket without tensing up or rushing the trigger pull. This is only an issue when range shooting and you never feel the recoil in a hunting scenario. Shooting big un-compensated magnums off of a bench can be unpleasant in some cases. I have a carbon-titanium super light 7mm Mag that is that way when I remove the muzzle brake. But it only weighs about 6.5lbs.

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Ive never been a fan of super light weight guns. But i wouldnt put the 308 to 300wm type rifles into the heavy recoil catagory.

JG26Irish_2 said:

So, where do you fall on this Question? Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? Is so which animals have you hunted? How has it performed for you?

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Ill tried to address your points in detail. Vs just yes good no bad.

But overall can it work yes. Is it the newest fancy shiny round sure. 6.5 swede is basically same thing and beem around 100 years so not as cool.
But lighter bullets going fast still dont have alot of mass when they impact.

Mass for same speed = alot more energy

Swedes traditionally hunt moose with 6.5x55.
But... just because they had milsurp rifles of that caliber, nothing else.

In modern world, where shops are full of rifles, calibers and ammunition there is no excuse to go hunting undergunned.

I think bigger hole bleeds better.

My choice would be: 338 win mag, 375 H&H, 9.3x62 in that level, with 300 win mag acceptable
Moose is big animal.

I assume it is costly hunt.
Loosing animal for wounding would not be good.

JG26Irish_2 said:

Shout out to our Creemore fans. QUESTION: Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? If so, which game animals. How has it performed for you?

Before you excoriate me for being a Creedmore fanboy, let me explain. I have never used a 22 or 6mm rifle to kill any game animals larger than a coyote. Also, my idea of a good Elk or Moose round is a 7mm RM, 300wm or 338wm loaded with a heavy bonded or copper mono bullet. I do add that bullet placement is more important than bullet type, weight, energy, etc. Also, I do not like having to track my game animals for miles.

All that said, I have encountered examples recently where hunters used for example 223 to take Axis deer with stunning results. I have seen side by side tests on ballistic gel using Federal Fusion bonded bullets in 243, 308 and 30-06 where the 243 penetrated just as deep and did comparable damage along its path which would suggest that on game the result would also be similar (assuming a perfect broadside shot properly placed). None of that makes me want to trade my magnum for a 243 let alone a 22 CM for an upcoming Moose hunt.

This morning I was watching a new youtube video posted by a young Elk hunting expert (self proclaimed). He said that a 6.5CM was the perfect Elk round because it was accurate and did not kick too much. His personal Elk rifle is a 22 CM which he likes even more but which is not legal for Elk in some states. He also states that for most hunters and in his case, the recoil of a 308 is too much??? He did not have his hair pulled back in a man-bun but had enough hair to do so on a windy day, lol. Mr X-purt cited a number of studies about bullets, bullet weight and energy and affect of recoil on soldiers to conclude that bullet placement is everything to insure hunting success. Because according to him, a 22-Creedmore recoils less thus he shoots it better and therefore is more likely to hit his prey more correctly.

I will admit that one of my most accurate hunting rifles is a 243. Another is a 22lr. But using his logic I am not using either one for Elk or Moose. Some of my other most accurate hunting rifles are: 7mm/08, 7mm RM, and 375HH. All three of these are sub moa with most loads and close to 1/2 moa with there best load. I am of a mind that most men can be taught or can teach themselves how to shoot heavy recoiling rifles with a bit of practice and trial and error. I find it necessary to remember to hold the rifle snug into my shoulder pocket without tensing up or rushing the trigger pull. This is only an issue when range shooting and you never feel the recoil in a hunting scenario. Shooting big un-compensated magnums off of a bench can be unpleasant in some cases. I have a carbon-titanium super light 7mm Mag that is that way when I remove the muzzle brake. But it only weighs about 6.5lbs.

So, where do you fall on this Question? Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? Is so which animals have you hunted? How has it performed for you?

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A 308 is too much recoil

mark-hunter said:

Swedes traditionally hunt moose with 6.5x55.
But... just because they had milsurp rifles of that caliber, nothing else.

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They also have to use heavy for caliber bullets, 150+ grain, to comply with the energy requirements.
In Scandinavia most moose are shot inside 100 yards.

