Which Calibre Should Be Consigned to the Grave

[sgt_zim]

Here's a short list of the ones whose demise would not cause me any distress. A lot of these choices are based on personal bias not technical merit:

1. Anything with the word "Weatherby" in it.

2. For some reason I can't explain, I seem to have an aversion to acronyms. So feel free to stop making ARC, PRC, RCM, RUM, SAUM, WSM & WSSM cartridges whenever you feel like it.

3. Let's just convert all of the Remington 280's and have the 280 Ackley Improved be the de facto choice. Do we really need both?

4. The 7mm Backcountry (unless of course we decide we really really need 80,000 psi proprietary cartridges in our lives).

5. I doubt I'll every own anything with the words "Nosler" or "Dakota" stamped on the barrel.

Every cartridge I shoot except one was designed before I was born. I'm nostalgically stuck shooting classic long-action cartridges from a century ago.

If we go by creation date rather than the date a cartridge got a SAAMI spec, then every rifle I own fires a cartridge developed before I was born, the newest of the lot being 280 AI, and Ackley first came out with that in the late 1950s.

As for all the "new" stuff...

Ecclesiastes 1:9
That which has been is what will be, That which is done is what will be done, And there is nothing new under the sun.

I fancied 10 or 12 years ago getting something pretty hot when I was into long range target shooting, but I found my off-the-rack Savage 10 "police sniper" with its 24" fluted barrel to be quite the shooter.

The 280AI and my 9.3x62 are the only loads I really lean into, and the latter only because it's easy and safe given all the extra freebore that's standard for those rifles.

Now to get my hands on a Spanish Mauser.

 

[DaddyFlip]

I wanted to remain a spectator in this thread, but I can hold back no longer.

Any cartridge designation containing the following should go to the grave:
Ackley
Federal
Legend
Marlin
Nosler
Roberts
Ruger
Savage
Waters
Whelen (apologies to @Bob Nelson 35Whelen)

Any cartridge that served as a military round, foreign or domestic, should be exempt from the grave. While I despise the 308 (7.62x51), I love the 30-40 Krag, so balance is achieved. (How can one NOT love the Krag? Rimmed bolt gun, lever gun, double gun, single shot: nestled between the greatest deer cartridge of all time (30-30) and the greatest cartridge of all time (30-06))

Weatherby was all the rage from inception to the end of the last millennium. Maybe its time has passed, but there's something special about the Weatherby line that made it the benchmark to which all others were compared. The classics are 257, 7mm, 300, and the outrageous 340. The larger calibers are persona non grata these days, but the 460 still gets mentioned from time to time, having earned it's legendary status. Exempt from the grave.

The 6.5 market is saturated. Keep one or two then all others to the grave.

I agree with @odonata that the abbreviation gang should go to the grave. These cartridges were conceived to create a new thing to keep certain companies afloat without actually improving on a previous design. Most are overbore which might be okay for static bench targets but not for field use. Supermodels are tall and slender, like my beloved 300 H&H. They are not short and fat, like whatever new age cart you want to promote.

 

[odonata]

I wanted to remain a spectator in this thread, but I can hold back no longer.

As a newer member, thanks for weighing in. The more opinions, the merrier! Especially if we can throw rocks at them.

Any cartridge designation containing the following should go to the grave:
...
Roberts
...
Whelen (apologies to @Bob Nelson 35Whelen)

Hmm...Those are fighting words! Never disparage a beloved classic.

...I love the 30-40 Krag, so balance is achieved. (How can one NOT love the Krag? Rimmed bolt gun, lever gun, double gun, single shot: nestled between the greatest deer cartridge of all time (30-30) and the greatest cartridge of all time (30-06))

I have an outsized affection for the similar 303 British ever since I shot my first deer with one. I have a pair of single-shot falling blocks & love both of them. As a southpaw shooter, I have three 30-06's since that's one of the most ubiquitous cartridges available to shooters with my particular affliction. I'm a big fan of its boring dependability. My earlier rage is starting to subside...

Supermodels are tall and slender, like my beloved 300 H&H. They are not short and fat, like whatever new age cart you want to promote.

My 9.3x74r is the sexiest cartridge I shoot. Taller than anything either of my 375 H&H rifles shoot & it has a rim. Maybe you're okay after all.

 

[Elkeater]

Could just seat the heavier bullets deeper in the case. Yes I know it cuts into powder space.
But the shorter case cuts powder space to.

Yes you can. Or you can have your magazine opened up and replaced with a Wyatt’s extended box making it possible to fit short action cartridges with COAL of up to 3.000” into a short action rifle without single feeding. You can also just seat your bullets beyond SAAMI spec and single feed them.

The .260 or better yet its Ackley improved version will obviously outrun the creedmoor if you seat the bullets long to maximize powder space. But here’s the advantage to the creedmoor (which I own for my daughter to use as her all around gun for everything from coyotes to elk within reasonable ranges). It fits the long slippery 6.5 bullets while allowing feeding from a magazine, while also not wasting powder space and sipping on powder. It’s an efficient and effective cartridge used within its limitations.

 

[Hogpatrol]

ROI on manufacturing a lot of brass is going to get so low as to eliminate it's production. In that category, I suspect most belted cartridges and European metrics will be replaced by more modern cartridges.

 

[odonata]

...I suspect most belted cartridges and European metrics will be replaced by more modern cartridges.

I'm going to sacrifice a small animal to the ammo gods to make sure that never happens!

