Politics

[WAB]

I was actually thinking of Saul recently due to Frostbite’s comments. I know he was concerned about the rise of anti Semitic and anti Zionist feelings among the political left.

Unfortunately I haven’t seen him post since early this year.

He is definitely missed. Although we had differing political views, he presented intelligent, well thought out points. This leads to interesting discussions that really help you understand different points of view.

My participation here is greatly reduced because we are becoming an echo chamber. This happens by shouting down members like Saul. I see very little value in an echo chamber.

 

[Brent in Az]

I don’t think so, he took his leave shortly after Trump won the election.

He'll be back next election.....

 

[Frostbite]

My participation here is greatly reduced because we are becoming an echo chamber. This happens by shouting down members like Saul. I see very little value in an echo chamber.

Becoming?

So you had ONE guy named Saul who wasn't a rabid far right idealogue and you drove him off and now you have me who you are doing your best to drive off.

Sounds like this place has been a right wing echo chamber for a long, long time.

Any political forum should be a place with Liberal, Conservative and Moderate ideas posted, shared and debated.

The reason people might leave this political thread is because anything other than right wing views are greeted with hostility, insults, lies, obscenities and threats.

It's like there is sheer and immediate terror when right wing views are challenged........and chaos ensues.

The rest of Africa Hunting Forum has greeted me with respect and acted like adults.

So it goes.

 

[Frostbite]

It wasn't fake.

Trump lies again.

At a time when most Americans are wishing Trump would become MORE LIKE Reagan..........Trump is hiding from Reagan's wisdom.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/10/24/business/ronald-reagan-ad-trump-canada-ontario-tariffs

 

[Mountainshadows]

With some of my best friends here owning and operating ranches, and I help out quite often on those ranches, I will say that they are quite happy with the beef prices as they are. The packers have controlled that market for years with the producer getting a pittance for his product. What we have now is a combination of things that have caused the prices to soar. First, we have the lowest cattle population in the US since the 1950's. This is brought about by a lot of large outfits selling off (children/grandchildren inherit and don't want to do the work and just want the money). Cities are spreading out and taking over large swathes of agriculture land. Drought affects some of this in areas but that is area specific.

Argentina currently imports about 2% of the beef market in the US. A slight rise in this is not going to hurt the US market as Mexican beef imports have been drastically reduced due to the New World Screw Worm. It will take years for the beef industry to get built back up again here in the US.
The packers I'm sure have stepped up their lobbying money because their profit margins are not as high as they used to be. I believe this is why Trump has started speaking about the beef market although I think his perspective is from one side and he hasn't been given the other side of the story here.

I do not know of one rancher/and or farmer in my area who does not like Trump. That last should be for any bots that feel the need to expound on how smart they are with no actual experience of things.

 

[mdwest]

Im definitely not a rancher, and know next to nothing about cattle, cattle futures, etc..etc..

but.. one of my closest friends has a medium sized cattle operation in western Virginia (not west virginia).. and while he is growing tired of the market conditions constantly changing because of government involvement, etc.. he is very happy with current prices and his ability to make money with his ranch... he is having no problem selling as much as he has available.. and all at top dollar..

 

[deewayne2003]

With some of my best friends here owning and operating ranches, and I help out quite often on those ranches, I will say that they are quite happy with the beef prices as they are. The packers have controlled that market for years with the producer getting a pittance for his product. What we have now is a combination of things that have caused the prices to soar. First, we have the lowest cattle population in the US since the 1950's. This is brought about by a lot of large outfits selling off (children/grandchildren inherit and don't want to do the work and just want the money). Cities are spreading out and taking over large swathes of agriculture land. Drought affects some of this in areas but that is area specific.

Argentina currently imports about 2% of the beef market in the US. A slight rise in this is not going to hurt the US market as Mexican beef imports have been drastically reduced due to the New World Screw Worm. It will take years for the beef industry to get built back up again here in the US.
The packers I'm sure have stepped up their lobbying money because their profit margins are not as high as they used to be. I believe this is why Trump has started speaking about the beef market although I think his perspective is from one side and he hasn't been given the other side of the story here.

I do not know of one rancher/and or farmer in my area who does not like Trump. That last should be for any bots that feel the need to expound on how smart they are with no actual experience of things.

Thank you for bringing up pertinent facts about the beef markets.

Another factor rarely mentioned is that some states are trying to regulate the cattle industry out of existence - Colorado for example requires a vet to perform any penetrative examination.

So if you want to check pregnancy or artificially inseminate you must call the vet and pay the bill.... corporate ranches have a vet on staff so it's not a big deal, but for smaller producers that's a big cost increase.

Argentina imports are no threat to Americas beef industry, just like Turkey is no threat to the USA chicken/egg industry...... I mention this because opening egg imports from Turkey and other countries is how Trump got USA egg prices to drop drastically.

