Setting up the adolescent shooter

[HankBuck]

I think it depends a lot on the kid. I was shooting a rem 870 with 3 in mag buckshot at 9 and a 30-06. But I was 6’2” and 230lbs at 12 and our 4h let me start showing steers at 8. Which was 2 years early than normal. But I was really big for my age group.

@Flbt - well gun fit must be a problem for you now…assuming you’re 7’ 8” and 500lbs.?

 

[Flbt]

@Flbt - well gun fit must be a problem for you now…assuming you’re 7’ 8” and 500lbs.?

Luckily I stoped at 6’6” now the bad thing is o am to close to the 500lbs from not walking much for years with multiple broken legs.
I do have multiple family members from 6’2” to 6’9”
And the strange thing 3 of the 6’2” were girl cousins lol

 

[Flbt]

Luckily I stoped at 6’6” now the bad thing is o am to close to the 500lbs from not walking much for years with multiple broken legs.
I do have multiple family members from 6’2” to 6’9”
And the strange thing 3 of the 6’2” were girl cousins lol

As far as fit works for guns I got usto short stocks with the ar,s especially with armor on.

 

[steve white]

@steve white - for “Shooting” my focus would be proper gun fit and a manageable caliber/gauge.
After that for Rifle I would start the basics of shooting with a .22lr at stationary paper targets and for shotgun a 20ga (or 28ga if available for reasonable price). For shotgun after a few shots on a stationary target - most practice sessions would be on “moving” clay targets with easy straight always to start.
If someone already owns a proper fitting expensive gun or can afford to buy one - great….but a Mossberg, Remington, etc.. would be fine.
Lastly, for shotgun - consider adding in lessons from an NSCA/NSSA certified coach for two reasons: 1). They will usually be experienced in teaching beginners. 2). Sometimes Kids listen better to a stranger then “Dad”.
For “Hunting” I think teaching them yourself is the way to go - the time together in the woods or on the water and sharing the learning experience will be fondly remembered forever. The thrill of seeing your Son take their first Duck, Deer, Dove etc.. will get YOUR heart pounding and put a grin on your face that will return - everytime you recall the memory.

And second only to that, the grin in seeing one of the neighbors' or relatives' kids learning/succeeding. Truth is, I would never have learned had it not been for uncles.

 

[steve white]

I'm not saying your advice is wrong (it's not) but my grandson recently broke all the rules. He just turned twelve and decided to check out the trap club with Papa. I first took him to the practice trap range (at that house the ancient thrower is fixed forward). He shot at maybe fifteen targets with my magnum 12 gauge A5 and broke half of them. First time he'd ever shot anything bigger than .22. Quite a jump! Then I wanted to shoot a couple rounds of skeet before it started raining. I stopped at the vehicle on the way over and swapped the A5 for Citori twelve gauge. Usually I only shoot the heavier A5 at the range but once in a while choose to make things interesting with the Citori (which I don't shoot as well). Parker's eyes got big when he saw that fancy gun come out of its cherrywood case: "Papa can I shoot it?" Okay, but skeet isn't easy. At station one he proceeded to break four targets (singles only). Whoa! Didn't keep score but he must have broke half the targets that first round ... including incoming from low house at station eight! That was in June. Now after shooting a couple rounds every week he's already knocking down 20-21 regularly, including doubles. He's getting tall but quite slender. That 12 gauge O/U with 28" barrels is a handful and really jolts the kid but doesn't seem to affect his ability to stay on target. One of the guys we shoot with said I should buy a twenty gauge for Parker. "Why? If he's shooting a twelve gauge this good already, he'll only get better as he grows into it." So much for the "kids size gun first" concept. Or perhaps Parker just has an exceptional coach?

What's the difference between shooting a 20 and just loading a light 12??! (seriously) If some benefactor had bequeathed me with a short 12 English double scarcely 6 lb weight, I would have been profoundly affected, and had a gun to keep for LIFE. Maybe I should really stir the pot with a thread, "the 20 ga. is worthless"....nah, I'm not REALLY a trouble maker, lol.
Good job bringing him up RIGHT!

 

[steve white]

Well if some of you don’t like the cheaper bolt action on the market you will probably hate what me and my brother do.
After the 22rf. The first rifle has been a ar-15
First with a 223 upper the a 350l at least for his boys mine started before the 350L was out.
Light weight adjustable stock.
But we started them very early 3-4 if you count the BB guns

That's it--I'm cutting down the stock on the pellet gun to fit my grand daughter.

