Went To The Dark Side (Swarovski)

I was a die hard Leupold fan for many years. Then in 2019 my wife and I decided to make a drastic change and restructure our rifle collection and upgrade. We made a day trip to Euro Optic to look at a few rifles and optics for a true side-by-side comparison.

They allowed me to stand in the parking lot with probably $30K worth of optics from Swaro, Leica, Zeiss, S&B and Leupold. I would have never let my wife look through the high dollar glass without being prepared for the aftermath. She fell in love with the Z8i's and there was no turning back. We also chose the Leica binos over the others.

I will say there was a significant drop in optical clarity from the Swaro & Leica to the Leupold. But the difference between the Swaro and Leica was how my eye perceives the colors and how true they look. It was splitting hairs to find a winner and I don't think there was a looser in the running.

I still have one Leupold scope that sits on my 22lr and love it but it's purpose is varmint control, not big game. The confidence gained with better optical performance for large game animals can not be underestimated. It's a game changer that will allow you to see into the shadows of a blackthorn bush to see the black shoulder of a Cape buffalo and place the illuminated dot where it belongs.

Congratulations on your new Z3 and I hope you enjoy it without having your bank account suffer too much. Cheers.

Sideshow said:
I thought it was a good deal. It had been only used as shop display so not as if someone was going to take a hammer to it.
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I've bought several items from Euro Optic that were demo or used and saved a lot of money. Only had one that was a problem, but it was immediately made right by the staff and a full refund was given. They are wonderful people to do business with.
 
Bonk said:
I’ve never agreed with the philosophy of spending more money on a scope than I did the rifle and I still don’t. I’m a died in the wool Leupold fan and they’ve done everything I’ve asked of them. The most I ever spent on one was about $600 and that was for a VX5-HD. I liked it but I’m not a fan of 30mm tubes. I sold it almost immediately because it just seemed too bulky on top of my rifle. I have about a half dozen VX1/VX2/Freedom models and they work fine. Very basic but more than adequate for my needs. I do have some VX-3i models and those are my favorites. Better than the VX1/2 but still 1” tubes and not a lot of tactical tomfoolery. I’ve also been a sceptic of the big dollar brands like Swarovski, Zeiss, etc. I acknowledge their superior glass but in my world I couldn’t justify the considerable additional expense for a relatively moderate increase in performance. Better, yes but not $2500-3000 better.

Today I had the chance to buy a BNIB Swarovski Z-3 for several hundred dollars less than the going price. It was comfortably under $1K so I decided to buy it and see what all the fuss is about. I know it’s not a Z-8 but all the reviews I read said the optical clarity was really close to the Z-5 but still in a 1” tube. I haven’t had a chance to use it yet but it seems like a nice piece of kit especially for the price I paid.

One of two things will happen. It will either not impress me but I won’t be too annoyed because I didn’t spend a whole lot for it. OTOH, and probably worse, is I’ll love it and have to start replacing my Leupolds and I doubt I’ll find another deal like I did today. Wish me luck. :cool:
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Hi Bonk,
Z3 is Swarovski's entry level. And the last series with a 1in body. Swarovski quality comes to its full expression from the 30mm tube and above. Z3 is the series that this manufacturer's lens should make available at a lower price. The quality of the lenses is excellent, as is the impact resistance. I think you will be satisfied. I have had the opportunity to see a few, although they are not sold in the EU. In the EU, only optics with a 30mm tube are recognized as high class. I personally only use Zeiss and Schmit & Bend. These are serious manufacturers that have been proven over a period of more than a century (Zeiss is more than 160 years old).
And I must mention that I do not agree with you. I am of the opinion that optics and mount are worth more than quality weapons.
When you try the optics, let us know how satisfied you are
 
I have a Zeiss V8, a couple Docter's, a Nightforce, some Redfields and Leupolds and a Swarovski. I have a few Japanese Crimson Trace 34mm scopes and a 34mm Chinese scope that was almost $1500 retail I got for $500. I also have some Japanese made Brunton Optics binoculars, a couple of pairs of the highest end Bushnell binoculars and a pair of Swarovski EL Range TA 8x42.

I am not happy with the Swarovski EL Range TA 8x42 Binocular. It is not as clear as the EL 12x50's I sold to fund this purchase. The LRF unit in it sucks, I have swapped batteries multiple times. I carry a 10 year old Leupold 1600 TBR ranger in front of the Swarovski.

My eyeball likes Leica color better than Swarovski color. I don't think any of them put enough eye relief into binoculars like they used to do.

For binoculars, 22mm would be amazing, and we are lucky if we get 17 these days.

Rifle scopes are really not so finicky.

