45-70 for dangerous game?

[BeeMaa]

As far as I know that permit does not exist, but strange things happen. Thats why I stated I would be interested in the correspondence.

Unfortunately there are PHs operating under certain licensed operators that turn a blind eye to almost anything. I am not saying that is what you want to do, but if you do be very careful the last thing you or anyone want is to end up in our prison.

I have posted in the past about foreign PHs telling clients that they can arrange a DG hunt in Zim. They then pay off one of thei PHs to do a ride along and the foreign PH acts as your PH. This type of person will certainly work with anyone on just about anything. It happens.

Lon

I would say that corruption is a part of hunting (around the world and not just in Africa) and a few posts on this thread are going to do nothing to curb it.

The blame is shared by the client as well as the PH (or contracted PH). IMO, the one who pulls the trigger has the ultimate responsibility to take an ethical shot.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Some times I believe that the client honestly does not realize what he has got him or her self into until after they arrive. Once they realize their mistake they just seem to go along with it and hope for the best.

I would say that corruption is a part of hunting (around the world and not just in Africa) and a few posts on this thread are going to do nothing to curb it.

The blame is shared by the client as well as the PH (or contracted PH). IMO, the one who pulls the trigger has the ultimate responsibility to take an ethical shot.

I would say that corruption is a part of hunting (around the world and not just in Africa) and a few posts on this thread are going to do nothing to curb it.

The blame is shared by the client as well as the PH (or contracted PH). IMO, the one who pulls the trigger has the ultimate responsibility to take an ethical shot.

 

[IvW]

Slightly off topic (apologies)....but what is the leverevolution ammunition capable of taking...in 45-70 and 30-30?

Pigs........

 

[jlb1036]

Good morning
If you are considering hunting cape buff with the 4570 my advice personally and professionally
make sure you have good medical insurance and life insurance updated and arrangements for evacuation just in case but any way they are excellent choices of better rounds like 416 458 win mag lott and even the old but effective 375 hh.

 

[spike.t]

Pigs........

Is that it....so the bullet isn't too tough?....

 

[poco]

Is that it....so the bullet isn't too tough?....

Pigs , meduim game out to 150 meters like elk , black bear , deer

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Good morning
If you are considering hunting cape buff with the 4570 my advice personally and professionally
make sure you have good medical insurance and life insurance updated and arrangements for evacuation just in case but any way they are excellent choices of better rounds like 416 458 win mag lott and even the old but effective 375 hh.

One other thing I do not know if Rip Cord does rescues frim Chikuruba prison.

 

[spike.t]

Pigs , meduim game out to 150 meters like elk , black bear , deer

Thanks ....just need to persuade the gunshop to bring some 45-70 and 30-30 ammo in as some of my toys that been in storage arrived over here just before Christmas.....not sure where will find any black bear or elk here in zambia though....suppose I can get some shipped up from SA....

 

[Tundra Tiger]

@spike.t ... I have not really done much with the LEVER ammo in .45-70 but I have used it extensively in my .338 Marlin Express. It is the same bullet, just a hair smaller in diameter and a hair faster when it leaves the barrel.

When I bought my .338 ME it was the only commercial ammo I could get. I had reservations about how it would hold up, and some on here have had mixed results. For me? It has been a very solid performer. Even now, with a lifetime of brass and everything I need to reload, I still use factory ammo because it's the most accurate load in my rifle. I have ten bull moose in the dozen years I have used it, and after the first few I gave up worrying about the bullet. All ten have been one shot kills, and while moose aren't terribly difficult to kill, they are quite large.

Additionally I used my .338 ME and the LEVER ammo in Africa in 2021. I shot two bull kudu, a blue wildebeest, blesbok, warthog, 2 impala, and a springbok. Distances were out to 240 yards. Except for the wildebeest (which was a bad first shot by me at an extreme angle), all were dead in very short order without tracking required. My PH was very impressed and very happy - as was I.

Based on that, my opinion is the same bullet in the .45-70 would be fine on PG to 150, and maybe 200 under the right conditions.

 

[375Fox]

@spike.t ... I have not really done much with the LEVER ammo in .45-70 but I have used it extensively in my .338 Marlin Express. It is the same bullet, just a hair smaller in diameter and a hair faster when it leaves the barrel.