 

[Flbt]

That's it--I'm cutting down the stock on the pellet gun to fit my grand daughter.

I got all the kids a red rider as sone as they stared walking.
I have spent many a summer afternoon on the porch working the leaver for them to shoot at a old hog feeder to hear the clang. Really fun times lol

 

[Sabre]

@Sabre

A couple of things about your post. First, I never called out the Ruger American by brand, I was just thinking of all of the stuff on the retail rack at Cabelas. I find them all low quality. Savage, Remington, Browning. I can elaborate if you want the thread to drift into why these are terrible guns.

But drift on back into the Cabelas Gun Library? Yeah, you'll find a German made Mauser 98 that was born as a sporter, not sporterized, in some pedestrian-not-collectible caliber like 8x57 or 30-06 for a pittance. That is tangibly a very good quality gun that no one will "outgrow". (if made new today to the same standards, it would be a $10,000 rifle)

The other comment is obsession with accuracy. I've never found a vintage or antique gun that wouldn't shoot excellently (1.5" groups at 100 yards or better) with minor fussing. Yes, even those with a bit of throat erosion. What the vintage guns do very well is feed/not jam/not break. They also have true dimensions for mounting a scope, a serviceable trigger, and infinite replacement parts that can be had for next to nothing. (springs, followers, etc.)

Your point may be valid that it takes some consumer understanding to find a good value, but the point was about teaching children hunting and that has to start with teaching them the value of a dollar and to make good long-term decisions. Anyone reading this can learn to discern good quality guns and pass that info on to younger people, rather than fall for overhyped marketing and low quality.

I agree with just about everything you said. I would just say that the vast majority of people aren't going to have the knowledge, or take the time to learn the knowledge required to pick a good value out of the gun library of used guns.

For many people, the benefits are there to get a new, accurate, dependable rifle, relatively inexpensively nowadays. My only area of disagreement with you is that those rifles aren't necessarily low quality and they fulfill the intended purpose.

 

[Sabre]

I'm sure your gifting a cheap Ruger that shoots bullets on top of each other is a perfect reflection of who you are.

Are you always this miserable in real life, or do you just save it all for the internet hunting forums?

For whatever reason you, and many others it seems, highly value sub MOA for deer hunting. Personally, super accuracy has never been important to me as a big game hunter. MOA has been more than sufficient for my kind of hunting. Even out to 300 yards I can still put a bullet somewhere in the boiler room (though anything past 200 yards is extremely rare). Considering that most deer hunters now are limited to shooting from tree stands or over bait on tiny parcels of land, 2" MOA is probably sufficient.

You have written multiple accounts of your hunting adventures that indeed indicate accuracy, and even safety, are of little concern to you.

Considering that most deer hunters now are limited to shooting from tree stands or over bait on tiny parcels of land, 2" MOA is probably sufficient.

The thread is about setting up a young "shooter" just getting started. This is not just limited to hunting, or how you hunt deer over bait, other people do actually do other types of hunting and shooting.

While I'm not elegant in appearance, I'm certainly not ugly either. Can't see myself gifting something that is butt ugly. It's true my go to shotguns for the last 20 years are black plastic. But only because I shot the wood to pieces on both of them twice (current A5 and its predecessor 870). If/when I hand them down, they will be returned to wood. Doubtful given the way things are going that the next generations will have an opportunity to wear them out like I did.

You are a constant walking contradiction on this forum. "Plastic is useless ugly junk I would never use and never let anyone I cared about use"; "Both my go-to shotguns for the last 20 years are black plastic".

Yikes.

 

[Flbt]

I agree with just about everything you said. I would just say that the vast majority of people aren't going to have the knowledge, or take the time to learn the knowledge required to pick a good value out of the gun library of used guns.

For many people, the benefits are there to get a new, accurate, dependable rifle, relatively inexpensively nowadays. My only area of disagreement with you is that those rifles aren't necessarily low quality and they fulfill the intended purpose.