 

[EarlsSon]

Following on from another estemed member who wishes,with my full support, to resurrect I am thinking the alternative

Which deserve to die

I would start with 6.5 Creedmoor

I woudl further mention 270 win nothing a 7x57 or 7x64 did not acheive in spades

I know, but as pitchforks are banned in Iceland and indeed flaming torches will stop us reaching our carbon whatever - I feel I am safe here

Any caliber that you deem unnecessary based on your omni importance

 

[Josh P]

ROI on manufacturing a lot of brass is going to get so low as to eliminate it's production. In that category, I suspect most belted cartridges and European metrics will be replaced by more modern cartridges.

Automated benchtop milling machines will be a thing in the future, I hope. Look at how far 3D printers have come for the consumer market. I hope the same happens for CNC technology.

 

[Flewis]

Don’t listen and just keep buying, that’s what I do.

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

I'm going to sacrifice a small animal to the ammo gods to make sure that never happens!

It’s deer season so go ahead and sacrifice a large one too.

 

[375er]

.25-06 and Nosler Ballistic Tips. I spent two days chasing deer and pigs wounded by this combo when helping a hunter in a group hunt. I finally gave him my .308 with Barnes. He dropped every animal from there on. The very next week he bought a .308 and has done well ever since.

Anytime a hunter showed up with a nice shiny new Weatherby rifle, the ranch owner would turn and whisper to call the man with tracking dogs and have him on standby.

The ranch owner also imposed a requirement of a .270 Win as a minimum and that reduced problems a lot. In reality, hunters with .270, .308, 7-08, and .30-06 seem to deliver more consistent results than all others.

I cannot disagree more. The problem is with using wrong bullets for the task. I have been shooting the .25-06 for more than 45 years and everything I have taken with has dropped like a hot rock. People just choose the wrong projectiles!

 

[Doug Hamilton]

I cannot disagree more. The problem is with using wrong bullets for the task. I have been shooting the .25-06 for more than 45 years and everything I have taken with has dropped like a hot rock. People just choose the wrong projectiles!

Right! Ballistic Tips are great Coyotes bullets, but are not designed for deer at .25-06 velocity. Nosler does make great big game bullets. I have used Partitions and AccuBonds to good effect. Varmint or match bullets (Ballistic Tips) are a poor choice for deer sized animals.

 

[matt85]

The 400 H&H may be redundant but I still want one.

If being redundant was the cartridges only crime, then I wouldn't hate it so much. Its second crime is using the long dead .411" bullet diameter. There are very few bullets made in this diameter and all of them are designed for use in lower velocity cartridges. This means even when you find a .411" bullet, it will likely not perform as well as it should due to the velocity of the cartridge.

You buy a 400 H&H rifle just collect all H&H products. It offers no value in the field and no collectors value outside of being made by H&H. If your ever able to find someone willing to buy it from you, it will sell for a tiny fraction of what you paid for it.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Following on from another estemed member who wishes,with my full support, to resurrect I am thinking the alternative

Which deserve to die

I would start with 6.5 Creedmoor

I woudl further mention 270 win nothing a 7x57 or 7x64 did not acheive in spades

I know, but as pitchforks are banned in Iceland and indeed flaming torches will stop us reaching our carbon whatever - I feel I am safe here

.30 Carbine, .222 Rem, neither one was good for much that isn't a better fit by other calibers.

 

[Flbt]

.30 Carbine, .222 Rem, neither one was good for much that isn't a better fit by other calibers.

I would agree out of a rifle.
But the 30 carbine can become interesting as a handgun round. It’s kinda interesting.
I was also told by a older gentleman that loaded down in a single shot it make a good rabbit and rook type rifle. But I don’t know about that.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

I would agree out of a rifle.
But the 30 carbine can become interesting as a handgun round. It’s kinda interesting.
I was also told by a older gentleman that loaded down in a single shot it make a good rabbit and rook type rifle. But I don’t know about that.

Sure, but there are other rounds that fit the riles better.

 

[tarbe]

I have a simple litmus test (which I admit I violated on my one and only Cape Buffalo):

"Never hunt with a cartridge younger than yourself".

So for me, 1957 or older.

 

[wildwilderness]

.30 Carbine, .222 Rem, neither one was good for much that isn't a better fit by other calibers.

Not so! The .222 is really good for one thing it sounds really cool when you say “Triple Deuce”! I want one just for that

 

[PCC600]

LMAO I am a FFL in Iceland everyone bought them - I decided not to stock as ammo would be the problem - it was but on ballistics, nothing the 6.5x55 cannot achieve - So kids crying they cannot get ammo

Then I go to Africa as I do and foreign hunters there ....it is a death ray - meanwhile I am helping out on sorting the wounded etc !

Everytime a new calibre comes out - I get the bible out - and see it has been done before or pretty close to being done

Before the Great War - DG calibres sorted

Before WW2 plainsgame was sorted - only 17 HMR has made a difference - as can in the UK or Europe take a hare or a rabbit @ 100+ and a fox @ 50 with the same gun !

6.5x55 is a brilliant cartridge as is 6.5x54 .

 

[PCC600]

Ohh and as I have been poked in a private message to reveal my calibres

basically 303 318 404 505 I may have a relationship with a 7x64 but lets not discuss that - bloody Europeans !

Not fired the 505 in anger but the rest work !

Stephen

Sounds pretty much like what I shoot . Drop the 404 and add a 425WR and add a 500NE for when I am tired of shooting the 505 . All much older than me in rifles older than me and all great killers .