Double tap or safety shot!!

[Sable123]

Some people i have guided out right refuse, some ask for help and some never even knew it could happen!! I am talking about the Professional hunter following up with a shot of his own right behind the clients to finish an animal and stop it from running off wounded. I would be interested to hear your thoughts/preferences?

I am not sure what others refer to it as, but I call it a "safety shot". Basically when a client fires, the professional hunter follows it up with a quick shot of his own in the correct area, directly after.
As a PH I often find this topic to be a bit of a taboo and discuss it in depth with my clients before hand to make sure they are comfortable with the notion of it before setting out on a hunt. Most are seasoned hunters and would frown at the idea of another putting a bullet in their prized trophy, while some are nervous and would rather the animal go down immediately than spend 3 days of their 10 day safari tracking a wounded animal.
I understand that under certain circumstances it is difficult to put in a "safety shot", but what I would like to know is have you ever requested it? Been offered it or had it done without your knowledge?
Not sure if this is similar (mostly because I am not registered to hunt dangerous game and so have not put clients onto a dangerous animal) but is the same sort of thing discussed when a PH is required to put down a charging buffalo/lion/leopard or is it standard operating procedure amongst big 5 hunting that the PH will have the final say on a wounded animal? (I know the answer "generally" from speaking with other PHs but Im interested in the general mass of hunters)

Thanks and happy hunting as all ways!

 

[Nyati]

Never been offered or asked for it on plainsgame.

When hunting buff, my PH told me he had to shoot if wounded and it came too close. Under those circumstances, I agreed, of course.

An exception would be hunting croc, ( if I ever move to a bigger house someday ) where you know that if you don´t kill the animal outright, he is going to head for the water with a very high probability of losing him. There, I would request a safety shot, as me shooting for the neck and my PH for the hip.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Some people i have guided out right refuse, some ask for help and some never even knew it could happen!! I am talking about the Professional hunter following up with a shot of his own right behind the clients to finish an animal and stop it from running off wounded. I would be interested to hear your thoughts/preferences?

I am not sure what others refer to it as, but I call it a "safety shot". Basically when a client fires, the professional hunter follows it up with a quick shot of his own in the correct area, directly after.
As a PH I often find this topic to be a bit of a taboo and discuss it in depth with my clients before hand to make sure they are comfortable with the notion of it before setting out on a hunt. Most are seasoned hunters and would frown at the idea of another putting a bullet in their prized trophy, while some are nervous and would rather the animal go down immediately than spend 3 days of their 10 day safari tracking a wounded animal.
I understand that under certain circumstances it is difficult to put in a "safety shot", but what I would like to know is have you ever requested it? Been offered it or had it done without your knowledge?
…….

Thanks and happy hunting as all ways!

Personally, I figure if I shoot like crap I deserve to "waste" three days tracking the animal. Maybe I'll be reinforced to learn something about shooting and I'll certainly learn about tracking.

I have watched a host of PH's on hunts. My own conclusion drawn by observing the disappearance of their rifle into a case after the first trip to the range or after the first day (or it never came out at all). They concluded I could shoot and their was zero possibility of a dangerous encounter.

In Dangerous Game areas the PH's have always carried their rifle. Lion, Elephant and Buffalo being a potential issue.
No doubt, anyones in immediate danger; SHOOT! *

Other than that, I'll be shooting my own critters thank you very much.

I have asked a PH to place a final shot on an Eland; I wanted it ended. I hit it five times. Three in the boiler room. No idea why this guy would not go/stay down. (It was a rented rifle)

I can not even conceive of a PH shooting without my agreement or knowledge. except *
If there was no immediate danger I hope they have brought enough money for their trophy fee. I'll be glad to take their trophy pictures for them.

Nyati's idea about Crocs I have to agree. I might be chatting about an "echo shot".
Another circumstance might be "border hunting" on game that might enter the park and be lost "Elephant". Certainly we'd be chatting about dropping it on the spot.

On a difficult followup it all changes.
Anything goes. Get the critter on the ground with any safe shot.

 

[Wheels]

Generally speaking, I am against an echo shot. As Brickburn said, if my shooting is that bad, maybe I deserve to spend three days following the animal up.

Having said that, the PH has shot my animal three times.

