Proposed BATF ban on privately made weapons - Gun Grab Forthcoming

rookhawk

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The BATF has proposed regulations to restrict and control 80% finished receivers, but the rules will be an effective seizure of weapons without compensation or due process. The biggest wrinkle in the proposed rules are that everyone that owns a weapon that is not serialized will have 60 days to get an FFL to etch or engrave prescribed serial numbers and will report that info to the BATF. Further, it will require an additional background check.

There are very, very few companies in America that do laser engraving of serial numbers on firearms today. Today, those companies only do such engraving BEFORE the components are finished to the level required to be considered a Firearm. They do this so they are not required to be Federally Licensed Gunsmiths under FFL rules. To become an FFL takes months, sometimes years, and requires the consent of your town's Chief Law Enforcement Officer. The net result is that every citizen with such a gun will have 60 days to find a FFL that does engraving of serial numbers and will have to pay whatever fees are required to get their personally made firearms marked, otherwise they will be required to surrender their weapons.

This is a truly dangerous gun-grab as the legislation will be impossible for most to comply with making the owners Felons or deprived of their property in the process.

It doesn't stop with AR-15s and Glocks my friends, it means every gun custom built by an individual, not for resale, for personal use since 1968 is now subject to seizure if the owner cannot get it engraved by an FFL serial number engraver within 60 days of this rule taking effect. Good luck finding that! Most people that wanted to put their name and a serial number on their guns voluntarily before it was required by law struggled to find anyone to do it within a year and any of those that did so still aren't legal because the serial numbers applied will not be valid under the new rules.


 

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Aren’t they also trying to push that anything that is a critical step in the buildup also required to have an SN (i.e. uppers, slides, bcgs, etc.), or is that not being pushed yet?
Correct. But really the essence is that the AR lower and Upper are both receivers. The serialization of the Upper isn't in the rules as far as I can tell.

However, the serialization of 80% guns prior to manufacture will be a requirement moving forward. Thus, if you buy a billet, it needs a background check and a serial number. Can you imagine? Where are these 15 billets? Yeah, bad day at the workshop, 9 of them were destroyed due to an error in the CNC so they've been discarded.
 
Or one can just ignore this BS. Go about your business and keep ones nose clean. While I dont agree with their new edict, in and of itself its sort of Meh. Since 1968 all newly made guns have to have a SN and its never been a problem.
So home made guns have been exempt for a time, and now no longer. So you have 2 choices, comply or ignore.
In reality taking the lower to an FFL and having him do an electro pencil SN on it is just not that big a deal. How many non SN guns do most guys have? I dont have any, nor plan to.
I dont see it as an effective seizure of anything. They dont know you have it, how is it going to be seized? Going door to door isnt here yet and wont be for the foreseeable future.
So like I said, comply or ignore. Compliance really doesnt amount to much here. I can think of a lot of other things they could do that would be much more invasive and onerous.
Joe and the demtards would like to do a hell of lot more than this I promise you.
 
There's a jewlery shop around the corner from me who also has an FFL. Twenty bucks and he'll engrave anything you want on the barrel, or 80% receiver.

Like the Volstead Act did with booze, this will create a cottage industry in 3D printed guns and I guarantee in the big cities there are smart people buying those machines now in anticipation of the rule.
The feds will be busting printing houses instead of stills. Almost too funny how naive and ignorant of history's lessons some people can be

Those that refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
 
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Or one can just ignore this BS. Go about your business and keep ones nose clean. While I dont agree with their new edict, in and of itself its sort of Meh. Since 1968 all newly made guns have to have a SN and its never been a problem.
So home made guns have been exempt for a time, and now no longer. So you have 2 choices, comply or ignore.
In reality taking the lower to an FFL and having him do an electro pencil SN on it is just not that big a deal. How many non SN guns do most guys have? I dont have any, nor plan to.
I dont see it as an effective seizure of anything. They dont know you have it, how is it going to be seized? Going door to door isnt here yet and wont be for the foreseeable future.
So like I said, comply or ignore. Compliance really doesnt amount to much here. I can think of a lot of other things they could do that would be much more invasive and onerous.
Joe and the demtards would like to do a hell of lot more than this I promise you.
Well put sir!!!!
 
