Vintage double rifles regulated with soft nose bullets..

Pondoro

Pondoro

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I have something puzzling me..I have a 1906 vintage Joseph Lang in .450/400 3 1/4 NE.. On the barrel it reads "Regulated for 60 grains cordite and 400 grain soft nose bullets"..

According to John Taylor the 450/400´s were THE allround medium rifle before the .375H&H emerged and 1906 was the heydays of elephant hunting. Buffalo was also shot with solids only due to inferior soft nose bullets. So why regulate for/with soft nose..? Perhaps made for India with tiger in mind...or the african cats..? Customer specs..?

So my question is, how common was it to regulate the .450/400´s for softs..?
 
The solids of yesteryear were for the most part made from gilding metal, which was relatively soft and not as heavy-duty on barrels as steel-jacketed solids. Regulating with softs was fine as the solids of the day probably shot pretty much the same in any event.
 
It was intended to be used for tiger hunting in India. Back in those days, the .450/400 Nitro Express was almost universally preferred by Indian tiger hunters. Elephant hunting was banned in India in 1873, so most double rifles under .500/465 Nitro Express caliber (which would be used for gaur bison or water buffalo) intended for Indian shikar would definitely be regulated with soft points (with tigers, leopards & Asian sloth bears in mind).

But of course, solids could also be used in the rifle. The Kynoch soft points and round nosed gilding metal jacketed FMJ solids both regulated to the same point of impact.
 
I did shoot some prewar Eley ammo with solids..had to stop that due to duds and afterburners..

I will load it with Woodleigh softs only I think..
 
Pondoro said:
I did shoot some prewar Eley ammo with solids..had to stop that due to duds and afterburners..

I will load it with Woodleigh softs only I think..
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Or Wim Degol tombac jacketed FMJ solids. These are built to the original specifications and profile of the pre 1950 Kynoch gilding metal jacketed FMJ solids.

And guaranteed not to cause strain on old rifle barrels.
 
Golam..do you have a link to Wim Degol bullets..?
 
Hunter-Habib said:
Or Wim Degol tombac jacketed FMJ solids. These are built to the original specifications and profile of the pre 1950 Kynoch gilding metal jacketed FMJ solids.

And guaranteed not to cause strain on old rifle barrels.
Click to expand...

I would not be so sure about that.

Vim Degol recently made FMJ bullets for me and on this occasion informed me that his bullets have much thicker walls than those from Woodleigh. He certainly also makes thin-jacketed bullets, but not for all calibers.
 
grand veneur said:
I would not be so sure about that.

Vim Degol recently made FMJ bullets for me and on this occasion informed me that his bullets have much thicker walls than those from Woodleigh. He certainly also makes thin-jacketed bullets, but not for all calibers.
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But grand veneur, he told me that his tombac jacketed FMJ solids are safe to use even in pre World War I double rifles.
 
Hunter-Habib said:
But grand veneur, he told me that his tombac jacketed FMJ solids are safe to use even in pre World War I double rifles.
Click to expand...

Sure you can use such bullets in old double rifles, I do that too, but the bullet maker don't know your rifle. Everyone has to take the condition of his rifle into account and handle accordingly on their own responsibility, but if you are not so sure about what you are doing, you are always on the safe side with thin-jacketed soft point bullets.
 
Pondoro said:
I did shoot some prewar Eley ammo with solids..had to stop that due to duds and afterburners..

I will load it with Woodleigh softs only I think..
Click to expand...
I had a 1908 DR Westley Richards. I only used woodleigh in softs and their FMJ and nothing else for fear of ruining the barrels otherwise
 
Rare Breed said:
I had a 1908 DR Westley Richards. I only used woodleigh in softs and their FMJ and nothing else for fear of ruining the barrels otherwise
Click to expand...

Typically thin skinned game like Lion, Leopard, Kudu, Eland, etc uses a double rifle soft with .025” to .035” thick gilding metal jackets. The heavy buffalo softs are usually .065”.

I would hope that FMJ traditional solids would use the .065” jackets to ensure the steel jacket never touches the rifling, but I’m uncertain.
 
I highly recommend listening to @rookhawk on your vintage DR. He advised me and worked extremely well
 
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