Politics

You have engaged in this conversation in both a civil and meaningful manner so of course I will not ignore your comments.

We will have to disagree on god and abortion for now. With regard to his past behavior, I find it important to examine his actions, as it is at least somewhat indicative of his moral compass. With that said, there is nothing that shows me that personal moral failings mean that a person cannot be an effective leader. The point I am trying to emphasize is that there are plenty of solidly conservative politicians who live upstanding moral lives and would be far better representation of American values than Trump. Furthermore, I find it extremely difficult to simply brush aside his own admissions of sexual assault, the degrading ways he has talked about women, his utterly repugnant and often flat-out wrong tweets, and his puerile approach to the office of the presidency.

See I can't put God and abortion aside because for me that would be two of the biggest issues I'd vote on with regards to domestic matters. To me abortion is murder, plain and simple. Other's have grey areas on this, I don't... be that as it may. Furthermore, advancing the faith and protecting Christians worldwide is vital for western civilisation. Christian - Jewish morals are what the west is based on. I can bet my bottom dollar that the Dems won't protect those values. I agree there are some more presidential members but would they have the freedom/balls to do what he has done. They would all be in someone's pocket. Trump self funded his campaign and therefore owed nobody.

He has certainly kept some promises, namely lowering corporate taxes, which I consider to be the highlight of his presidency. However, his failures are the direct result of either not making the necessary compromises to pass legislation or the wholly unacceptable attempts to shirk processes, which has resulted in many of his directives being stymied. His all-or-nothing approach to governance has continued legislative gridlock and worked against his own agenda.

You are right in some respects he is inflexible and could have accomplished more, but also sometimes there are certain things one shouldn't bend on. I would say the gridlock is LARGELY due to the swamp nit picking or being downright obstructive.

From what I have seen, Trump has courted Saudi Arabia, Russia, and North Korea as allies. THESE are not the allies we want. I agree with Trump that we need to demand more from our European allies as far as defense spending is concerned. However, the real threats we face are from China, Russia, and Iran. We need an international coalition to properly deal with these countries, and that is impossible when Trump does not even try to build such coalitions.

The difference is that he is not courting these countries to instil THEIR government principals in the US but rather to advance democracy in THEM... The Dems want to do it the other way around. They love the romantic notion of socialism. As for him not trying to build coalitions, why would the so called allies want a change to the status quo? They are happy to take take take. They get the US protection and it is largely for free. Like I said, they know where their bread is buttered. So Donald lighting a fire under their butts will not change their allegiance.

Once again, we will have to disagree on this. What you see as democrats promoting division, I see as democrats attempting to deliver on their promises of social justice and inclusion. I see Trump's failure to show any compassion whatsoever for those who are victims of violence, racism, and oppression as far more divisive. If after the George Floyd killing, he had spoken to the pain that many communities were feeling and vowed to both protect the 1st Amendment rights of peaceful protesters, deliver substantial reforms, and maintain peaceful conditions in cities, he would not be in his current position.

But this is simply not the case. They use race and other dividers to divide. You are fast becoming a nation not of Americans but a nation groups. One group hates the other or loves one but not the other. Instead of one nation of Americans that is diverse. Social justice? You guys in the US simply don't know how great you have it. It is probably the most socially just country on the planet. Is it perfect? No. Can it ever be? No. How far do you want to go down the social justice road? Even poor old Columbus is a target. Every mini group wants compensation or preferential treatment for some perceive injustice even if it was 450 years ago. This is what you get when identity politics rules... groups of spineless whiners. Stand together and say Shit happens lets move on.

As for racism, Trump has repeatedly denounced racists, banned some of them, has introduced policies to address racism, legislation to help give minorities a start in life. The Dems pull out the race card every 4 years and then use the 4 years to bugger it all up.


Some of the policies that I hold dear are guns, personal freedoms, healthcare, women's rights, taxes, Israel, justice reform, government spending, the environment, and countering Russia/China/Iran/Saudi Arabia. As you can see, I am pretty evenly split down the middle, which means I have to look at which policies I believe are most easily threatened by a Biden presidency vs a Trump presidency. Obviously, my calculations change based on the candidates. For instance, I would vote for Trump over Sanders because I believe that Sanders is a bigger threat to my policy views than Trump.