Molan Labe’ which I believe translates in Latin to I hope that shit is so hot when you pick up my gun that it burns your fingers you commie prick. Or something like that.
 
All this makes me want to go buy half dozen or so of these 80% kits, just so I can ignore the letter boys in dc.
Anybody else see a court challenge ahead?
 
I will neither confirm nor deny that I might have been tempted or not tempted to pay cash to obtain or not obtain a Polymer80 kit this past weekend at the gun show. I will say I talked to dealers who said they were selling a lot of them.
 
All this makes me want to go buy half dozen or so of these 80% kits, just so I can ignore the letter boys in dc.
Anybody else see a court challenge ahead?
Yes, just like the stupid bump stock ban. Guys turned them in or hid them and now what? The courts are ruling it was illegal to ban them in that way, having ATF do it. Same thing here. Its going to require Congress to do it, and despite all their big talk, they havent done jack, though its early yet.
If the guys that had bump stocks had just kept them home for a while they could still have them, but some ran scared and turned them in and got shit for them.
So if concerned about the SN thing, either get a SN for them which isnt that big a deal or just stay quiet and wait it out.
 
All this makes me want to go buy half dozen or so of these 80% kits, just so I can ignore the letter boys in dc.
Anybody else see a court challenge ahead?
You know as well as I do living in Colorado, that the 57 out of 64 Sheriffs' that have refused to enforce the previous bullshit gun laws recently passed in Colorado WILL NOT enforce an unconstitutional federal gun control mandate through "executive orders" NOT passed by Congress. Just as with our out of control immigration issue, the feds will have to attempt to enforce the orders issued by Sleepy China Joe, until the Courts strike them down.
 
There's a jewlery shop around the corner from me who also has an FFL. Twenty bucks and he'll engrave anything you want on the barrel, or 80% receiver.

Like the Volstead Act did with booze, this will create a cottage industry in 3D printed guns and I guarantee in the big cities there are smart people buying those machines now in anticipation of the rule.
The feds will be busting printing houses instead of stills. Almost too funny how naive and ignorant of history's lessons some people can be

Those that refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

And those of us who did learn the lessons of history are doomed to watch the rest of the morons repeat the same mistakes.
 
I’m actually surprised by the responses. Two more snippets to consider:

1.) Your easy engraving option isn’t really the case. You need to go to an FFL engraver, a new type of FFL classification. Those don’t exist yet. The engraving has to be laser to be practical, but those lasers are $8000. The Reason is, the FFL must mark the serial number as their FFL number and a 6 digit suffix. Plus city, state. Plus name of FFL. Plus caliber. Plus rifle or pistol. Basically, about 50 to 80 characters at least 5 thousandths deep. My engraving guy is pretty reasonable For hand engraving, $3 per character, but he isn’t an FFL for these purposes. It’s a much bigger problem to get these engraved and registered in their 4473 bound book that many understand.

2.) If you don’t do process above within 60 days of the passing of the rule, you’re charged with one of the most serious gun crimes in America. The crime committed would be tax evasion by violating the Gun Control Act by manufacturing a weapon without a license. That’s the same prosecution charge they use to go after possession of SBRs, AOWs, Silencers, and Machine Guns. It’s not a trivial matter, it will overnight make about ten million citizens into felons with 10 year minimum sentences if prosecuted.
 
Well then the only other option is lay low till the courts sort it out, like with the bump stock ban. Not complying may make one a de-facto felon but so what?
Who is going to know if there is no way to trace it right? Or sell it now if that concerned.
If its as complicated and expensive as all that to SN it, I would bet the courts will have a say in it. Either way it will be challenged and like many things that get challenged, it will be on hold for a time while it gets sorted.
 
Guys blowing this off MIGHT be okay, I stress might.

Have ya'll forgotten the raids at some of the 80% companies not long ago? You paid with something, that something was logged into their system. That my friends was a test run. They knocked on people's doors that bought products from those companies.

I know a good many of you don't care for the black guns. I get it, don't make the mistake just because it doesn't effect you now means it won't later. The ball is rolling and it's not pretty. A lot and I mean a lot of people have no problem with disarming Americans. Don't believe ask all our brothers that are on this site that live in other countries.

