My new Model 70 pre 64- 375 H&H "working" rifle- Have sight question

If the Lyman won't fit without modifications then you might try contacting Skinner Sights. He is pretty ingenious and may have a solution to mount a peep using the tapped holes at the front of the receiver.
Otherwise, I would contact Warne about a front base and RMR red dot mount.
 
Don’t live life based on the value of things, that’s living for money when there’s better things to live for - if you want to fit X scope mounts to it then go for it.
This. I like this.
 
I have been a collector of rifles in the past. I am an amateur when it comes to assessing values.
Your gun is nice. It is not mint and does not appear to a “collectible” or investment type gun. Will it appreciate in value? Maybe, likely, but everything does except beanie babies.

So, make it usable for what you want or need. Guns are to be shot and used. If never plan to sell it, then this is not an issue. Get a solid gunsmith to get you the set up you like and go shoot it.

Model 70”s are everywhere. They are not rare or terribly unique. I have several. I like the action and shoot them. In my experience the current ones and the New Haven made guns are more accurate and better made. I know that is sacrilege, but it is my experience.

So, forget protecting perceived value and go enjoy your gun!
 
Also, after reading many of the posts here - the M70 action is a marvel of simplicity. It works reliably. Many say the 98 Mauser is the motherlode best of all actions. It is good. It is strong. It is well engineered. But it is not the only truly great action out there. The M70, the Dakota/Parkwest M76, the (I am sure to be drawn and quartered for this), Remington 700 and dozens of copies like the HS Precision, are good to great as well. Even the Ruger 77 action is tired and true.

So , be happy with what you like, go shoot it. If you cannot get it shoot accurately, sell it and go get another….you are not married to any gun or action…you have free choice.
 
All good comments above from M70 lovers! Take stock off, put inside a protected gun box (aka Glass Case) inside closet that reads "break in event of Sale!" Get an HS Precision stock (it'll shoot better!) and new sights from NECG. For the most part, it's a 100 yd DG gun. Irons (esp. modern, peeps, fiber optic illuminated, etc.) shoot well. I used to shoot 3-4" groups to <150 yds with the factory sights, and that's just fine, but upgrading will accurize the gun, and you haven't touched a thing. The forward "scout style" mounted red dot is also a fantastic way to go. You'll never get scoped, unless you have an extremely protuberant brow... V. Nice & GL! Take out of glass case and sell on its 100 yr anniversary. Paul Mauser is smiling down, envious...like Tesla looking at Edison.
 
Well said!
 
Also, after reading many of the posts here - the M70 action is a marvel of simplicity. It works reliably. Many say the 98 Mauser is the motherlode best of all actions. It is good. It is strong. It is well engineered. But it is not the only truly great action out there. The M70, the Dakota/Parkwest M76, the (I am sure to be drawn and quartered for this), Remington 700 and dozens of copies like the HS Precision, are good to great as well. Even the Ruger 77 action is tired and true.

So , be happy with what you like, go shoot it. If you cannot get it shoot accurately, sell it and go get another….you are not married to any gun or action…you have free choice.
You overlooked Springfield 03A3. In my book it's a smoother action than either 98 Mauser or M70. Springfield requires slightly less effort on closing bolt to cock the striker (yes, both are "cock on opening" but striker is not fully cocked until bolt is closed).
 
If you plan to shoot this rifle, definitely consider adding internal crossbolts. They will be hidden from view and won't affect collector or sentimental value. Easily done with a Dremel tool and carving bit, 1/4" threaded rod, and JB Weld. I would also put a reinforcement rod down through the stock wrist from the end of receiver tang, but that requires some skill to do it correctly. And you want to make sure the stock is rebated away from end of the receiver tang to prevent cracks starting there. Again, none of these modifications should detract from collector value. Certainly not like a crack will.
 