 

[Frostbite]

With some of my best friends here owning and operating ranches, and I help out quite often on those ranches, I will say that they are quite happy with the beef prices as they are. The packers have controlled that market for years with the producer getting a pittance for his product. What we have now is a combination of things that have caused the prices to soar. First, we have the lowest cattle population in the US since the 1950's. This is brought about by a lot of large outfits selling off (children/grandchildren inherit and don't want to do the work and just want the money). Cities are spreading out and taking over large swathes of agriculture land. Drought affects some of this in areas but that is area specific.

Argentina currently imports about 2% of the beef market in the US. A slight rise in this is not going to hurt the US market as Mexican beef imports have been drastically reduced due to the New World Screw Worm. It will take years for the beef industry to get built back up again here in the US.
The packers I'm sure have stepped up their lobbying money because their profit margins are not as high as they used to be. I believe this is why Trump has started speaking about the beef market although I think his perspective is from one side and he hasn't been given the other side of the story here.

I do not know of one rancher/and or farmer in my area who does not like Trump. That last should be for any bots that feel the need to expound on how smart they are with no actual experience of things.

I agree that a little more beef from Argentina won't mean much.

You might also note that American beef numbers are down partially because we have gradually bred bigger and better beef cattle.

We now get more meat from every animal and it's higher quality so sell more and better beef from fewer cattle.

Prices are up partially because Americans love beef and are willing to pay higher prices for the higher quality product.

Trump's actions are not going to impact ranchers much but they never want to see more foreign beef as a matter of principle.

 

[RLD]

He is definitely missed. Although we had differing political views, he presented intelligent, well thought out points. This leads to interesting discussions that really help you understand different points of view.

My participation here is greatly reduced because we are becoming an echo chamber. This happens by shouting down members like Saul. I see very little value in an echo chamber.

Amen.

 

[Red Leg]

These are the sorts of comments from buffoons, left and right, that are causing such damage to the country.

Exhibit one is the DNC chair who with a serious expression on his face states:

"Our job is to win, to win elections. That is our role. That is our responsibility, and where I have to put my attention and focus, Jason, is on those pieces.”

He added, “If we reach that break the glass moment when all of our democratic institutions have failed us, right? And we are truly in a dictatorship and an authoritarian regime here has completely shredded the Constitution, then party doesn’t matter, and then elections don’t matter and then the resistance looks completely different."

Of course he is careful to never to actually say there is a "dictatorship" because he clearly understands there isn't one - but the implication is good politics and why worry about a few unstable armed morons determined to save the republic from "fascism."

https://www.breitbart.com/clips/202...er-and-resistance-looks-completely-different/

On the right, we have the ever thought provoking and morbidly obese Steve Bannon confidently talking about Trump's third term. Nothing like a little accelerant to add to the non-critical thinking left's collective meltdown.

Both hard core bases are being led around by their collective noses.

 

[deewayne2003]

I think lots of the disconnect from reality is the elder statesmen of our society had been trained to believe main stream media as the gospel of what is actually happening.

The constant intake of "the sky is falling" news put forth by the MSM has led to severe cognitive dissonance amongst the elderly population that desperately want to believe they are as virtuous as they portrayed themselves in their youth.

 

[mdwest]

Yep… the lunatic fringe on both sides, that only represent a very small fraction of the population, have the loudest voices…

The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

 

[cwpayton]

With some of my best friends here owning and operating ranches, and I help out quite often on those ranches, I will say that they are quite happy with the beef prices as they are. The packers have controlled that market for years with the producer getting a pittance for his product. What we have now is a combination of things that have caused the prices to soar. First, we have the lowest cattle population in the US since the 1950's. This is brought about by a lot of large outfits selling off (children/grandchildren inherit and don't want to do the work and just want the money). Cities are spreading out and taking over large swathes of agriculture land. Drought affects some of this in areas but that is area specific.

Argentina currently imports about 2% of the beef market in the US. A slight rise in this is not going to hurt the US market as Mexican beef imports have been drastically reduced due to the New World Screw Worm. It will take years for the beef industry to get built back up again here in the US.
The packers I'm sure have stepped up their lobbying money because their profit margins are not as high as they used to be. I believe this is why Trump has started speaking about the beef market although I think his perspective is from one side and he hasn't been given the other side of the story here.

I do not know of one rancher/and or farmer in my area who does not like Trump. That last should be for any bots that feel the need to expound on how smart they are with no actual experience of things.