The first doesn't fit your example completely. I shot a gemsbok late in the day. We tracked it for a couple of miles. The PH could see it through some bush and I couldn't. I gave him my rifle and he shot it and slowed it down. He gave the rifle back to me and I finished it off with about 15 minutes of light left. The animal didn't deserve to suffer anymore due to my poor shooting.

The other two examples were elephant. The PH brought this up prior to the hunt being booked. He highly recommended that he back up my shot if close to the border but it was my choice. We agreed that he would back me up when we were close to the concession boundaries. As I recall, one elephant was about 200 yards from a boundary and the other 400. He supplied echo shots and I have no qualms about the decision. I had over a year to contemplate that possibility and thought it was the prudent decision for me.

As has been mentioned. With a croc, I would request an echo shot.

When dealing with a wounded animal that can keep going, I have no pride. The animal deserves a speedy end. While it has only happened the one time, I would always tell the PH to take a shot if he has it and I don't.

This will be an interesting thread. Thanks for bringing it up.

All the best.

 

[Cody Malone]

I offer follow up shots on my whitetail customers here in Texas. As long as I see impact I put one into it as well to lesson the likelihood of loosing an animal bc of a poor shot

I discuss this when they get to camp and if they question I will not do it as per their request. I have lost three deer in four years. You know how many request not to do a follow up shot? Only 4 out of 100

 

[Sable123]

Some valid points thanks guys. Its all about learning and expanding my knowledge for me, so I enjoy hearing others opinions. Which is why I discuss it before hand and make sure everyone is on the same path regarding the "echo" or follow up shot. I have however put in a follow up shot on an animal where the hunter out right refused my help but I wasn't going to allow his ego and s**t shooting to further the discomfort of the animal.

Thanks again, will like to hear more on this.

 

[G Skinner]

While in Namibia I shot a Gemsbok with my bow , both my PH (Helmut) and myself thought the shot was good ..........after a few days of tracking , much to my feelings of discomfort ,the cow walked into us at another waterhole . I was told to shoot 1 of 2 animals coming in . The 1st animal walked by at 40 plus yards ,to far for the bow , the 2nd at 27 yards ,but would not stop . When they reached the waters edge Helmut looked at them threw the binos and up came the rifle and down went the Gemsbok .I was surprized at how quickly it all happened and asked WHY ? rather unpolitely . He said "That is your Gemsbok " to the shock of us both that animal had walked 10 miles in 4 days and neither of us could tell that it was even injured ..... but there high in the shoulder was that sweet little triangle made by my G5 Montec . I believe it was Helmut's or any PH's responsability to do a follow up shot . I know it is not a pretty story but it is the way it happened and I have a trophy on my wall to prove it . Thanks Helmut .
Glen

 

[Cody Malone]

I should have also added I have harvested a few wounded bucks after they have returned home and shipped them the horns

 

[jeff]

G Skinner, it seems like in your case the PH should have handed you the rifle and given you the chance to harvest your gemsbok.

 

[G Skinner]

Jeff , he did offer me his rifle many times .......... but I was scared of the big bad bang .... why do you think I bow hunt ? Seriously neither of us expected the Gemsbok to walk in on us like that .
Glen

 

[jeff]

It seemed to me he was surprised and got trigger happy, but I wasn't there, if you were happy with his response that's all that matters.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Just has someone ask about when a PH should be shooting.

 

[Red Leg]

I do not believe that I have ever had a PH carry a rifle on a PG stalk. And I have yet to have a PH fire a second shot at a buff. That said, were a PH to believe that my first or second shot at a buff were insufficient, I have no issue whatsoever with him firing an immediate insurance shot.

This can also go badly for the PH. I was hunting in the Caprivi several years ago with a very well known Namibian outfitter. I'll leave his name out of this. I was hunting buffalo with one of his PHs, and he was personally guiding a fellow from Houston who was hunting elephant. A PG licensed PH was also tagging along chalking up one of the supervised big game hunts he needed for a DG license. In any case, they came upon a shootable bull escorted by a young askari. The PH pointed out the correct bull and the client fired a .416 ruger into its shoulder. At the shot both bulls bolted and the askari stumbled in the process. The PH assumed the client had shot the wrong bull and put two .500's into his backside as he ran off. 100 meters or so later two bulls were down. When I left camp, the PH was still trying to figure out how to get the small bull designated a PAC animal.

 

[Hank2211]

Issue is, as always, or nearly always, one of communication. On a dangerous game hunt PH has certain responsibilities to ensure safety of all concerned, but that shouldn't obviate the need for a conversation.