This should infuriate every American that reads this proposed plan. Most will say it doesn't matter to me I don't have that...then when they come for what you do have it will be to late.
 
Yes, just like the stupid bump stock ban. Guys turned them in or hid them and now what? The courts are ruling it was illegal to ban them in that way, having ATF do it. Same thing here. Its going to require Congress to do it, and despite all their big talk, they havent done jack, though its early yet.
If the guys that had bump stocks had just kept them home for a while they could still have them, but some ran scared and turned them in and got shit for them.
So if concerned about the SN thing, either get a SN for them which isnt that big a deal or just stay quiet and wait it out.
Very, very few have been turned in as I understand it. And as @CoElkHunter pointed out, here in Colorado, as well as in most states that don't border an ocean, many sheriffs and other LEOs are stating publicly that unconstitutional edicts pushed out by this administration will not be enforced.

Guys blowing this off MIGHT be okay, I stress might.

Have ya'll forgotten the raids at some of the 80% companies not long ago? You paid with something, that something was logged into their system. That my friends was a test run. They knocked on people's doors that bought products from those companies.

I know a good many of you don't care for the black guns. I get it, don't make the mistake just because it doesn't effect you now means it won't later. The ball is rolling and it's not pretty. A lot and I mean a lot of people have no problem with disarming Americans. Don't believe ask all our brothers that are on this site that live in other countries.

This should infuriate every American that reads this proposed plan. Most will say it doesn't matter to me I don't have that...then when they come for what you do have it will be to late.
This is absolutely the case. Just because these ugly plastic peashooters aren't my cup of tea doesn't mean I should ignore or accept the movement to ban or confiscate them. Divide and conquer. Demonize an inert piece of metal so the uninformed public doesn't squawk too loud when they outlaw them. Ask those in Australia, Canada, and England how well ignoring it "because it didn't effect them" went.
It has been good to see the volume of new gun owners skyrocket as more and more people realize they are responsible for protecting themselves. And these ugly, evil, black (stereotype) guns are really good for that purpose. It has created some strange bedfellows as many of them are quite progressive in so many other areas, yet they are beginning to learn why private gun ownership is vital to this republic.

Speaking of stuff that used to be available, but the letter brigade has managed to get pulled from the market; back in the nineties there were a couple companies selling "rainy day kits". A complete Sten, just needed to mill a few holes and a slot. Wonder how many of those have been completed in recent times?
 
Guys blowing this off MIGHT be okay, I stress might.

Have ya'll forgotten the raids at some of the 80% companies not long ago? You paid with something, that something was logged into their system. That my friends was a test run. They knocked on people's doors that bought products from those companies.

I know a good many of you don't care for the black guns. I get it, don't make the mistake just because it doesn't effect you now means it won't later. The ball is rolling and it's not pretty. A lot and I mean a lot of people have no problem with disarming Americans. Don't believe ask all our brothers that are on this site that live in other countries.

This should infuriate every American that reads this proposed plan. Most will say it doesn't matter to me I don't have that...then when they come for what you do have it will be to late.
Oh puhlease, you're not going to go into that tired old cliche about "when they came for my shotgun no one was left" I hope.
Lets not get carried away here, this isnt about black guns, I like and own several and they are not in question here with this SN thing, they already have one like all guns made since 1968.
This is about making guns at home with no SN.
The same tired argument was used on the bump stock ban, look what happened. Nothing, the court has tossed it out, at least for now, probably/maybe get a SCOTUS review, who knows, for now its dead. Bump stocks are essentially legal for those who own one. I think that ban was stupid, just like this one, but it isnt law yet and if it becomes law, good chance it wont survive either.
So just sayin', before we start calling each other Fudds and whatnot, take a deep breath and look at the whole picture.
Going to be a lot of poking holes in the air with lots of fingers, but in the end it wont matter, what will be will be.
I doubt like hell this is the turning point on which our fellow citizens take up arms, in fact I guarantee it.
Write letters and send emails to your reps, send a check to GOA or whatever and hope for the best.
 

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