I can agree with 90% of your list there. Women's rights I'm all for with the exception of abortion. And I can GUARANTEE you the Dems will not support Israel as Donald does. As stated earlier he is the better option (from what I can see) to counter Russia/China/Iran/Saudi.
 
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The so called "progressive" politicians have proven without any shadow of a doubt their method of governing has been an abysmal failure. They keep getting more "progressive" and their legislative entities continue to suffer from ever increasing crime, gun violence, drug use, high taxes and now anarchy. You just can't fix stupid.
 
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And now the appeasers in Orange County have voted to re-name the airport, because John Wayne was a racist.
 
If White Privilege is such great advantage to all white people in the the US,why do all prominent people who have one white parent and one black parent self identify as BLACK??? Maybe Barack can answer this question?
 
Trump shared a video of one of his supporters saying "white power." He did not take it down until Sen. Tim Scott asked him to. If this does not give you pause when voting for Trump, nothing will. As Americans, we have to do better and stand firmly against this racism.
 
Trump shared a video of one of his supporters saying "white power." He did not take it down until Sen. Tim Scott asked him to. If this does not give you pause when voting for Trump, nothing will. As Americans, we have to do better and stand firmly against this racism.

I am against the racism shown by all sides....and they all exhibit racial bias in some form or another.

Anyone who won't vote for Trump because of this, but will vote for Biden despite all his obvious racism, is being selectively outraged, I think.

So for me, it comes down to babies and guns.

Clear choice for me.

Everyone has to decide which issues differentiate the candidates.

Racism, as commonly defined, does not differentiate them, in my mind.
 
And anyone that doesn't think Russian, Chinese and North Korean operatives are not deep in to the riots, looting and protests, fanning the flames of racism, is naive or delusional.
 
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I am against the racism shown by all sides....and they all exhibit racial bias in some form or another.

Anyone who won't vote for Trump because of this, but will vote for Biden despite all his obvious racism, is being selectively outraged, I think.

So for me, it comes down to babies and guns.

Clear choice for me.

Everyone has to decide which issues differentiate the candidates.

Racism, as commonly defined, does not differentiate them, in my mind.

There is no comparison between Biden's racist gaffs and tweeting support for white power. None. Trump is making it abundantly clear that he is a racist. There is no dancing around that now.

And anyone that doesn't think Russian, Chinese and North Korean operatives are not deep in to the riots, looting and protests, fanning the flames of racism, is naive or delusional.

Russia and China, probably. North Korea, I doubt they have the reach. We give them far too much credit.
 
Trump shared a video of one of his supporters saying "white power." He did not take it down until Sen. Tim Scott asked him to. If this does not give you pause when voting for Trump, nothing will. As Americans, we have to do better and stand firmly against this racism.

There is no comparison between Biden's racist gaffs and tweeting support for white power. None. Trump is making it abundantly clear that he is a racist. There is no dancing around that now.

Oh, come on Saul. Seriously?
In an election year, when both parties are trying to win over black voters, especially in battelground states that may play the key role in this presidential election, you really believe Trump is intentionally and knowingly tweeting out white power videos?
Have you seen the video? Some dude yells white power and now there is proof positive that Trump is a racist?
I find it much more plausible that it was in fact an unseen oversight than an overtly racist message. How often do we see social media gaffes? Trump may occasionally have foot-in-mouth disease, but do you really think he is that stupid?
Take a breath and think about it. Continuing to push the leftist party line is just you re-tweeting (socialist/marxist) propaganda.
There, see how easy it is to spin something posted on social media?
 
He shouldnt have tweeted the video without really watching it first. He knows everyone is picking apart everything he does and he should come out and tell that guy to shut up.

But since we are talking about racism. I pretty sure Joe Bidens gaff below is worse. There is no mistake about how he feels about black people and it is directly his words.

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1895156_1894977_1644536,00.html

And this is where I feel true racism is today in America, real racism is quiet and it is coming from someone with a smiling face.
 
Oh, come on Saul. Seriously?
In an election year, when both parties are trying to win over black voters, especially in battelground states that may play the key role in this presidential election, you really believe Trump is intentionally and knowingly tweeting out white power videos?
Have you seen the video? Some dude yells white power and now there is proof positive that Trump is a racist?
I find it much more plausible that it was in fact an unseen oversight than an overtly racist message. How often do we see social media gaffes? Trump may occasionally have foot-in-mouth disease, but do you really think he is that stupid?
Take a breath and think about it. Continuing to push the leftist party line is just you re-tweeting (socialist/marxist) propaganda.
There, see how easy it is to spin something posted on social media?