The old Redfields and Leupolds can be shot, but boy do I ever prefer the Zeiss and Nightforce. The Nightforce is very dark compared to the Zeiss.

Budget be damned I'd replace everything on a long range rifle with Nightforce, and everything for Europe in the Swarovski Z8 line with 56mm Objectives.

For Binos, I think I'd trade mine with the Geovid 8x56 2400 and be happy. They have good color and eye relief.
 
I have a handful of Swaro's a Z6, and a pair of Z5's. They are very good scopes but are not my favorites for most hunting. I have a Kahles on my #1 DG rifle and am using Arken Z8's on almost everything else. I simply love that little scope. I have two of them on 338's so you know they can handle the recoil. They are clear and precise and easy to use in varied situations. They simply work for me. So, yeah Swarovski is good and has some bang on great features.
 
Muskox said:
I have a Zeiss V8, a couple Docter's, a Nightforce, some Redfields and Leupolds and a Swarovski. I have a few Japanese Crimson Trace 34mm scopes and a 34mm Chinese scope that was almost $1500 retail I got for $500. I also have some Japanese made Brunton Optics binoculars, a couple of pairs of the highest end Bushnell binoculars and a pair of Swarovski EL Range TA 8x42.

I am not happy with the Swarovski EL Range TA 8x42 Binocular. It is not as clear as the EL 12x50's I sold to fund this purchase. The LRF unit in it sucks, I have swapped batteries multiple times. I carry a 10 year old Leupold 1600 TBR ranger in front of the Swarovski.

My eyeball likes Leica color better than Swarovski color. I don't think any of them put enough eye relief into binoculars like they used to do.

For binoculars, 22mm would be amazing, and we are lucky if we get 17 these days.

Rifle scopes are really not so finicky.

The old Redfields and Leupolds can be shot, but boy do I ever prefer the Zeiss and Nightforce. The Nightforce is very dark compared to the Zeiss.

Budget be damned I'd replace everything on a long range rifle with Nightforce, and everything for Europe in the Swarovski Z8 line with 56mm Objectives.

For Binos, I think I'd trade mine with the Geovid 8x56 2400 and be happy. They have good color and eye relief.
Click to expand...
+1 on the V8 Zeiss. I was able to compare it side by side with a Z8 Swarovski and the Zeiss was the better resolving tree bark at a distance. Surprise, since some here thing the Z8 is a near religious experience.
 
steve white said:
To the OP: quote from the Dark Lord of the Sith..."Only now, do you realize the power of the dark side"
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Little does he know that by choosing Swarovski, he's coming into the light...literally.

A Jedi you will become @Bonk.

 
@Bonk - Not that I'm an enabler in any way, but wanted to let you know that @EuroOptic is having a sale on a few items. Didn't know if you, or maybe others might want to take a look. You know, just look at a few scopes. Certainly not thinking of buying anything. :unsure: ;) Cheers.

EuroOptic Swaro Sale
 
I joined the dark side 15 years ago. (Swaro, Zeiss)

The logic is following:
If I hunt every day 365 days a year, I dont need that.

But If I hunt on limited number of days per year, and even more limited by number of days in Africa, I want the best glass possible, to use every last moment of daylight I can.

Answer: Swarovski, Leica, Zeiss, Smidt and Bender.

If you hunt 365 days a year, in your backyard you dont need any glass at all. Iron sights will suffice.
One day you will get lucky
 
mark-hunter said:
I joined the dark side 15 years ago. (Swaro, Zeiss)

The logic is following:
If I hunt every day 365 days a year, I dont need that.

But If I hunt on limited number of days per year, and even more limited by number of days in Africa, I want the best glass possible, to use every last moment of daylight I can.

Answer: Swarovski, Leica, Zeiss, Smidt and Bender.

If you hunt 365 days a year, in your backyard you dont need any glass at all. Iron sights will suffice.
One day you will get lucky
Click to expand...
I see the logic in that.

But what if that one animal you've been looking for comes around and you only have irons? Do you really want to wait until it happens again. Lightening doesn't usually strike twice. I'd prefer to have the best I could afford on top of the rifle at all times. Plus, who knows if your hunting neighbor isn't doing the same thing and that animal ends up in his backyard? Be a shame to go over for coffee one day and find it hanging on his wall.

Make the most of each and every opportunity, no matter how small.
 
@BeeMaa
I wanted to give some slack to OP, by giving politically correct answer.
You are, of course, 100% correct!
;)
 
mark-hunter said:
I joined the dark side 15 years ago. (Swaro, Zeiss)

The logic is following:
If I hunt every day 365 days a year, I dont need that.