I saw that video clip by the self proclaimed elk whisperer.

It’s actually a rather flawed discussion.
He quoted a number of military tests that you can’t compare to hunting statistics.
If I was sending 100+ rounds per day, I would also prefer a light recoiling platform, but who can remember the recoil from the last shot you took at game? 22LR or 375H&H….

Yes… you can kill elk and moose using a 6.5 with ideal shot placement, but that seldomly happens in the real world.

JG26Irish_2 said:

Shout out to our Creemore fans. QUESTION: Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? If so, which game animals. How has it performed for you?

Before you excoriate me for being a Creedmore fanboy, let me explain. I have never used a 22 or 6mm rifle to kill any game animals larger than a coyote. Also, my idea of a good Elk or Moose round is a 7mm RM, 300wm or 338wm loaded with a heavy bonded or copper mono bullet. I do add that bullet placement is more important than bullet type, weight, energy, etc. Also, I do not like having to track my game animals for miles.

All that said, I have encountered examples recently where hunters used for example 223 to take Axis deer with stunning results. I have seen side by side tests on ballistic gel using Federal Fusion bonded bullets in 243, 308 and 30-06 where the 243 penetrated just as deep and did comparable damage along its path which would suggest that on game the result would also be similar (assuming a perfect broadside shot properly placed). None of that makes me want to trade my magnum for a 243 let alone a 22 CM for an upcoming Moose hunt.

This morning I was watching a new youtube video posted by a young Elk hunting expert (self proclaimed). He said that a 6.5CM was the perfect Elk round because it was accurate and did not kick too much. His personal Elk rifle is a 22 CM which he likes even more but which is not legal for Elk in some states. He also states that for most hunters and in his case, the recoil of a 308 is too much??? He did not have his hair pulled back in a man-bun but had enough hair to do so on a windy day, lol. Mr X-purt cited a number of studies about bullets, bullet weight and energy and affect of recoil on soldiers to conclude that bullet placement is everything to insure hunting success. Because according to him, a 22-Creedmore recoils less thus he shoots it better and therefore is more likely to hit his prey more correctly.

I will admit that one of my most accurate hunting rifles is a 243. Another is a 22lr. But using his logic I am not using either one for Elk or Moose. Some of my other most accurate hunting rifles are: 7mm/08, 7mm RM, and 375HH. All three of these are sub moa with most loads and close to 1/2 moa with there best load. I am of a mind that most men can be taught or can teach themselves how to shoot heavy recoiling rifles with a bit of practice and trial and error. I find it necessary to remember to hold the rifle snug into my shoulder pocket without tensing up or rushing the trigger pull. This is only an issue when range shooting and you never feel the recoil in a hunting scenario. Shooting big un-compensated magnums off of a bench can be unpleasant in some cases. I have a carbon-titanium super light 7mm Mag that is that way when I remove the muzzle brake. But it only weighs about 6.5lbs.

So, where do you fall on this Question? Is a 6.5CM or a 22CM the ideal Elk hunting rifle? Do you use one to hunt big game? Is so which animals have you hunted? How has it performed for you?

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Dear Jg26,
the strength and resistance of the animal to the impact of projectiles depends and starts with the skin. The skin is the one that raises the level of caliber. If the skin is thick, the weight of the projectile must be greater. All of us on this forum know ballistics well, so I won't spread the story.
I hunt a lot with 243, I also know 6.5creed and I think they are sufficient for hunting heavy animals with the use of adequate bullets.The difference between larger and smaller calibers is also in the tolerated mistake in the hit.
243 and 6.5 will kill any animal if you hit her in the lungs and heart. Well, if you hit it worse, the animal will certainly take the hit a lot. I believe that the point of impact and the bullet model are more important than the caliber.
I also think that shooting at animals that are more than 300yds away (except in exceptional cases) is unethical and unfair. When it comes to Moose and Elk, I think it is more desirable to have one of the larger calibers. Although I know that the 243 with the Oryx 100gr grain with the rules of the shot will certainly shoot down the Moose no less effectively than the 308 -30 06, it would not be my first choice in this hunt.
I don't know about 22 creed. I think I repeated most of the things that my colleagues said before me, but that is also my opinion