Certainly could be a possibility. I would not put it passed an inattentive staffer. Yet where is is Trump's strong condemnation of the tweet and of white power? Why must the sole black republican senator speak out for him to take it down? What I see is an intentional dog whistle to a certain segment of his base. He knows that he is not going to win any black support against Biden so his best chance will be to fire up more support from certain white voters instead.

Regardless, can we all just forget the whataboutism that runs rampant in politics today? Enough of the "Biden said this" or "Trump said that" garbage when faced with abhorrent behavior from anyone. I will be the first to hold anyone to account for their words and actions. I expect others to do the same. You may decide that you will still vote for Trump for whatever reason, and that is your prerogative, but do not let him forget that his supporters will still hold him to a high standard if he is to earn their votes. We are all to eager to give a free pass to our own side.

On a side note, it seems that I do not have a place left in this world. Gone are they days when gentleman could hold civil discussion of policy without name calling. If we are to have any hope of survival as a nation, we must resist every attempt to divide us, to make our neighbors the enemy. People were not "alt-right fascists" or "leftist marxists" or whatever other name you want to use. We were all Americans. We may hold differing views in how we want to solve the problems facing the nation, but we recognize the humanity in one other. When faced with uncomfortable realities, we all too often retreat into our respective camps. Right vs Left. If we could just sit down and talk, forget the political labels, we would see that we are all so alike in what we want for this nation. I have tried to do my part on here to approach every discussion with civility, to avoid name-calling, and to appeal to reason, and I appreciate that many have done the same. Still, that is not the trend in political discourse. Ultimately, a man must have a guiding set of principles and vote his conscience.
 
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Certainly could be a possibility. I would not put it passed an inattentive staffer. Yet where is is Trump's strong condemnation of the tweet and of white power? Why must the sole black republican senator speak out for him to take it down? What I see is an intentional dog whistle to a certain segment of his base. He knows that he is not going to win any black support against Biden so his best chance will be to fire up more support from certain white voters instead.

On a side note,it seems that I do not have a place left in this world. Gone are they days when gentleman could hold civil discussion of policy without name calling. If we are to have any hope of survival as a nation, we must resist every attempt to divide us, to make our neighbors the enemy. People were not "alt-right fascists" or "leftist marxists" or whatever other name you want to use. We were all Americans. We may hold differing views in how we want to solve the problems facing the nation, but we recognize the humanity in one other. When faced with uncomfortable realities, we all too often retreat into our respective camps. Right vs Left. If we could just sit down and talk, forget the political labels, we would see that we are all so alike in what we want for this nation. I have tried to do my part on here to approach every discussion with civility, to avoid name-calling, and to appeal to reason, and I appreciate that many have done the same. Still, that is not the trend in political discourse. Ultimately, a man must have a guiding set of principles and vote his conscience.
The last Blue Dog Democrat was run out of the national party almost a decade ago. That means domestic politics now does extend beyond our shores - it has so in spades since '16. Moreover, I am not sure we are "all Americans" any longer. I feel no sense of shared purpose with any ignorant child who believes that the men like Jefferson and Washington created a failed country based upon "white privilege or superiority." Instead, what we have allowed to happen is the emergence of a failed, ignorant and fundamentally uneducated generation. In no other place in the world, including anywhere in Western Europe could anyone, regardless of race or place of birth find greater opportunity than here. Yet the MSM, the Democrat party, and every desperate CEO in the country is pandering to a mob that could only be found in the "Lord of the Flies" just a decade ago. I watched a young black woman being interviewed in Seattle asserting she was an African woman "forced" to live in the US. I would love to drop her into Beira Mozambique for a couple of weeks to see how all that oneness with the continent works out.

The most laughable thing, is the notion that whites now represent a "minority". That assumes anyone other than Anglo Saxons are on board with the BLM mob. Really? Ask an Asian what they think about this madness. If you think the average Hispanic is on board with BLM's goals then you haven't met one. Eventually a politician will emerge who understands the potential of that new coalition. It will be interesting to see if he emerges from the the GOP or is an independent. I can't imagine he or she will be a Democrat with their total focus on grievance rather than opportunity.
 
I think the issue is Dems see Biden as a moderate.. and therefore the moderate dems may turn out in large numbers to support him..
 

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