If the Lyman won't fit without modifications then you might try contacting Skinner Sights. He is pretty ingenious and may have a solution to mount a peep using the tapped holes at the front of the receiver.
Otherwise, I would contact Warne about a front base and RMR red dot mount.
I believe Skinner sight makes one that fits in the dovetail for the rear sight
 
My favorite rifle…pre-64, 375 H&H, G&H side mount system. Pretty enough to like but still a working tool
af4d48c5-0e5a-4e9b-94c1-17e7e5e3a41f.jpeg
 
Hello Traveller1,

Excellent rifle you have there.
In my grouchy old man opinion, the model 1898 Mauser ….. when considering ALL species, at all “reasonable” hunting distances IMO, (from sword fighting distance, out to around 4 or 500 paces), is by far the world’s finest hunting rifle.
There are many copies, (mostly ones that cheapen the manufacturing process).

With that, among all the endless copies of Paul Mauser’s Model ‘98, around the world, since the end of WW-II … the Winchester Model 70 (not the 1964, through perhaps the 1980’s, cheezy, “push feed” ones), the Controlled Round Feed Model 70, is one of the World’s most excellent hunting rifles.

Agreeing with others here, I suggest that you should consider having a Professional Gunsmith bed the action and cross pin the stock, to avoid recoil cracks.
Regarding iron sights, I rather like the original rear sights on your rifle (once I did own one pretty much identical to yours).
Well, except that, I had a larger, white front sight bead installed, because my eyes (like yours), are aging.
And so, I suggest that you have installed a large (LARGE), white front bead sight.
Warthog ivory is classic and does not turn yellow with age.
However, porcelain likewise never yellows and is much more “impact resistant” than real ivory.
New England Custom Gun (often printed as: “NECG” these days), sells porcelain beads, in all sizes, including large ones for old guys like us.
Not cheap but worth every penny for sure.

Then, 1.
Consider having it professionally claw mounted for a simple but sturdy 4x scope from about the same window in history as the rifle itself.
The Zeiss 4x with front bell rubber armored comes to mind.
Now and then they do pop up for sale on various internet sites (gunsinternational.com is the best one, IMO).

2.
Since claw mounts now cost well beyond $1,000.US these days (but still worth it), perhaps you prefer to save some money ? ….. Then, do consider having the OLDER model Talley blocks (aka: “bases”) installed (requires drill & tap) and again, the older model Talley lever rings to match installed.
As usual, I recommend a sturdy, 4x scope, from about the same vintage as your excellent rifle.

3.
Forgive an old rifle grump for answering a question that you did not ask.
But, I encourage you to use 300 grain Swift brand, A-Frame bullets, for all species (Africa or anywhere) that you may hunt, especially all buffaloes, including every sub-species.
Well, except elephant.
Those require all solids.

The Swift A-Frame is arguably the best of the best, among ALL of the world’s expanding big game bullets, world wide that, has ever been dreamed up.
Indeed it is everything the Nosler Partition always wanted to be but never achieved.
Admittedly, there are some other good ones out there now.
However, again in my opinion, nothing is as sure as the Swift A-Frame.
Zowie, whata bullet !
No, I do not get any sort of benefit (however, IMO, I do deserve a “kick back” from Swift for all the good I’m constantly crowing about their bullet. LoL).

In the air now.
Upon landing, my young trophy wife (she’s only 62) and I will be doing a wee bit of fly fishing.
So, gotta run.
Again I say, great rifle.
And, I hope you carry it on many grand adventures.

Cheers,
Velo Dog.
Velo - just a question from someone who wonders, this rifle looks to have been used for many years and the stock has not cracked. Wouldn't that indicate that it doesn't suffer from the weakness that many 70s do, and so isn't likely to crack? Nothing wrong with a little preventative maintenance, though...
 
Resurrecting an old thread here hoping to get some help with a similar situation..