On the only croc I shot, it was very close to the water's edge. I told the PH to follow-up if it looked like a bad shot and we could lose the trophy. I made a pretty good shot, and followed up the brain shot with a heart/lung shot, but the tail twitching was pushing the croc to swiftly flowing water. I emptied my rifle into it - two more rounds - and then the PH took three. Finally stopped the movement. I think the locals though war had broken out.

My PH has also taken a shot when we were charged by a buffalo I had wounded - at 20 yards with open sights he was way faster than I could have been. (Bought Talley mounts after that little episode.)

On a plains game hunt, where there is no dangerous game, I've never heard of, let alone seen, an "echo" shot. Having said that, I've experienced my PH taking a quick shot on a wounded animal we'd been following. We'd discussed it - first person to see it brings it down, but that was because I'd made a poor first shot, we didn't want to spend days tracking it, and ethics compelled us to deal with it as quickly and humanely as possible. I also asked my PH to finish a springbuck still running and leaping at 600 yards. Not a shot I could make, so handed my rifle over. Otherwise, I can take the finishing shot. (Other than those two, my average is pretty good!).

No surprises is usually a good policy.

 

[Scott Slough]

I can not even conceive of a PH shooting without my agreement or knowledge. except *
If there was no immediate danger I hope they have brought enough money for their trophy fee. I'll be glad to take their trophy pictures for them.

I have to agree with BRICKBURN!

If I don't trust my shooting and the PH doesn't trust my shooting, why don't I just let the PH shoot it for me and I will provide the double tap? That way, we can be sure that I get MY trophy and I can go home and put it on the wall and call it mine and no one but me will know the difference ... wait, I would know the difference!!!!

 

[Divernhunter]

On my PG hunt the PH did not carry a rifle. The tracker did for a few but it was never needed. I think the sight in shots helped him decide I could shoot, also my daughter with 2-3 shots touching. My 1st animal was a moving Waterbuck at 235 yards. One shot flop over dead. After the next couple of animals he did not even take it with us usually. All animals from 300 to 480 yards were dead, no tracking, with one shot. Except one: My Gemsbuck was shot running a bit high. The quick follow up shot I made put it down and since it took 2 I put another into it just to be sure it never got up on its own while we walked over to it several hundred yards away. The couple from 150-300 yards were easy one shot kills. If I needed back up my daughter was there with her rifle.
Unless it was easy to tell it was a poor shot with the animal going to get away I would not want any help. I have hunted all my life, do not get "Buck-Fever" and shoot well using the proper type of bullets handloaded into proper cartridge sized firearms for the game/conditions I am hunting.
We could have got closer to the animals(all spot and stalk) but since we shot so well the PH wanted to make it a bit more challenging for us. We did not mind especially since we got some free animals tossed in.

If DG then I want the PH to do what is needed to kill the animal before it gets to kill us. That and not being as mobile as I use to be is one reason I will not hunt DG.....well maybe a crock.

 

[Rob404]

My PH never carried a rifle when i hunted Plains Game,he carried a sidearm, I had the good fortune of making all One shot Kills,

 

[BRICKBURN]

.............
This can also go badly for the PH. I was hunting in the Caprivi several years ago with a very well known Namibian outfitter. I'll leave his name out of this. I was hunting buffalo with one of his PHs, and he was personally guiding a fellow from Houston who was hunting elephant. A PG licensed PH was also tagging along chalking up one of the supervised big game hunts he needed for a DG license. In any case, they came upon a shootable bull escorted by a young askari. The PH pointed out the correct bull and the client fired a .416 ruger into its shoulder. At the shot both bulls bolted and the askari stumbled in the process. The PH assumed the client had shot the wrong bull and put two .500's into his backside as he ran off. 100 meters or so later two bulls were down. When I left camp, the PH was still trying to figure out how to get the small bull designated a PAC animal.

OUCH!

 

[Brent in Az]

Unless it's a life or death situation, or the PH has my permission, they better not "Double tap" my shot, or they can pay the trophy fee. Following up my shot ,with their own, a nano second after, is something that would really irk me.

No offense to the PH's.

 

[Velo Dog]

Unless it's a life or death situation, or the PH has my permission, they better not "Double tap" my shot, or they can pay the trophy fee. Following up my shot ,with their own, a nano second after, is something that would really irk me.

No offense to the PH's.

+1.