But If I hunt on limited number of days per year, and even more limited by number of days in Africa, I want the best glass possible, to use every last moment of daylight I can.

Answer: Swarovski, Leica, Zeiss, Smidt and Bender.

If you hunt 365 days a year, in your backyard you dont need any glass at all. Iron sights will suffice.
One day you will get lucky
Click to expand...

Sounds like a sales pitch
 
One evening in Africa, as a Leupold hunter packed up because he couldn't see in the dimming light, I handed him my Swarovskis. He changed his mind about spending more on optics.

"It only cost the difference in what you paid for it and what you sold it for"
 
I am very interested to hear the op thoughts.

I first got a z3 and felt it was a huge upgrade. I now also have a z5. But, the sleeper is the Kahles 1-5 I have. I believe it’s a subsidiary of Swarovski and a cheaper way to get that quality.
 
BeeMaa said:
I was a die hard Leupold fan for many years. Then in 2019 my wife and I decided to make a drastic change and restructure our rifle collection and upgrade. We made a day trip to Euro Optic to look at a few rifles and optics for a true side-by-side comparison.

They allowed me to stand in the parking lot with probably $30K worth of optics from Swaro, Leica, Zeiss, S&B and Leupold. I would have never let my wife look through the high dollar glass without being prepared for the aftermath. She fell in love with the Z8i's and there was no turning back. We also chose the Leica binos over the others.

I will say there was a significant drop in optical clarity from the Swaro & Leica to the Leupold. But the difference between the Swaro and Leica was how my eye perceives the colors and how true they look. It was splitting hairs to find a winner and I don't think there was a looser in the running.

I still have one Leupold scope that sits on my 22lr and love it but it's purpose is varmint control, not big game. The confidence gained with better optical performance for large game animals can not be underestimated. It's a game changer that will allow you to see into the shadows of a blackthorn bush to see the black shoulder of a Cape buffalo and place the illuminated dot where it belongs.

Congratulations on your new Z3 and I hope you enjoy it without having your bank account suffer too much. Cheers.


I've bought several items from Euro Optic that were demo or used and saved a lot of money. Only had one that was a problem, but it was immediately made right by the staff and a full refund was given. They are wonderful people to do business with.
Click to expand...

I began the transition to German glass a number of years ago. It would be hard to go back. This year I shot a very nice buck at absolute last light. I was using a Ruger No 1 in .275 Rigby topped with a Swarovski Z6i 1-6x24 EE with a German No 4 reticle. After the shot I realized I had not turned the reticle on and yet had no difficulty making the shot. The brightness and clarity of that scope is unbelievable and that unit is not intended as a low light scope. I doubt very much that I could have made that shot with a Leupold VX6.
 
Pheroze said:
I am very interested to hear the op thoughts.

I first got a z3 and felt it was a huge upgrade. I now also have a z5. But, the sleeper is the Kahles 1-5 I have. I believe it’s a subsidiary of Swarovski and a cheaper way to get that quality.
Click to expand...
Kahles is ran as a different company under the same roof. Kahles was thought to be the "tactical" company for a while, but they have gone to producing their own hunting scopes again.

Their tactical realm is huge, I think it has put a few chinks in the Schmidt Bender armor.

Saying that, the problem is that not everything sold by Kahles is made in the Swarovski factory.

Everything sold by swarovski is made there.
 
All my scopes are either Leupold or Vortex and all are proven. I'm certainly open to a Swaro, but it would definitely have to be a demo at half price.
 
I’m skeptical of the price:performance ratio in the higher end glass. Certainly a case of diminishing returns. I’ve got Leupold VX-6 HD on my Blaser R8 barrels and have a pair of Leica Geovid Pro binoculars that I think are great.

OTOH, the market prices are what the market will bear. AND - Was talking with my uncle recently who is in his 70’s and is one of my main hunting partners. He has some early cataracts and it is not as easy to see past 200 yds or so with his Leupold VX-3 3.5-10. I think many of us as we age, would be better served by better glass and fewer rifles.

As I’ve bemoaned in other threads, I have realized that I need reading glasses this year. Have been dragging my feet, but there is no question premium glass can compensate for some of the loss in vision we all suffer to a greater or lesser extent as we age.
 
I should also say that we all have a budget to live within, but spending enough on quality glas to meet the needs of our eyes is worthwhile.
 
458JCE said:
I have multiple Z3s in 3-9x36 (fave for weight)
Click to expand...

The now discontinued z3 3-9x36mm was absolutely the Leupold-Killer. At an MSRP of $645 that Z3 was so far superior to other entry-level to mid-level optics in that rough pricepoint.

Both of my son's first rifles have those z3s. I wish I had a drawer full of another dozen.
 
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