While dropping off a rifle for some adjustments at the gunsmith, I had the good fortune of running into an old colleague of mine that I haven’t seen in at least a decade. Of course we started talking about guns and he mentioned he had a pre-64 Model 70 in 375 H&H among other interesting specimens. Long story short, I ended up trading him my pre-64 Model 70 in 30.06 with replacement stock for a 280 AI build he is doing (plus some cash) for his pre-64 375 H&H.

Based on the serial number, it is a 1948 production, which in magnum actions, the rear of the receiver was not D&T for a scope, etc. I enjoy shooting irons, but my eyesight doesn’t allow for me to do it very effectively anymore. I am 100% against drilling any holes, or perinatally modifying the rifle in any way, but given my poor eyesight, I would love the option of putting a red dot on the front of the receiver where two holes form the factory exist, not permanently modifying the rifle in anyway. In the above post, there is the suggestion of using a Weaver style base and mounting a red dot to it, but I have not ever seen one actually mounted like this. I have also heard that a Warne base could also possibly work. Does anyone have experience here? Below are pics of my new rifle, she is a peach and a real joy to shoot… I just can’t see these irons well enough to hit anything! View attachment 772886 View attachment 772884View attachment 772885
Just by having the rear receiver bridge not tapped you gain 10-20% value over book. DO NOT drill and tap it. The number of non drilled receivers is shrinking every year and that value will continue to rise even if only a 70-80% condition gun.

You should be able to find a red dot mounting plate that will mount to a weaver rail or a 2pc pic mount. As you mentioned I think Warne makes a 2pc pic rail for Pre64’s, you’ll need to look at them and see how many slots they have for the red dot plate to mount to and compare it to the plates.

Another option might be getting a red dot plate and having your gun smith modify it by drilling the correct Pre64 hole space in it so you can utilize it.
 
Gentlemen,

Thanks for all the responses, opinions ans suggestions. I still have not got a chance to fire her yet but I have compared her to several other rifles including modern Mod. 70's and shotguns as to the balance and pulling her straight into my line of sight. She is the best, only my Citori and Savage Mod. 99 compare. I don't even have to tilt my head, exactly where I am looking the bead appears.

Because of this I am hesitant to add scope or modern red dot/Trijicon RM style sights. I have never used a red dot or RM style sight before. @deewayne2003 do you use a RM style sight? If you do, does it make adjust your check on the comb?

Yes, I am still on the fence about tapping her, even more so since pulls up so nice. I know she is not a collector value because the condition, but she all original. @Vintageguy I agree about redos either leave it or go all the way and then its just another custom pre 64.

@Velo Dog, I looked at NECG, but did not see a front sight that looks to work with a M70 dovetail front ramp. I like this sights as well. Its neatly impossible to find a Lymm 6w front v sight to replace the worn one (not out) on her. My first order of business is to get a highly visible front sight and shoot several boxes of shells and get a feel for this express site. Then checked under her hood and get her serviced by gunsmith. A complete disassembly, ultrasonic bath and inspection is what she needs.

Thanks Again,

Kelley
It sounds like what you love about this rifle is that the sights are on target when you shoulder it blindfolded. I don't know exactly what's wrong with the sights that are on it, but I wouldn't change anything until I'd run some rounds through it. It may be that what looks like a problem isn't a problem...

There is a class of firearms which earn their keep by being perfect for inside 50 or 60 yards, the defensive arm. They're what you carry if you're not particularly hunting or in areas of short range visibility. That shouldering characteristic makes your gun the absolute best for that purpose. Then there's an argument that says not having to shoot at greater than 50 yards is the true test of the hunter.

I have an old 30-06 made by Husqvarna, essentially a '98 clone, that comes up for me as yours does for you. The gun is worn and stocked in something that looks like someone cut it out of a 2"x6", inletted it and got the side view pretty good but didn't care about the edges of the board being so evident. A bit ugly. But then I don't really need sights for close up as it works like a shotgun for me. I won't change this rifle.
 