When I was a kid the 94 Winchester or 336 was all ways a popular choice mainly depending if you wanted to use a scope or not.
In high school I think they were 150 and 156 and that was a lot of first deer rifles mostly 30-30 some times a 35 and I remember one guy that got a grand father pass down in 32

Also British 303 in military guis and sporting conversations were very popular
I took my first 8pt with a mrk4 that had a scope put on it. I think I have mentioned it before and the nice old man that gave me a lot of surplus ammo with it to learn how to shoot it and clean crosive primers
50$ from what I remember
I wish I still had it but it got sold to buy something else.
I wanted to try so many different calibers
The men I was around helped because they knew my dad did not care. I bought sold and traided all kinds of different guns as a teen.
The only one that I remember that I might have got taken on. ( but maybe not because most around here didn’t know any guns but the normal ones)
But my first 7x57 was a sporter with duble triggers a butter knife handle and a 18-20 in barrel
I swapped in on a 06 that o could scope

 

[RR 314]

I have 3 or 4 friends that started their kids on the Browning Micro-Midas in .22-250 and I followed after their rave reviews. Others disdain .22-250s for deer, but all of our kids did great with them. I killed a bunch of deer in my 20’s with .22 caliber rifles (as many as 15-20 a day), and never lost one/had to track, so I wasn’t fearful of the .22. Leupold straight tubes are great scopes for young kids as they have ample eye relief and limited variable adjustment range.

Here are his first two deer at age 6 and 7. At age 8 or 9 we switched to .260 and at 15 went to 6.5 PRC.

 

[NoStepOnSnek]

I’ve come to find that the AR platform is the best gun for new shooters. Low recoil, ergonomic and modular. Triggers are easily upgraded. Caliber variety allows for a youngin’ to practice with a 22 or 223, and then swap for an upper that is identical other than the barrel being 350 legend or 6.5 grendel

 

[Ontario Hunter]

What's the difference between shooting a 20 and just loading a light 12??! (seriously) If some benefactor had bequeathed me with a short 12 English double scarcely 6 lb weight, I would have been profoundly affected, and had a gun to keep for LIFE. Maybe I should really stir the pot with a thread, "the 20 ga. is worthless"....nah, I'm not REALLY a trouble maker, lol.
Good job bringing him up RIGHT!

Personally, I swing and shoot a heavy shotgun much better than a whippy light one. Seems to work for Parker too. He handles the recoil and weight of the 12 ga O/U well. Stunning actually. Why try to fix what isn't broke? I'm not looking for any excuse to buy another gun. Not a gun collector. Anyway, my brother is giving me his late wife's Savage SxS 20 gauge. Guess we can play with that when I get back from Montana.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Are you always this miserable in real life, or do you just save it all for the internet hunting forums?



You have written multiple accounts of your hunting adventures that indeed indicate accuracy, and even safety, are of little concern to you.



The thread is about setting up a young "shooter" just getting started. This is not just limited to hunting, or how you hunt deer over bait, other people do actually do other types of hunting and shooting.



You are a constant walking contradiction on this forum. "Plastic is useless ugly junk I would never use and never let anyone I cared about use"; "Both my go-to shotguns for the last 20 years are black plastic".

Yikes.

Don't take what I write out of context. Shows a serious lack of maturity.

 

[Sabre]

Don't take what I write out of context. Shows a serious lack of maturity.

Sure thing, bud.

 

[Ray B]

Starting in 1987 as a Wa State Hunter Education instructor I used my first "big" rifle for gun handling and live fire by my students. the rifle is a Rem 700 ADL mfg 1962 in 308Win. The stock was trimmed down to fit me at age 14 ( I was small for my age) so most of the students age 10-16 or so have no trouble with it. Also I'd load cast bullets 170 grain with a charge of SR4759 to get a velocity of 1700 fps. Using it accomplished a few things:1. the student got to shoot a "big" rifle that came close to fitting them; 2. was reasonably high quality (for it's price range) 3. they got to experience "recoil" more akin to a real cartridge (not a 223) and 4. they saw the educational and real benefits of handloading.
Unfortunately, the lawyers of the state have banned the firing of personal guns and the use of non-factory ammo not provided by the state. So now the students shoot a full size Savage 110 223- if the instructor has a live fire day- which most no longer do, due to the documentation hassles. In the day I did have several parents thank me for providing examples of better guns.

 

[HankBuck]

Luckily I stoped at 6’6” now the bad thing is o am to close to the 500lbs from not walking much for years with multiple broken legs.
I do have multiple family members from 6’2” to 6’9”
And the strange thing 3 of the 6’2” were girl cousins lol

@Flbt - guessing that in School—-No one “picked on You”

 

[Flbt]

@Flbt - guessing that in School—-No one “picked on You”

No not really. But besides the size I broke show steers and horses at home
So was never really worried about people.
I mean you get ran over by a 1000 lbs steer what’s a person going to do to you or bit by a stud in a bad mood.