Well said, the situation as I see it is cattle market was so low for so long that people expected low beef prices, heck I remember when light calves [ 3-4 weight

] hit 2.00$ about 6 yrs ago. Gold has more than doubled ,silver also [apples to oranges?]so beef up at 25% is not crazy. I had a friend complaining about grocery prices a year ago , I told him groceries were a bargain at any price here in America, if you dont believe it just go without food for 3 days then tell me hamburger is too high.
Blaming the packers for low prices is correct prior to the upswing.
The ultimate threat to ranches is spitting them up as 10-40 acre Horse properties or rec. properties , as you said the children dont want to work on a ranch because they saw the struggles of the parents and said not me so the buy outs were a $$ option right now. But living in town and working a key board is not nearly as satisfying.. see attached.

 

[wesheltonj]

I know enough about cattle as I don’t want to own them. My neighbor runs his cattle on my property and I get the Ag exemption. Running a cow calf operation is a full time PITA.

 

[Mountainshadows]

Well said, the situation as I see it is cattle market was so low for so long that people expected low beef prices, heck I remember when light calves [ 3-4 weightView attachment 722145] hit 2.00$ about 6 yrs ago. Gold has more than doubled ,silver also [apples to oranges?]so beef up at 25% is not crazy. I had a friend complaining about grocery prices a year ago , I told him groceries were a bargain at any price here in America, if you dont believe it just go without food for 3 days then tell me hamburger is too high.
Blaming the packers for low prices is correct prior to the upswing.
The ultimate threat to ranches is spitting them up as 10-40 acre Horse properties or rec. properties , as you said the children dont want to work on a ranch because they saw the struggles of the parents and said not me so the buy outs were a $$ option right now. But living in town and working a key board is not nearly as satisfying.. see attached.

I completely agree. The little ranchettes are everywhere anymore, and they don't raise cattle. One of my friends sold some calves at a sale yesterday. 6 wt. bringing 4.35. For those that don't understand, that's a 600 pound calf selling for $2610.

 

[Mountainshadows]

I know enough about cattle as I don’t want to own them. My neighbor runs his cattle on my property and I get the Ag exemption. Running a cow calf operation is a full time PITA.

It's a lifestyle and most people were born into it. I don't know any of my rancher/farmer friends that want to run a bank for a living and neither would I. At times yes, PITA, but I think most jobs have those moments.
The thing is, keeping traditions is also what has been feeding the country. Unfortunately I've watched several large places get sold around here. One of them has already been split in half and the other two were bought by out of staters just for hunting. No cattle on those two anymore.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

I completely agree. The little ranchettes are everywhere anymore, and they don't raise cattle. One of my friends sold some calves at a sale yesterday. 6 wt. bringing 4.35. For those that don't understand, that's a 600 pound calf selling for $2610.

And for those of us with LESS than no knowledge of cattle... is that a good price?

My "knowledge" of cattle is beef prices at our local AC (Alaska Commercial) store in my remote bush community in Alaska.

 

[Mountainshadows]

And for those of us with LESS than no knowledge of cattle... is that a good price?

My "knowledge" of cattle is beef prices at our local AC (Alaska Commercial) store in my remote bush community in Alaska.

That is a most excellent price for the rancher selling his calves! The cattle market is in territory it has never seen before.

 

[Betterinthebush]

And for those of us with LESS than no knowledge of cattle... is that a good price?

My "knowledge" of cattle is beef prices at our local AC (Alaska Commercial) store in my remote bush community in Alaska.

These prices right now are outstanding. I sold out my cow/calf pairs, replacement heifers and bulls in April. Beef producers deserve to finally reap the benefits of these prices and finally replace old and wore out equipment. I just don’t like when someone in government says to an entire group that they don’t understand the business they’re in. That was very poor form on his part.

 

[RLD]

I think lots of the disconnect from reality is the elder statesmen of our society had been trained to believe main stream media as the gospel of what is actually happening.

The constant intake of "the sky is falling" news put forth by the MSM has led to severe cognitive dissonance amongst the elderly population that desperately want to believe they are as virtuous as they portrayed themselves in their youth.

It bleeds, it leads.

But the "sky if falling" approach is working, both for the MSM, those on the political left and, even more so, for the MAGA movement.

Look at the MAGA rhetoric. This is a "rebellion", that is an "invasion", they are sending us rapists and murders, this city is burning. Or Elon Musk saying "A seemingly small election could determine the fate of Western civilization" or England is heading for a civil war. Or their use of the term "terrorism" or "terrorist" for anything they don't like. Or "I am your retribution." Retribution for what? For living in one of the best countries in the world?

Both sides use fear to motivate people. It's dishonest, unhealthy, and destructive.

Now I am very found of Reagan, so I am not using him as an example because of the current controversy, but guys like Reagan, and even Obama promised to make things better and appealed to people's better aspirations and emotions to gain their support. Even both Bush Presidents were pretty good at that.

Both Trump and Biden turned to a more fear based approach. They stopped promising to deliver more "virtue" or "progress" but promised to save you from a very evil fate or person, or even more dangerously, evil group.

It's working, but I don't think it is leading anywhere good.