This came off of my Pre 64 Win 70 in 270. Never seen one before or since. Front mounts on top of the receiver where it is tapped. The rear mounts on the side where the receiver sight would be mounted. The rings only have screws on the top so the scope can be leveled. The only way I can fiigue how the rings were mounted was they had to be installed before the ocular eyepice and turret bases. Appear to be a Weaver scope but there are no markings on the scope. The front ring has a U14 stamped on it and the rear U10.
Wiin scope1.jpg
Winscope2.jpg
 
This came off of my Pre 64 Win 70 in 270. Never seen one before or since. Front mounts on top of the receiver where it is tapped. The rear mounts on the side where the receiver sight would be mounted. The rings only have screws on the top so the scope can be leveled. The only way I can fiigue how the rings were mounted was they had to be installed before the ocular eyepice and turret bases. Appear to be a Weaver scope but there are no markings on the scope. The front ring has a U14 stamped on it and the rear U10.View attachment 773376View attachment 773377
I'm with the "don't drill" crowd. Anything that will mount to existing holes is good. Or improve the express sights if they need replacement; that would be okay also.

Here's a link to the Weaver U mounts catalog for all rifles. I'll bet there are some out there to be found.
Type U Mounts for Model K Weaver Scopes
 
I know I was a smart ass butt I had a lens transplant last year so I’m taking the scope off my Ruger no 1 300 HH and pulling out a m-94 30-30 I killed my first deer with back in the 1960’s. Find an outfitter in Canada that’s up to sneaking an old man within 50-75 yards of a bear, no bait, please. Get in the thick brush for Cape buffalo with open sights. If I kill nothing the so be it. It’s the hunt. Anyone know where a good used but not abused low comb undrilled m-70 is that’s for sale!
 
EfRed said:

Velo - just a question from someone who wonders, this rifle looks to have been used for many years and the stock has not cracked. Wouldn't that indicate that it doesn't suffer from the weakness that many 70s do, and so isn't likely to crack? Nothing wrong with a little preventative maintenance,

Greetings EfRed,

I have noticed that with my own rifles and observations of other people’s rifles yes, wood stocked older well used ones that have not yet cracked are not as likely to crack any more.
This is especially true if said rifles have survived quite a lot of shots fired through them with full pressure / hard recoiling ammunition.

However, I will guess that over the decades as wood dries out, including but not limited to rifle stocks, a crack or cracks might develop, with or without recoil being involved.
And so, I totally agree with you that there is nothing wrong with a little preventative maintenance.
Regarding wooden stock reinforcement, it is better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

Cheers,
V. Dog.
 
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I agree, I don't like the way side mounts looks, but thinking maybe an option incase I need to thread the needle at 100 yard or more.
Side mount is a bigger abomination than just drilling a tapping the rear bridge.
Just my opinion for what it is worth.
 

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K_P wrote on Buckleyguy12's profile.
Good morning from Montana.

I'm looking at a post from 2018 where you were looking for a lefty Winchester in .375 H&H Magnum. I'm selling mine. My email is [redacted] in the event that you're still searching for a unicorn.

Best,

Kelly Palmer
Gents, if you book and pay your deposit before the end of this year , you can have the bigger cull package for the 2026 price! https://www.africahunting.com/threa...griffiths-safaris-starting-at-us-2-560.96285/
I am currently in Northern Cape scouting a hunting area, we will have lots of amazing hunting opportunities for 2027! I will post updated available dates soon!
Azklmsr wrote on MANKAZANA SAFARIS's profile.
Good Evening. I am very interested in you hunt for the spiral slam. March in 2028 would be fine for me

Couple of quick questions:

1) Can we add some additional species on
2) what do you want for a deposit?
3) how do you want me to sign up

I'm on whats app or email

Kurt [redacted]

have a great evening
MHYOUNG 375 wrote on Marley7x57's profile.
If you really are interested I 'll send some pix. I have quiet a few.
 
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