When I bought my .338 ME it was the only commercial ammo I could get. I had reservations about how it would hold up, and some on here have had mixed results. For me? It has been a very solid performer. Even now, with a lifetime of brass and everything I need to reload, I still use factory ammo because it's the most accurate load in my rifle. I have ten bull moose in the dozen years I have used it, and after the first few I gave up worrying about the bullet. All ten have been one shot kills, and while moose aren't terribly difficult to kill, they are quite large.

Additionally I used my .338 ME and the LEVER ammo in Africa in 2021. I shot two bull kudu, a blue wildebeest, blesbok, warthog, 2 impala, and a springbok. Distances were out to 240 yards. Except for the wildebeest (which was a bad first shot by me at an extreme angle), all were dead in very short order without tracking required. My PH was very impressed and very happy - as was I.

Based on that, my opinion is the same bullet in the .45-70 would be fine on PG to 150, and maybe 200 under the right conditions.

Did you use the lead core or the all copper bullet? I’d think the all copper would be a tough bullet that would retain mass. The lead core bullet is just a standard non-bonded bullet with a thin jacket.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

To my knowledge all of my factory ammo has the standard cup and core under the flexible tip. From what I can remember, on all broadside moose, the mushroomed bullet has been under the skin on the far side. Distances have been between low 100s out to about 210. I have shot caribou at greater distances, and the results were the same. The two kudu were the same; one was 130 and the other 150. Both were single shot kills that traveled maybe 20 yards, if that.

I realize the 29 animals I have shot with my .338 ME is chicken feed compared to what some of you shoot, but it's what I've got. It's been enough that I have faith in the rifle and load.

 

[375Fox]

To my knowledge all of my factory ammo has the standard cup and core under the flexible tip. From what I can remember, on all broadside moose, the mushroomed bullet has been under the skin on the far side. Distances have been between low 100s out to about 210. I have shot caribou at greater distances, and the results were the same. The two kudu were the same; one was 130 and the other 150. Both were single shot kills that traveled maybe 20 yards, if that.

I realize the 29 animals I have shot with my .338 ME is chicken feed compared to what some of you shoot, but it's what I've got. It's been enough that I have faith in the rifle and load.

I’m not into lever guns, but they do offer mono bullets in leverevolution factory ammo. Might be worth a try if someone wants to use a lever gun and looking for a tougher bullet.

 

[freefall]

I would take the LeveRevolution ammo after moose, but not brown bears. .45-70. The .30-30 has limited utility up here.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

I agree @freefall ... As much faith as I have come to have in the FTX bullet for moose and caribou, it would not be my choice for brown bear. I did use a handload with a 160 grain FTX in a .308 (Savage 99) for blacktail and it performed well, though honestly at the distances we saw deer I probably could have gotten by with a large rock and a good throw.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I've got ten bull moose, a few more than that caribou, 2 kudu, 2 impala, a warthog, a zebra, a blue wildebeest, a springbok, and a blesbok that say FTX bullets can do just fine, at least out of the .338 Marlin. And the ten bull moose were all essentially one shot kills.

@Tundra Tiger
I used to love the 265gn FTX in my 444 marlin. Built on a No4 SMLE action I had no issues using full length cases. This really made them sing at over 2,400fps. Absolutely flattened pigs and sambar deer.
Bob

 

[serdog]

Most of the conversation has been around Buffalo however it terms of Dangerous Game I would think the .45/70 would be effective for Leopard and Lion much like it is for big bear in North America.

 

[freefall]

Most of the conversation has been around Buffalo however it terms of Dangerous Game I would think the .45/70 would be effective for Leopard and Lion much like it is for big bear in North America.

Yeah that. I would think heading into the brush after a lion would be very similar to easing into an alder patch after a bear.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

Agreed @serdog ...

 

[Rafiki]

Slightly off topic (apologies)....but what is the leverevolution ammunition capable of taking...in 45-70 and 30-30?

Deer

 

[WebleyGreene455]

Zimbabwe

people hunt dangerous game with handguns that dont come close to meeting the ballistics a 45-70 produces.. they hunt dangerous game with archery equipment that doesnt deliver anything close to the terminal ballistics that a 45-70 produces..

I'm asking purely about Zimbabwe because it's where I've figured I'll go if I ever do. Do they not have a minimum energy requirement also? I haven't been able to find the documents again but I recall seeing that there was a minimum energy listed when I looked at the rules a while ago. Which made me go looking for load info on making .45-70 meet the energy value and that's how I found a couple cartridge makers whose heavy loads would work alright in a Shiloh Sharps '74. If I wanted to use a Sharps '74 and not a 9.3x62 Mauser.